What is the best intercooler up-grade?
03-24-2011, 08:11 PM
#1
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What is the best intercooler up-grade?
There are the numerous stage up-grades from all the known vendors but I suspect that intercoolers from other cars may just be much better suited for a "best bang for buck" thinking.
What experiences do people have from changing IC's?
I find several aftermarket kits that are bigger and looks more effective at a very reasononable price - but no one have flow tests to show :-(
I can also find IC's from RX7/8's that also look good at better price - maybe down to the bigger customer base??
Please all chime in with knowledge you may have - and ïf documentation is available then please do enlighten us :-)
Cheers
Niels
What experiences do people have from changing IC's?
I find several aftermarket kits that are bigger and looks more effective at a very reasononable price - but no one have flow tests to show :-(
I can also find IC's from RX7/8's that also look good at better price - maybe down to the bigger customer base??
Please all chime in with knowledge you may have - and ïf documentation is available then please do enlighten us :-)
Cheers
Niels
03-24-2011, 10:26 PM
#2
Burning Brakes
I'm sure technology has changed over the years. I had a Lindsey Racing stage 2 in a previous 951 I had, but that was really the only mod except exhaust. There are more knowlegable than I am here, but I didn't notice a difference. I'm sure on a heavily modded car, there's more to gain.
03-24-2011, 11:45 PM
#4
Nordschleife Master
The only thing that worries me about the FMIC is damaging it on the street
If someone backs into you in a parking lot, and compresses the bumper shocks, you're getting towed home. It would most likely crack either the cooler itself, or the pipes.
I think they are the best option for max power on a track car...but not the best option for a DD car (JMHO of course)
If someone backs into you in a parking lot, and compresses the bumper shocks, you're getting towed home. It would most likely crack either the cooler itself, or the pipes.
I think they are the best option for max power on a track car...but not the best option for a DD car (JMHO of course)
03-25-2011, 12:34 AM
#5
03-25-2011, 12:43 AM
#7
Nordschleife Master
If you take a hit hard enough to damage the FMIC, you have bigger issues to worry about than your FMIC...
A hit hard enough to damage the FMIC, would have your car roughly looking like this:
A hit hard enough to damage the FMIC, would have your car roughly looking like this:
Last edited by JohnKoaWood; 03-25-2011 at 01:02 AM.
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03-25-2011, 12:45 AM
#8
Nordschleife Master
The SFR kit requires your to trim the bumper bar, correct? So if that bar gets crunched back an inch, so do the FMIC pipes...
I'm not talking about the stock unit here...
EDIT... here is techno duck's post on his install. Wouldn't take much to damage that...... Some punk kid could leave you walking with a swift kick to your grill....
I'm not talking about the stock unit here...
EDIT... here is techno duck's post on his install. Wouldn't take much to damage that...... Some punk kid could leave you walking with a swift kick to your grill....
Justin, if you get the chance i would like to see pictures of how you cut the bumper out.
Now after another 5hrs working on this, about 1.5 of that spent cutting more of the bumper bar out and about 2hrs wasted taking the bumper cover on and off again i am almost done. I should hopefully have this done before lunch tomorrow however i might be held up because i need to find one of two specific couplers (but i need both to do it right). More on that later in the post.
Anyhow here is the progress i made today. I fitted the intercooler again and bent the provided brackets to fit the angle the core sits at. Top is what the brackets looked like originally, bottom is approximately what they need to look like to fit the angle. It was easy to do this, a little trial and error, a vice and a hammer was all i needed.
Now before i drilled any holes i test fitted the core with the couplers attached which revealed more issues with the bumper bar. I ended up not cutting enough out of the bumper bar (i honestly couldnt believe it!). I took the entire bumper cover off again (stupid of me to put it back on!) and with the bumper bar off the car, used a whiz wheel yet again to cut off more material.
Here is the finish result after another 1.5hrs of cutting material off the bumper. This seems like it shouldnt take long but i assure you it does. Its tough to get the cutoff wheel in the right spots due to the angle and how damn thick the bumper is in parts. It does not look like it in the picture, but i smoothed everything out also with a grinding nose.
Now with the couplers on..
And now satisfied with that, i drilled the holes for the brackets and FINALLY mounted the intercooler..
This shows the angle that the core sits at. Note; tilt your head so the lower radiator support is horizontal and you will get an idea of what angle the core sits at.
