JoeW

I was just reading the '97 Car&Driver review and it was describing the RS America version of the Ruf conversion:

"The little secret is that this stuff is fitted to an RS America, which is 70 pounds lighter than that year’s 911. The RS America punches a smaller hole through the air, with a frontal area of 18.9 square feet, versus the 20.0 square feet of the ‘94 911."

Now the weight part I'd heard about of course, but I'd never heard about a change in the frontal area. Anyone know anything about this? J

andrew964

arent the 94 cars turbo bodied? (could be wrong but it would explain the difference in frontal area)

JasonAndreas

I too had heard about this and then one day when I needed to replace my front bumper cover I went over the part numbers with the insurance guy and the dealer and we couldn't find any difference in part #'s for the C2 & RSA. The RSA's with the smaller frontal area are probably the same RSA's that had seam welded bodies.

Adrian

Dear Joe,
Are we talking a comparison between a RCT (370 hp) which was once a RS America and a 94 model year 993?
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

PS: The RCT Evo is relatively new and is the 425 hp beastie.

JoeW

Hi Adrian,

I'm sure you're right on part of it. I had been reading about the RCT Evo on the Ruf site, then read the review posted there from '97 which, as you point out, was for the 370hp RCT. (Thanks.)

The RCT tested was an RSA from the factory and the frontal difference vs. any other non-Turbo look 964 didn't make sense to me unless I'd missed some design change that had gone into the RSA.... but your instinct is probably correct, that the writer was comparing the car to the then-production 993 frontal area. A very compelling car in any case and about $40000 in upgrades to pull off in the '97 version! Do you have any idea what the RCT Evo package costs? J

Adrian

Dear Joe,
Just the engine upgrade is around $US23,000. The whole package here is circa 40,000 Euros. This includes engine, transmission (made in 6-speed), brakes, suspension, interior (everything) and rear spoiler.
If you want the widebody conversion the cost is higher. Personally I prefer the narrow body version, it fits down my driveway better.
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

emilios

Dear Adrian,

what would the cost be / is it cheaper in turning a turbo 3,6 into an RCT EVO? - I presume cheaper than a normally aspirated 964?

It is one possibility I am would be intersted into - also do you know the approximate time scale it takes for such a venture?

Best regards

Emilios

NotTwinTurboYet

Hi Adrian, I'm new on this forum, and I live in Switzerland (Fribourg). This post just to tell you that my mechanic made a proposal to me for the engine upgrade to a 3,6L twin turbo including the 6 speed gearbox. Price was about 35000FCH (installation not included). This is clearly too expensive for the price of the car (especially when considering all that need to be changed) but not as much as I would though.
NTTY
964C4 (1989)

Adrian

Dear NTTY,
Yes I agree with the type of conversion you are looking at. However converting your car into a RUF-Porsche does help retain some value. If you also look at the cost of conversion against getting another 425 hp Porsche model the price of the RCT Evo starts to look VERY attractive.

Dear Emilios,
If you take RUF a Turbo 3.6 you will not get a RCT you will get something else. It used to be the BTR 3.8. Which is a 3.8 conversion and then you can get the rest of the RUF trimmings. The time frame depends upon when you book it in (time of year). If you are interested tell em what you want (via email) and I will ask for you. I know Alois Ruf wil be interested in doing something special for you because he LOVES to play with 964 Turbo 3.6s.
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

NotTwinTurboYet

Thanks Adrian, do you think we can get the authorization to drive this car on road in Switzerland?
Retaining the value of such a modification is something I thought impossible, but if you tell me that's possible, I start to be interested... but we're seapking about more than twice the price of the car, my wife would kill me for just speaking about it
Florent

Adrian

Dear Florent,
RUF cars are already cerified in Switzerland. Their agent is Elite Sportwagen in Sirnach SG.
As long as you have the TÜV documents you should have no problems. However as you already know each Kanton applies its own laws so nothing is 100%. I know in my own Kanton how and what to provide (learned the hard way) to get approvals. One word of warning though, if you exceed Porsche specifications then most Kantons require an independent engineering check. An example, if you lower your Porsche past the lowest point Porsche ever offered a road car then you will have troubles.
RCT Evos are selling in Germany (when they come on the market) for around 50,000 Euros. I know a Targa was sold for this recently. However this conversion is for fun, it is not a financial investment.
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

NotTwinTurboYet

Hello Adrian, sorry to come back with that old post, but I'm really considering that RUF modification, and I have some concerns. Especially, my car is a 1989 C4, and I would really like to keep the 4WD. You told that RUF is modifying the gearbox to a 6 speeds one. Does it retain the PDAS? I ask you that because there are some guys offering 6 speeds transmition, but it requires to remove the 4WD, but I'm not happy about that especially because PDAS and ABS are linked. If RUF can keep the PDAS, it means that they just add a 6th speed to the original transmition. How is this possible? I guess that 964 and 993 transmition are close to be the same, and it's may be possible to modify the G64 transmition to become a 6 speeds, using parts coming from a 993 gearbox (but it may requires some hard work... )
Anorher question is about the engine and again the PDAS. Is the PDAS connected to the engine management system? I mean, is it possible to put another engine in a C4 and keep the PDAS, or does the ECU need to communicate with the PADS to receive or send informations?

Florent

David K.

Here's my experience with narrow vs. wide body cars:

My narrow body RS America ( http://www.rsamerica.net/gallery/davidk_of_nj.htm ) was fast thru the high speed stuff at "The Glen" last summer then Steve's wide body car ( http://instant-g.com/Cars/Teala/index.html ).

Steve was running a 964 motor in the same configuration as my 964 motor. I Said to Dr. Steve why is my car faster then your lighter car. My Car weights 2690 lbs and his weights in at ~2450 LBS. What the Dr. told me was over a certain speed aerodynamics is a bigger factor then weight.

Your result may vary......

Adrian

Dear Florent,
The RUF six-speed conversion retains the traction control.
No the PDAS has nothing to do with the Engine management system. It is part of the transmission.
If you install a 993 6-speed transmission you cannot retain PDAS or ABS unless you pay for the C2 system to be installed.
I have yet to find anyone who has successfully bypassed the PDAS system but been able to retain ABS. This is something I have been looking into but have not found an effective and easy way yet.
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

NotTwinTurboYet

Thanks for your answers Adrian! Good news for me, because I really want to keep the PDAS. I don't think I need a 6 speeds Gearbox, and if I'm sure that the original Gearbox is able to resist to a big modification of the engine, I'm not so sure about the 4WD differentials...
Florent