Guru 364 - soon?
02-12-2003 | 03:11 PM
#16
Race Director
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 10,862
Likes: 34
From: Indianapolis, IN
G96: "No NEED for a reply Tim, that's enough hijacking from you for one day"
Does your attitude ever stop?
Jeez man! All he did was come into this thread to see what you were blabbing about -then politely said his kit isnt finished and that its expensive, and lastly that he didnt want to hijack the Guru thread anymore. Whats so wrong with that??
To come around and compare Lindseys kit to SFR's is apples and oranges. They are going after a completely different market I bet -hence the different parts and price involved.
Does your attitude ever stop?
Jeez man! All he did was come into this thread to see what you were blabbing about -then politely said his kit isnt finished and that its expensive, and lastly that he didnt want to hijack the Guru thread anymore. Whats so wrong with that??
To come around and compare Lindseys kit to SFR's is apples and oranges. They are going after a completely different market I bet -hence the different parts and price involved.
02-12-2003 | 04:35 PM
#18
Racer
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 313
Likes: 0
From: Victoria, BC, Canada
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by DangerIsland:
One thing that's always bothered me about the Lindsey kit is that they don't include the cam (or test pipe) that you need to make that number (363) in the kit. If you're going to sell a "kit" that has a number associated with it, I think you should include everything it takes to get there.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">I agree with you on this one! I think it's a load of barnyard droppings that they don't give you everything that their '364 kit' needs to get 364 rwhp. Isn't that basically false advertising?? No big deal though, all you have to do is read the fine print.
I don't think we can come to any conclusions about anybody's kit until we've got a few testimonails as to how they perform. To this point, not many of us have 'kits' but rather a mix-match combo of parts to get the big HP & torque numbers. This of course goes for value, performance (advertiused vs. reality, even with a 190K mile car) and of course reliability/driveability.
<img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" />
One thing that's always bothered me about the Lindsey kit is that they don't include the cam (or test pipe) that you need to make that number (363) in the kit. If you're going to sell a "kit" that has a number associated with it, I think you should include everything it takes to get there.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">I agree with you on this one! I think it's a load of barnyard droppings that they don't give you everything that their '364 kit' needs to get 364 rwhp. Isn't that basically false advertising?? No big deal though, all you have to do is read the fine print.
I don't think we can come to any conclusions about anybody's kit until we've got a few testimonails as to how they perform. To this point, not many of us have 'kits' but rather a mix-match combo of parts to get the big HP & torque numbers. This of course goes for value, performance (advertiused vs. reality, even with a 190K mile car) and of course reliability/driveability.
<img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" />
02-13-2003 | 12:48 AM
#20
Race Director
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 14,075
Likes: 3
From: Santa Barbara, CA
Ski, what's been your experience with the Kokeln-363 kit? With and without the cam?
You still have the cam? I'd like to compare it to a 'street' cam upgrade we've developed. Unlike the WebCam or Milledge grinds which can really only be considerd 'race' cams since their sweet-spot is 6000-8000rpm... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="frown.gif" />
You still have the cam? I'd like to compare it to a 'street' cam upgrade we've developed. Unlike the WebCam or Milledge grinds which can really only be considerd 'race' cams since their sweet-spot is 6000-8000rpm... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="frown.gif" />
02-13-2003 | 09:32 AM
#21
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 7,897
Likes: 2
From: Heber Springs, AR
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by Danno:
<strong>Ski, what's been your experience with the Kokeln-363 kit? With and without the cam?
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Danno the cam is gone,,my bottom end was terrible. Maybe it was due to the head upgrade,,I have no idea. But we measured the lobes over stock and when we put it in, you know where I take my car for major work, his eyes were skeptical. Just my experience however if you have MAP or MAF with fuel controller I'm sure you could dail it in.