Here you can see some of the material i cut off the bumper (bottom right) to try and get it sit more horizontal. To get it completely level, it would require cutting a significant amount of material off the bottom of the bumper as you can see..
Pre-intercooler charge pipe test fitted, fits reasonably well.
Now comes the 'son of a #$@##@" moment. Here is the post intercooler charge pipe. Way off,
Even when forced down, it is about 1.5" short. Its hard to see where the pipe terminates in the picture, but the bead for the coupler is just under where the pipe is cutoff in the picture by the area the nose panel screws onto. As you can see also, i need to cut off that IC mounting point to get the pipe to line up right. I am planning on cutting it so it can be bent out of the way tomorrow morning.
Here is another angle of the pipe being forced downwards, its being held down under the nose panel mounting point.
My plan is to put a 2.5'' hump coupler on the endtank so the chargepipe can bend a little easier. Now what completely screws me i think is the fact the pipes that come with the intercooler are 2.5'' and id say 90% of people out there have 2.25'' pipes. Whats going to be very hard to find is a reducer that goes from 2.25'' -> 2.5'' in a 5'' length which is what i think i need.
Extreme-Psi has both the coupler and reducer in 4'' lengths..but honestly i dont think it will be enough. I need to take some measurements and double check tomorrow. All i know is the generic 3'' lengths couplers come in usually (what i have) is way too short.
I am going to check the two local speed shops tomorrow.. otherwise i am going to get screwed on the shipping having to order online..and that is assuming i can find a place that even considers a reducer longer than the usual 3'' length as a non-custom order type deal.
So close..
Now after another 5hrs working on this, about 1.5 of that spent cutting more of the bumper bar out and about 2hrs wasted taking the bumper cover on and off again i am almost done. I should hopefully have this done before lunch tomorrow however i might be held up because i need to find one of two specific couplers (but i need both to do it right). More on that later in the post.
Anyhow here is the progress i made today. I fitted the intercooler again and bent the provided brackets to fit the angle the core sits at. Top is what the brackets looked like originally, bottom is approximately what they need to look like to fit the angle. It was easy to do this, a little trial and error, a vice and a hammer was all i needed.
Now before i drilled any holes i test fitted the core with the couplers attached which revealed more issues with the bumper bar. I ended up not cutting enough out of the bumper bar (i honestly couldnt believe it!). I took the entire bumper cover off again (stupid of me to put it back on!) and with the bumper bar off the car, used a whiz wheel yet again to cut off more material.
Here is the finish result after another 1.5hrs of cutting material off the bumper. This seems like it shouldnt take long but i assure you it does. Its tough to get the cutoff wheel in the right spots due to the angle and how damn thick the bumper is in parts. It does not look like it in the picture, but i smoothed everything out also with a grinding nose.
Now with the couplers on..
And now satisfied with that, i drilled the holes for the brackets and FINALLY mounted the intercooler..
This shows the angle that the core sits at. Note; tilt your head so the lower radiator support is horizontal and you will get an idea of what angle the core sits at.
Here you can see some of the material i cut off the bumper (bottom right) to try and get it sit more horizontal. To get it completely level, it would require cutting a significant amount of material off the bottom of the bumper as you can see..
Pre-intercooler charge pipe test fitted, fits reasonably well.
Now comes the 'son of a #$@##@" moment. Here is the post intercooler charge pipe. Way off,
Even when forced down, it is about 1.5" short. Its hard to see where the pipe terminates in the picture, but the bead for the coupler is just under where the pipe is cutoff in the picture by the area the nose panel screws onto. As you can see also, i need to cut off that IC mounting point to get the pipe to line up right. I am planning on cutting it so it can be bent out of the way tomorrow morning.
Here is another angle of the pipe being forced downwards, its being held down under the nose panel mounting point.
My plan is to put a 2.5'' hump coupler on the endtank so the chargepipe can bend a little easier. Now what completely screws me i think is the fact the pipes that come with the intercooler are 2.5'' and id say 90% of people out there have 2.25'' pipes. Whats going to be very hard to find is a reducer that goes from 2.25'' -> 2.5'' in a 5'' length which is what i think i need.
Extreme-Psi has both the coupler and reducer in 4'' lengths..but honestly i dont think it will be enough. I need to take some measurements and double check tomorrow. All i know is the generic 3'' lengths couplers come in usually (what i have) is way too short.
I am going to check the two local speed shops tomorrow.. otherwise i am going to get screwed on the shipping having to order online..and that is assuming i can find a place that even considers a reducer longer than the usual 3'' length as a non-custom order type deal.
