cruise98

Ski:

I hope the news is good as well. This is too much work for an experimental daily driver.

I bought the line from them "we will strip the rest of the steel for you, no problem". Wish I had done it myself! The dowels for the head were not the problem, but those split dowels are a royal pain! They did not remove them, and what was left disintegrated and left fragments in the block. I almost drove to Wisconsin to have a "discussion" with them over that one.

I sent it to the Wisconsin plant. I chose the 964 rings because they were designed for Nikasil bores in the 911 engine. An engineer with JE recommended that to me. I was concerned with the hard chrome face of the stock turbo ring seating, so I went around the block a few times before deciding to use the 964 part.

I would love to put a scope in there to see what is going on. When I was putting the engine together, I put each ring in the bore and measured the gap. It was dry, and the rings were very difficult to slide in the bores, but once you put some oil in the bores, they are slick as glass. Good oil retention for sure.

During the initial start-up I was sent some bad chips from APE and had some detonation at relatively low boost. I may have to change the head gasket because of that, so that will be an opportunity to check them out. I am loosing coolant, but I cannot find a leak and the leak down test last night did not reveal the cause. No smoke either. The project never ends.

Dino oil, SAE 30, for the first 250 miles, and changed it last night to more dead dinos until 1000 miles. Then it is on to Mobil 1 and hopefully a long life.

DanaT

Ski,

I am confused about how much you want to build-up the thickness on the cylinder bore. I think you want about .002mm.

If that is the case, then you are looking at about 80 microinches. That is actually quite a lot of thickness for plating. Not unreasonable, but not a minor plate either.

I am skeptical of trying to build-up thickness with plating. That said, building thickness is done quite often. When this is done, stress in the plated layer becomes very critical. Most electroless nickel processes are not low stress plating layers.

What I can say about plating is that it is alot of black magic that goes into it and no plater will ever tell you the complete truth about their processes. For example, ask them if they use an Electroless (EN) or Electrolytic nickel process and if EN what the phosphorous content is. They may tell you the first, but most likely not the second.

Hope this sheds some light.

-Dana

Alan C.

I saw a set of 911 turbo cylinders recently which had been bored and replated. The plating came off in 4 of the 6 cylinders. What was interesting was that the plating also came off at the bottom of the cylinder where the piston skirt never touched. You could see what looked like bubbles under the plating.

Alan C.

m42racer

Yeap! been there done that. I had my block done and it came off on the dyno tuning. The process is flawed with faults and the results are often connected with major engine damage. I choose to go the liner way. If done correctly, this repair is very common in many other engines that use aluminium blocks with Iron Liners. The smart customers choose who does the work. Then you can rely on many hours of problem free running and repair without replacing the Liner.

Duke

Can anyone give some sort of price indication at all regarding sleeving?

superjet.1

Call Neil at performance developments he can do all you need and more 1-949-646-7461.

dand86951

Liners are about $50 ea. from Darton and a set of JE pistons is about $650 depending on who you buy from. Then you need the machining and that is where the big variable comes in as it depends on where you are and how familiar the shop is for our blocks. My guess is in the states you would pay around $800 for the block machine work.

alengyel

KS in England, I think thats where they are, makes a sleeve of Alusil. They are designed to be inserted in a bored out cylinder to bring the finish back to original factory specs. It should be the same KS that made the pistons for the 951, I'm not sure when they went to Mahle. Ill try to find the web address.

alengyel

here is the KS tech sheet on the installation of liners.


http://www.msi-motor-service.com/dow...ren/alu_en.pdf

and here is the site.


http://www.msi-motor-service.com/ks/...chueren_en.asp

alengyel

Oh, and the sleeve comes honed and lapped. all the machine shop has to do is punch out the block and install the sleeve. If you manage to get a price or a sourse, this shouldnt be to hard as they now have a plant in the us, post it cause i might need them as well.

m42racer

Liners at $ 50.00 each. What, is Walmart in the Liner business? I think you need to recheck your prices. There is no such thing as a $ 50.00 Liner.

cruise98

I checked with them and they told me the 944 liners were no longer available. The liners are for the 100.50 mm piston.

Alan C.

I believe Chris White at 944enhancement.com can do a block with sleeves for around $26-2800. That includes the machining, sleeves, JE pistons with pins and rings.

Craig Friesinger had this done to his engine by Chris and he has had no problems. Looked at the bores after 2 races and the bores looked brand new. Craig's engine, from Farler Performance, puts 400 to the rear. A really nice GT3S 944 turbo.

Alan C.

dand86951

Well, then I guess those funny cylindrical things made out of iron in my engine are a figment of my imagination, and of Darton's imagination. I do have to admit I didn't get them for $50.00 each. They were actually on special for less and I apologize for misleading you about the high cost. I have my invoice to substantiate what I said. What they are charging for them now I don't know, but I do know what I paid for Darton liners and if they are good enough for Bob Norwood, they are going to be plenty good enough for me.

Sam Lin

Liners certainly aren't hugely expensive, $50 is right - it's the labor that goes into installing them that runs up the bill.

Sam