The kit,,well I bought the pcs before it was a kit. I was not happy with the software, Kokelns, you know that but the other pcs I'm pretty happy with. I wish I had access to a dynojet close but I don't. I last turned 282 with 290 respectively, if you add 40hp to that(dynojet) then it's close without the cam - 20-25hp? The above run, we tapped into a vacuum line and it was 16.6 psi, or that is what the machine read. My boost guage said 17. Your Guru software BTW.
Hey, get any ballast resistors yet?
<strong>Ski, what's been your experience with the Kokeln-363 kit? With and without the cam?
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Danno the cam is gone,,my bottom end was terrible. Maybe it was due to the head upgrade,,I have no idea. But we measured the lobes over stock and when we put it in, you know where I take my car for major work, his eyes were skeptical. Just my experience however if you have MAP or MAF with fuel controller I'm sure you could dail it in.
The kit,,well I bought the pcs before it was a kit. I was not happy with the software, Kokelns, you know that but the other pcs I'm pretty happy with. I wish I had access to a dynojet close but I don't. I last turned 282 with 290 respectively, if you add 40hp to that(dynojet) then it's close without the cam - 20-25hp? The above run, we tapped into a vacuum line and it was 16.6 psi, or that is what the machine read. My boost guage said 17. Your Guru software BTW.
Hey, get any ballast resistors yet?
02-13-2003 | 11:44 AM
#22
Banned
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,635
Likes: 0
From: San Diego
quote:
Originally posted by TurboTim:
I wont reveal any numbers but lets just say it surpasses the Lindsey 363
package by a good margin.
Did you fall way short of your goal or what? Why keep quiet? If a good margin is 9 horsepower with
many, MANY more thousands spent, you're correct.
Why keep quiet? Here are a couple of reasons. The car does not have our entire package for starters. I refuse to post step by step updates like I did on the 968.net because I refuse to have our parts and our approach to making power criticized and questioned by guys like you. Unfortunately, not everyone is like you but the few people that have your same attitude tend to ruin it for everyone else. So when our kit is finished being developed, I will forward you a copy of the dyno chart.
Here's a snip from Lindsey's site:
"The package makes 363* RWHP and retails for $3639.00"
And I think this is yours:
"This car made 372+HP...Over $25,000 has been invested within the last 12 months (not including
the price of the car)."
There you go again, making blanket statements. The word "think" is a dead giveaway that your really have no clue as to what has been invested in this car. It also makes me wonder how much of the money spent on having the car re-painted, having the interior recovered in leather, rims and tires, maintenance, etc...... is included in the $25,000 figure you came up with? For future reference, you should try to back up your claims and statements with facts.
Looks like Lindsey has superior value by a factor of three or four [dollar-wise,
I would love to see just one dyno chart, from just one custome,r who bought the kit and made the claimed horsepower. I have talked to quite a few people who have this kit and they are making nowhere near 364hp. Some of them have the optional cam, they also have the testpipe and a few other extras. So I guess your superior value theory has been blown right out the door. If you care to continue this, then please back up your statements with proof.
Finally Trevor........you have Speed Force Racing parts all over your car. I know you probably will not admit it but we all know the truth;^) Without these specific parts you would not have a turbocharged 968! Ha Ha. So whats with your attitude towards me?
Originally posted by TurboTim:
I wont reveal any numbers but lets just say it surpasses the Lindsey 363
package by a good margin.
Did you fall way short of your goal or what? Why keep quiet? If a good margin is 9 horsepower with
many, MANY more thousands spent, you're correct.
Why keep quiet? Here are a couple of reasons. The car does not have our entire package for starters. I refuse to post step by step updates like I did on the 968.net because I refuse to have our parts and our approach to making power criticized and questioned by guys like you. Unfortunately, not everyone is like you but the few people that have your same attitude tend to ruin it for everyone else. So when our kit is finished being developed, I will forward you a copy of the dyno chart.
Here's a snip from Lindsey's site:
"The package makes 363* RWHP and retails for $3639.00"
And I think this is yours:
"This car made 372+HP...Over $25,000 has been invested within the last 12 months (not including
the price of the car)."
