333pg333

BB, yes it is/will be available so don't worry. I am also going with this.

Chris, my problems are mostly mid cornering and the tail coming out. Of course I can just slow down but that is treating the symptom not the cause. Also there is more to be worked out of my suspension setup and I'm not sure if I'll transfer this setup into the track car either.

Duke I have also seen that that product seems well received but that's not always what it seems, however in this case I think it's genuine.

Anders, it's about time you posted some video for us to all marvel at your skills hehe. No really I would like to see them if you have any?

anders44

hehe I have nothing from this year, but I have something from last year when testing suspension and no LSD? you can see car beeing nervous. with looser sway bars, looser rear shock settings for bump and reboud together with an LSD it's much more preditcable, hooks up better and is faster. aprox 3-4 secs than in video.

but more on the serious side, I work parttime (more like for fun?) as you know for a company offering instruction on track, so we analyze a lot of video, etc to see what went wrong, what can be done better etc. to improve my skills again I often goto germany, belgium etc and have instructions from real pros.

that and after going off the track a ****load of times with the 944 and fixing the suspension I haven't spun around in quite some time, close though, you need to be FAST on a aggressive setup 944, not like an m3... I also get to spend a lot of time on the track almost alone and doing 150 laps in a day

look close at 3:50 and out moviecar is a buddy in a 600hp GT2 ofcourse wanting to go past... traffic helps not to!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbzg7KDpTnU

Chris White

You have to balance out the negative camber - more negative camber gives you better lateral grip but worse foward grip with power.

If you are still running an open dif then that should be the first thing you take care of.

333pg333

Motorsport 80% LSD. Grip issues are lateral, not in a straightline....yet. I also late brake too much, in self assessment.
Neg front is 3.5 and rear is 1.9, I am finding that I have to run with my front Tarret done up all the way. This will decrease turn in / increase understeer, which will help not loose the rear. Not ideal of course but this is how it 'feels' best. In fact the car felt best when both sways were up on full. Yet when I had to switch back to the MO30 rear due to a broken droplink with the Tarret, I have to run that Mo30 on full soft or the car will rotate while parked! Always have had to run that on soft for some reason.
The other downside is I'm getting some choppyness through some turns. As if the front and rear are fighting. Rebound is also up full front and rear as I had an issue with 'Porpoising'. This has cured that. Bump is halfway on rear, 3/4 on front. Hoosier 275/295 R6s.

Duke

Just some input.. Some of the fastest race (but still street legal) 944s locally (996 CUP territory) run -4.5 front and -3.5 rear camber while still being lighter and running harder springs & shocks than your car.
IMHO -1,9 rear is much too little. I would add another degree of rear camber for testing.

anders44

camber needed also depends on bushings and tires.

do they also run 18"?

Duke

There is one car specifically that I have in mind that had most of the track records in it's class. It was super competetive in it's power/weight class.
18" MPSC and everything solid. Large splitter + wing, everything fibreglass etc.
Supposedly dry allowed even more camber but that was a wet/dry compromise.

But there's several ways to be fast. IMHO it seems that something is not right in Pat's setup and one way to try to reduce that massive oversteer is by adding more rear camber.

George D

Patrick,

Have you installed Polybronze bushings where available? This settled my car quite a bit, but I'm still working on the KWV3 settings, as I've got some front end issues. We are thinking it's the springs on the stock KWV3. In a corner, it's great, but once unloaded, I'm getting some floating issues under power.

Do what you want, but I'd work on your suspension issues first. TC, whether modualted from the computer, or ABS sensors is great for offroading, but will hamper times on a flat tarmac, in my opinion.

G

RPHARRIS

About the E-throttle, you could always use one in series with your mechanical throttle like the twin turbo supra. You might even be able to transplant some of that system off of one of those engines.

Personally I think if you're building a dedicated race car, you won't need traction/stability control. Those aids seem to help the most in terms of making a grippy (ie. r-compound tires and good geometry) but softly sprung car manageable. The right suspension setup will tune out lots of the traits that make electronic aids so useful.

gt37vgt

the other thing Pat try to Judge your car set up more by lap times than feel ...sway bars are a good exaple ... you may feel all inspired when the cars dives flat into corners but its not always the fastest way around ...
I wonder if lengtheng the outer arm would help tame the tail as that is much less work than the full ... I'll consult the guru

333pg333

That's a very good point Adam. In other words what 'feels' the best is not always the quickest....darn it....! I do seem to love the flat feeling of having both Tarrets screwed up full but perhaps I'm having to back off for longer before being able to power on with that setting?

333pg333

Yep George, I've got those P/Bs plus virtually all the Racers Edge metals as well.
I'm wondering if you're front end issues mightn't be like mine in that it was actually too little rear rebound and that is allowing your nose to climb on acceleration? If indeed that is what you're suffering?
As for hampering times, well I'm not sure about that. If that seems to be the case we can modulate it or just turn it off.

333pg333

I might have that rear camber a little to weak at 1.9 it may be more like 2.5 It's been a while since I've had it setup. Getting 3.5 out of the rears would take some adj from what I could tell. I wonder what spring rates these guys have and what power to weight ratio they're working with? How street legal are they? Taking out a few hundred pounds would make a lot of difference.

333pg333

Anders, you have my dream job!! Sounds like you have tons of experience and not only in driving but setting up a car. This is so important. I find it hard to explain what is going on to Sean my mechanic some times which I'm sure is slowing progress down. Funny thing is that he drove my car for the 1st time on a track last weekend and liked it a lot. Problem is that I also liked it except it had too much 'choppyness' around some corners. It could have been partially the track surface but we thought we'd try it with the front sway bar knocked from fully tight to about half way on the next day when our comp sessions were. Seemed to help with the choppyness but I had quite a few moments where the car started to rotate pretty heavily. Now this could have been due to a number of reasons.
-The car was running pump at 1 bar on the Friday and E85 at 1.3 bar on the Sat. I was also going in too deep in some corners so I unbalanced the car too.
-The softer front sway bar.
-Leaking coolant getting on the rear tyres
-Cold day on track. Ambient temps were 5c which is ******* freezing for us!!!

333pg333

RPH, we will have to find out the hard way I guess.