So close..
03-25-2011, 12:55 AM
#9
Nordschleife Master
The SFR kit requires your to trim the bumper bar, correct? So if that bar gets crunched back an inch, so do the FMIC pipes...
I'm not talking about the stock unit here...
EDIT... here is techno duck's post on his install. Wouldn't take much to damage that...... Some punk kid could leave you walking with a swift kick to your grill....
I'm not talking about the stock unit here...
EDIT... here is techno duck's post on his install. Wouldn't take much to damage that...... Some punk kid could leave you walking with a swift kick to your grill....
I.E. Your bumper cover would be shredded, your bumper support would be toast, your frame (the cross member between the bumper support mounting locations) would be out of alignment. your header panel (and stock IC if there) would also be hit, as the stock IC sits directly above this frame member (lower stock IC mounts TO the cross member shown).
Keep in mind, the frame cross member is only attached on 2 sides, the back is open.. and it is just formed sheet metal, no real boxed frame there... ask me how I know...
Last edited by JohnKoaWood; 03-25-2011 at 08:50 AM.
03-25-2011, 01:13 AM
#11
Nordschleife Master
OH, I know what you're talking about...
Just sayin though, with the stock unit, your chances of being able to make it back home are much better than with the FMIC. I could drive home with a broken nose, and crushed bumper shocks.
Maybe our ideas of surviving an accident, and being able to get home, are 2 different things. I've only been on the hook 1 time in my life, and that was because my rear wheel was twisted 90deg to the car.....If its got 4 wheels, and the engine starts, I can make it home.
Just sayin though, with the stock unit, your chances of being able to make it back home are much better than with the FMIC. I could drive home with a broken nose, and crushed bumper shocks.
Maybe our ideas of surviving an accident, and being able to get home, are 2 different things. I've only been on the hook 1 time in my life, and that was because my rear wheel was twisted 90deg to the car.....If its got 4 wheels, and the engine starts, I can make it home.
03-25-2011, 01:28 AM
#13
Rainman
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
OH, I know what you're talking about...
Just sayin though, with the stock unit, your chances of being able to make it back home are much better than with the FMIC. I could drive home with a broken nose, and crushed bumper shocks.
Maybe our ideas of surviving an accident, and being able to get home, are 2 different things. I've only been on the hook 1 time in my life, and that was because my rear wheel was twisted 90deg to the car.....If its got 4 wheels, and the engine starts, I can make it home.
Just sayin though, with the stock unit, your chances of being able to make it back home are much better than with the FMIC. I could drive home with a broken nose, and crushed bumper shocks.
Maybe our ideas of surviving an accident, and being able to get home, are 2 different things. I've only been on the hook 1 time in my life, and that was because my rear wheel was twisted 90deg to the car.....If its got 4 wheels, and the engine starts, I can make it home.
for the record, this is what happened in my bumper-cars encounter. everything in front of the engine was completely hosed...the frame rail next to the oil filter was completely bent and crushed, about 3" inward. the only reason i didnt drive it home from the crash was because my front-mount oil cooler (where your FMIC would be) broke off its fittings and so all my oil would have sprayed out in the mile or so home. car i hit had a trailer hitch which punched holes in my 1) license plate 2) rubber bumperette and 3) clean through the NA's aluminum bumper. the bumper compressing from the impact is what killed the cooler.
granted, in this case the 951 IC would have sustained damage (crushed fins likely) but being a fairly stout piece i dont think it would have broken.
happily, the porsche badge sustained NO damage...
03-25-2011, 01:36 AM
#14
Nordschleife Master
Its kinda funny now....that its fixed... but those pics aren't funny.
Can't believe it wasn't totaled (was it?). A co-worker backed into my passenger fender and dented it, and State Farm almost totaled my car
. Apparently $1600 is what State Farm thinks my car is worth...
03-25-2011, 01:49 AM
#15
How often are you getting hit and how important is it to you that you are able to drive your car home after an accident? I just don't see how that should be a primary consideration when buying a part such as this?
Please get agreed value insurance on your car... it is worth the investment and for as much as most of us drive our cars, its not really an issue (usually they limit yearly mileage and usage). It's well worth the peace of mind.
Please get agreed value insurance on your car... it is worth the investment and for as much as most of us drive our cars, its not really an issue (usually they limit yearly mileage and usage). It's well worth the peace of mind.