There you go again, making blanket statements. The word "think" is a dead giveaway that your really have no clue as to what has been invested in this car. It also makes me wonder how much of the money spent on having the car re-painted, having the interior recovered in leather, rims and tires, maintenance, etc...... is included in the $25,000 figure you came up with? For future reference, you should try to back up your claims and statements with facts.
Looks like Lindsey has superior value by a factor of three or four [dollar-wise,
I would love to see just one dyno chart, from just one custome,r who bought the kit and made the claimed horsepower. I have talked to quite a few people who have this kit and they are making nowhere near 364hp. Some of them have the optional cam, they also have the testpipe and a few other extras. So I guess your superior value theory has been blown right out the door. If you care to continue this, then please back up your statements with proof.
Finally Trevor........you have Speed Force Racing parts all over your car. I know you probably will not admit it but we all know the truth;^) Without these specific parts you would not have a turbocharged 968! Ha Ha. So whats with your attitude towards me?
02-13-2003 | 02:02 PM
#23
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,084
Likes: 0
From: San Diego
With all of these HP packages being offered up, I would like to offer the JOHN ANDERSON 371PACKAGE 
This is not your average "BOLT ON KIT", infact, you need to be QUALIFIED, very QUALIFIED to even attempt at strapping this "asphalt eating horse power generating package" to your Porsche. No Sir, infact, its such a complex system that I feel its only fair to lay it out in detail BEFORE you start cracking your check books.
Check list (you will not even be considered unless ALL of these points are met by your car):
1-Car MUST have 230,000 HARD miles on the OD.
2-Car MUST have at least THREE major oil leaks, or one to two leaks that would allow at least one quart of oil to hit the dyno floor between EACH run. If you have these leaks, or one qualifying leak, AND your motor can manage to produce HUGE plumes of smoke during the RUN, you will recieve a boost controller with the package.
3-car MUST have a STOCK clutch and assembly.
4-Car MUST utilize the stock rusty wastegate.
5-Car must NOT have a test pipe, instead it must be a punched out dented cracked/welded re welded stock unit.
6-Car MUST have stock headers that have had at least two attempts at repair by welding.
7-YOu MUST toss down at least one spark plug hole, a metal, conductive washer, that will allow for special, "lightning" effects during the run. (not into the head, but rather toss the washer down next to the plug).
8-Car MUST be running a stock fuel pump that you can in no way account for the time and mileage on the unit.
9-Car must be running 92 octane gas.
10-Car must be using the stock blow off valve, updated 993 part is ok.
Now if, and ONLY if you meet each of the above you qualify for our exclusive BOLT ON 371 POWER PACKAGE. The package contains the following and is available for 2700.00 US! <img border="0" alt="[burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" />
The PACKAGE:
1-3 year old stage three MAF kit
2-52lb lope inducing injectors.
3-7 year old electronic boost controller with no wire harness.
4-NON ballbearing, 60-1 garret turbo.
5-55 gallon drum of 50 weight motor oil.
6-Fire extinguisher.
7-Your very own small crowd of people that will laugh and squeal with delight at the sight of your car running 22psi boost and hitting 371 on the dyno while smoking from the motor, shooting black doughnuts from the exhaust and lubricating the shop floor with your motor oil.
8- ventilation fan to clear the smoke from the shop.
This is the same setup I used on my car (which infact did meet ALL the requirements listed above) when I hit 371 at the wheels at 6000rpm <img border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" title="" src="graemlins/bigok.gif" />
For more information, or real cool glossy brochures, feel free to call the shop <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" />
Edit: Actually, please don't call the shop, we don't actually sell the kit...it was just my car..I thought I would spoof on it a little...and that run was witnessed by Tim Richards, My partner, I believe Danno was there...but these are NOT the people that would be shipped in your onw little crowd package :-)
Take Care!
This is not your average "BOLT ON KIT", infact, you need to be QUALIFIED, very QUALIFIED to even attempt at strapping this "asphalt eating horse power generating package" to your Porsche. No Sir, infact, its such a complex system that I feel its only fair to lay it out in detail BEFORE you start cracking your check books.
