mclarenno9

I think the jury is still out with regards to the Shorai batteries, especially in cars.

And don't waste your money on any Braille battery (unless its lithium-ion), as they are simply rebadged Deka units (with the post adapters). There are only a handful of true battery manufacturers in the US (I think 3). The Deka batteres are among the best, however. This ETX14 is the same as the Braille that Rob posted:

http://www.batterymart.com/p-Big-Cra...4-Battery.html

For a V8 you may need something slightly bigger, even more so depending on where it's mounted. I have an ETX30L as I drive mine on the street and in colder conditions.

TonyG

FYI.... I ran my last red LS6 951 on a tiny Odyssey PC535 battery for the last 6 years.

I would have to replace the battery every 3 years.

But it started the V8 fine.

The Shorai is less than 1/2 the weight and is more powerful.

The only real question is about the alternator LSx alternator voltage output. I've not been able to find anything definitive on the net.

I'm probably going to add some resistance to the alternator input circuit to trick it to bump up the output voltage slightly.

TonyG

mclarenno9

If you believe the made-up "equivalent" calculated values that Shorai publishes, then fine. Here's a simple load test of a couple similarly sized (i.e. marketed) batteries:
Go to 3:40 for the Shorai tests.

TonyG

Update:

I saw the test. I don't understand why the battery the test performed so poorly.

As of this last race weekend, we have 4 911 GT3/Cup race cars running this batter that have now completed 6-9 practice/qual/race days each. Happy to say, no problems and in fact perform far better than the Odyssey batteries they replaced in terms of cranking speed and the ability to leave the car powered up (engine not running) for extended periods with almost no voltage drop (which had been a big problem for the Odyssey batteries.

Either the battery in the test in the video was not fully charged, or it was defective (bad cell).



TonyG

Supachink

I've never had first hand experience with a Shorai, but most of the motorcycle riders i know that have tried them have bad times with them, complaining of extended crank times, not being able to start the bike for 5 minutes, etc. . . many of them have gone with this building an A123 celled battery. The cells can usually be found by breaking down a dewalt 18V battery pack. . . Found this thread that could be some interest to some of you:

http://www.r1-forum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=268406

odb812

This is simply not true. Braille uses FRP and carbon cases on their batteries, that's what you're paying for. Yes, the rest of the battery is the same, but you will never find a Deka that puts out the same CCA and weighs the same as the equivalent Braille. You're linking a battery with 220 CCA in comparison to the braille above with 360 CCA, and the Deka weighs 5lbs more.

I passed on a EXT14 for my Honda because I know people who put that battery in the same car and constantly have starting problems(imagine how well it will work in a 25 y/o Porsche). When I looked for a Deka with the CCA I needed, it was only a few lbs weight savings over factory in a battery with a different shape than factory--not worth it IMO. I ended up with a Braille B2015C.

TonyG

All I'm saying is that the "large" Shorai battery is starting very high compression GT3 4.0 liter race engines with ease.

These guys spend a small fortune on the car and to race and would never use a batter that wouldn't do the job. We're talking about $130k-$200k race cars. Money is no object on these cars. Nobody would risk a race on a battery that didn't work.

I don't know about my V8 (yet), but without doubt it works perfectly in the 911's.

TonyG

mclarenno9

For the AGM batteries that Braille markets, I see two versions, a standard version and a carbon fiber one. Funny enough, both weigh exactly the same. And to my eye, looking at the pictures, it seems to me they may just wrap the standard plastic casing in CF as it looks slightly bigger in the pictures. I don't know what you would be paying for other than the look?

I'm seeing the ETX14 (Deka) quoted at 11.5-12 lbs. That is the exact same weight as the Braille that Rob posted about and I was comparing it to (B14115). The Braille-stated CCA of 360 is not directly comparable to the number given for the Deka (220). Here's why, straight from their website:

"Braille Battery’s are tested using conductance testing which is an approximation of BCI testing. The BCI rating is the number of amps a new, fully charged battery can deliver at 0° Farenheit for 30 seconds, while maintaining a voltage of at least 7.2 volts, for a 12 volt battery using a draw down test. Since this type of testing can shorten the life of a battery, Braille’s batteries are individually tested prior to shipping using the conductance method. This method is much faster and less destructive to batteries.
-NOTE: All cranking performance ratings are based on calculations of data collected from conductance testing."

"At this time all of Braille’s ratings are determined by using a conductance tester and not the draw down method used by the BCI.

Here's some interesting reading:http://www.braillebattery.com/index....ille/pages/faq

It's pretty simple. For this type of battery (AGM or SLA), there is a strong correlation in capacity and CA versus weight. Since the cases are the same, and the quoted weights are the same, its safe to say they will perform about the same. I stand by my previous statement... The only difference is the stickers, the post adapters ($15) and the price tag.

Good to hear some positive results using those batteries Tony. Have they tried to alter the charging voltage at all?

It will be interesting to see how these hold up long term.

thingo

I have a Deka ETX14 on my 951, it is mainly a track car and when I park it in the garage I put the trickle charger on, but it turns the car over fine. It is a considerable weight saving.

gamman

Cca don't count. You yanks need tests at 75'f. And really only a/hr should count. Also we have found the discharge rates of the same batteries at link above to make a difference on our product. Our 2.slow golf barely requires 20a/hr. $55 and almost same specs as oddessey's.

Edit, what I am saying is that the same sized battery from them, an agm, with a 20a/hr discharge can give different results. Go with one that is not meant for hybrid go carts. They try to conserve the current in a steady flow. You want the massive discharge in the shortest time.

gamman

- Make: Powersonic

- Model: PS-12180NB


These $59 batteries new almost perform better for us than an oddessey. Same results lets say, but $100 more. You decide.

sm

Do you have any pictures of how this is mounted in your car? Did you have to do any custom mounting? Thanks for the info.

TonyG

FYI.... we have 10 911 GT3/Cup race cars using the Shorai battery for about a year.

It's amazing. Zero failures. FAR better than anything else we've tried.

TonyG

mclarenno9

I wanted a "reversible" mounting solution in case I ever needed to revert to the stock setup. So...I fabbed up an aluminum tray which is held in place similar to a standard battery. Once bolted down, the Deka drops in and is secured using a small piece of channel and two threaded rods. I chose to leave the angle pieces at the rear of the tray bolted rather than welded to accommodate different length (height) batteries. It works well and holds the battery very securely.

CyCloNe!

I prefer hamsters, the key is to select ones with rabies they run faster to catch their prey also the foaming action reduces corrosion build up