Check list (you will not even be considered unless ALL of these points are met by your car):
1-Car MUST have 230,000 HARD miles on the OD.
2-Car MUST have at least THREE major oil leaks, or one to two leaks that would allow at least one quart of oil to hit the dyno floor between EACH run. If you have these leaks, or one qualifying leak, AND your motor can manage to produce HUGE plumes of smoke during the RUN, you will recieve a boost controller with the package.
3-car MUST have a STOCK clutch and assembly.
4-Car MUST utilize the stock rusty wastegate.
5-Car must NOT have a test pipe, instead it must be a punched out dented cracked/welded re welded stock unit.
6-Car MUST have stock headers that have had at least two attempts at repair by welding.
7-YOu MUST toss down at least one spark plug hole, a metal, conductive washer, that will allow for special, "lightning" effects during the run. (not into the head, but rather toss the washer down next to the plug).
8-Car MUST be running a stock fuel pump that you can in no way account for the time and mileage on the unit.
9-Car must be running 92 octane gas.
10-Car must be using the stock blow off valve, updated 993 part is ok.
Now if, and ONLY if you meet each of the above you qualify for our exclusive BOLT ON 371 POWER PACKAGE. The package contains the following and is available for 2700.00 US! <img border="0" alt="[burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" />
The PACKAGE:
1-3 year old stage three MAF kit
2-52lb lope inducing injectors.
3-7 year old electronic boost controller with no wire harness.
4-NON ballbearing, 60-1 garret turbo.
5-55 gallon drum of 50 weight motor oil.
6-Fire extinguisher.
7-Your very own small crowd of people that will laugh and squeal with delight at the sight of your car running 22psi boost and hitting 371 on the dyno while smoking from the motor, shooting black doughnuts from the exhaust and lubricating the shop floor with your motor oil.
8- ventilation fan to clear the smoke from the shop.
This is the same setup I used on my car (which infact did meet ALL the requirements listed above) when I hit 371 at the wheels at 6000rpm <img border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" title="" src="graemlins/bigok.gif" />
For more information, or real cool glossy brochures, feel free to call the shop <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" />
Edit: Actually, please don't call the shop, we don't actually sell the kit...it was just my car..I thought I would spoof on it a little...and that run was witnessed by Tim Richards, My partner, I believe Danno was there...but these are NOT the people that would be shipped in your onw little crowd package :-)
Take Care!
02-13-2003 | 02:30 PM
#24
Drive-by provocation guy
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 10,439
Likes: 0
From: NAS PAX River, by way of Orlando
You know what guys??? You are right. Why spend thousands of dollars putting a new suit on a street bum. I pride myself on doing things the smart way and hopefully the easy way. I think that way would be to sell my 17 year old oil leaking piece of crap and just buy a supra twin turbo. So I can stop being embarrased by 17 year olds in a cars that make ours look stupid. Even those in here that have monster cars, I am sure those ricers ( at least the ricers that spend money on the motor and not stickers) dollar for dollar would make almost any 951/952 on this board look foolish on track, 1/4 track, skid pad, 0 - 100- 0, lat g's etc, etc, etc.
p.s. these statements come from a long time Porsche owner and admirer.
p.s. these statements come from a long time Porsche owner and admirer.
02-13-2003 | 02:32 PM
#25
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 903
Likes: 0
From: Seattle, WA
ooOOoooo can I buy the Lope-A-Matic? 2 injector set seperately? That sounds like an excellent way to get some props from the big american V8 crowd. "Look, it idles like a Chevy! Show me some respect!"
If need be, I can punch some holes in the appropriate places to get to the oil leak limit.
If need be, I can punch some holes in the appropriate places to get to the oil leak limit.
02-13-2003 | 03:05 PM
#27
Race Car
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,784
Likes: 0
From: Long Island, NY
John, I don't understand, are you saying that our cars are garbage? What point are you trying to make with comments that just downgrade our cars? With that point in mind, it sounds like toddk has a good point there. Those supras are way stronger than our cars can ever be. But then again, I am a real porsche fan and I love my 951 not matter how trashy anyone thinks it is. I can't avoid the truth either, and the truth is those japanese cars are much more reliable.
02-13-2003 | 03:12 PM
#28
Race Car
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 4,089
Likes: 3
From: $F Bay Area
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by TurboTim:
<strong>Finally Trevor........you have Speed Force Racing parts all over your car. I know you probably will not admit it but we all know the truth;^) Without these specific parts you would not have a turbocharged 968! Ha Ha. So whats with your attitude towards me?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva"><img border="0" alt="[offtopic]" title="" src="graemlins/offtopic.gif" />
I have SFR parts listed on my P-CarOnline profile you dork! Everyone knows I have SFR fuel lines and an SFR chip. I won't admit that I also have SFR intake pipes on my Anderson conversion?
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid30/p9e5e7d275b81816761dcea9a50a183bf/fd51eb8d.jpg" alt=" - " />
Custom SFR rotated crossover pipe flanges on my Anderson conversion?
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid29/pbd7fab850d249ab289e60e42766323d2/fd61e682.jpg" alt=" - " />
Some THICK and GOOPY SFR weld pictured here on my Anderson conversion?
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid29/p8e82d177d27b7354130108517d5de303/fd61e68a.jpg" alt=" - " />
That John/SHAUN turned into THIS right here:
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid29/pa3827d8df01365bbb01fd944cef19581/fd61e685.jpg" alt=" - " />
and finally an SFR one-of-a-kind y-pipe to fit the 951 cat pipe to a 968 Borla muffler assembly on my Anderson conversion?
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid29/peefb7b5d573a6572392ed19b90adf716/fd61e64d.jpg" alt=" - " />
You make pretty stuff, Tim. But what I haven't told ANYONE [and I'll break the silence right now] is about the SFR sticker you gave me that I happily put on the back of my car and MELTED OFF in the first NorCal rain. I don't like your cheap stickers, that's all. Hence my attitude, I was heart-broken.
If you send me a water-proof sticker then we'll be buddies again. 
<strong>Finally Trevor........you have Speed Force Racing parts all over your car. I know you probably will not admit it but we all know the truth;^) Without these specific parts you would not have a turbocharged 968! Ha Ha. So whats with your attitude towards me?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva"><img border="0" alt="[offtopic]" title="" src="graemlins/offtopic.gif" />
I have SFR parts listed on my P-CarOnline profile you dork! Everyone knows I have SFR fuel lines and an SFR chip. I won't admit that I also have SFR intake pipes on my Anderson conversion?
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid30/p9e5e7d275b81816761dcea9a50a183bf/fd51eb8d.jpg" alt=" - " />
Custom SFR rotated crossover pipe flanges on my Anderson conversion?
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid29/pbd7fab850d249ab289e60e42766323d2/fd61e682.jpg" alt=" - " />
Some THICK and GOOPY SFR weld pictured here on my Anderson conversion?
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid29/p8e82d177d27b7354130108517d5de303/fd61e68a.jpg" alt=" - " />
That John/SHAUN turned into THIS right here:
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid29/pa3827d8df01365bbb01fd944cef19581/fd61e685.jpg" alt=" - " />
and finally an SFR one-of-a-kind y-pipe to fit the 951 cat pipe to a 968 Borla muffler assembly on my Anderson conversion?
<img src="http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid29/peefb7b5d573a6572392ed19b90adf716/fd61e64d.jpg" alt=" - " />
You make pretty stuff, Tim. But what I haven't told ANYONE [and I'll break the silence right now] is about the SFR sticker you gave me that I happily put on the back of my car and MELTED OFF in the first NorCal rain. I don't like your cheap stickers, that's all. Hence my attitude, I was heart-broken.
If you send me a water-proof sticker then we'll be buddies again.
02-13-2003 | 03:18 PM
#29
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,084
Likes: 0
From: San Diego
How do you read that into my post LOL, Lighten up..it was a spoof on the packages that are out there, thats all...how is saying my car made 371 at the tires in the condition I described it as, be a hammer to our cars??? If anything it shows how solid they are...after that dyno run, the car ran perfectly, even after such high boost...it was reliable and solid.
I was only showing that HP can be made, and it can be made reliably, and simply, without spending big freaking dollars...:-)
If I thought these cars were crap, why would I have two cars we race, three cars I drive, and a business based on these cars?
Please tell me what comment it was in my post that downgraded your car? Or our cars?
I'm glad we have Tim Richards and Danno out there with these packages...they are making products for you that will truely enhance the performance of your car, and its nice to see it done in the different ways they are approching it. Tims is at least from what I can see, and have seen...a setup that is more involved than Dannos kit...Danno is keeping it on the smaller side, whos is best...at this point we don't know.
But, please, take it easy...I was not bashing your car, it was humor, and fact, and it was my car...thats all :-)
Take Care!
I was only showing that HP can be made, and it can be made reliably, and simply, without spending big freaking dollars...:-)
If I thought these cars were crap, why would I have two cars we race, three cars I drive, and a business based on these cars?
Please tell me what comment it was in my post that downgraded your car? Or our cars?
I'm glad we have Tim Richards and Danno out there with these packages...they are making products for you that will truely enhance the performance of your car, and its nice to see it done in the different ways they are approching it. Tims is at least from what I can see, and have seen...a setup that is more involved than Dannos kit...Danno is keeping it on the smaller side, whos is best...at this point we don't know.
But, please, take it easy...I was not bashing your car, it was humor, and fact, and it was my car...thats all :-)
Take Care!
02-13-2003 | 03:22 PM
#30
Former Vendor
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 2,279
Likes: 110
From: fortistuning.fi
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by Silverbullet951:
<strong>John, I don't understand, are you saying that our cars are garbage? What point are you trying to make with comments that just downgrade our cars? With that point in mind, it sounds like toddk has a good point there. Those supras are way stronger than our cars can ever be. But then again, I am a real porsche fan and I love my 951 not matter how trashy anyone thinks it is. I can't avoid the truth either, and the truth is those japanese cars are much more reliable.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">I guess that the point John is trying to make here is that there's quite easy -but maybe not so long-lasting ways- to make noticeable amount of hp out of our tiny four-bangers...It's just how much money you're willing to pay,and what really you're going to get with that.
BTW,I've seen a dyno graph with almost 400hp (380-390) out of turbocharged and carburetted! 2-litre Pinto.
And yes,you can buy a new or quite new wok-pan,but will it still be around 10 years from now when 951 is just getting to be a classic??I bet Supras are just rusting quietly away in back-yards... <img border="0" alt="[bigbye]" title="" src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" />
Cheers,Pete
Oh crap,when I was typing this John made himself very clear...I'm so slow in typing,especially in English... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
<strong>John, I don't understand, are you saying that our cars are garbage? What point are you trying to make with comments that just downgrade our cars? With that point in mind, it sounds like toddk has a good point there. Those supras are way stronger than our cars can ever be. But then again, I am a real porsche fan and I love my 951 not matter how trashy anyone thinks it is. I can't avoid the truth either, and the truth is those japanese cars are much more reliable.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">I guess that the point John is trying to make here is that there's quite easy -but maybe not so long-lasting ways- to make noticeable amount of hp out of our tiny four-bangers...It's just how much money you're willing to pay,and what really you're going to get with that.
BTW,I've seen a dyno graph with almost 400hp (380-390) out of turbocharged and carburetted! 2-litre Pinto.
And yes,you can buy a new or quite new wok-pan,but will it still be around 10 years from now when 951 is just getting to be a classic??I bet Supras are just rusting quietly away in back-yards... <img border="0" alt="[bigbye]" title="" src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" />
Cheers,Pete
Oh crap,when I was typing this John made himself very clear...I'm so slow in typing,especially in English... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />