Weighed the car today
08-20-2018, 12:55 AM
#32
Burning Brakes
2650 lb is impressive. I bet it's pretty gutted. But if the car driving in the rain is the one you're talking about, I see you still have the front bumper bar, judging from the location of the tow hook. I've removed both my front an rear bar (and relocated the tow hook). I haven't weighed it yet, but plan to in the next few months when I get some scales. I'm bracing myself for a major disappointment, after working very hard to take weight out of it.
08-20-2018, 10:04 AM
#33
Race Car
Somewhere between 2300-2400 is doable with just hard work and not much expense.
My son's SP2 car is 2600 with 3 gallons of fuel and suited driver. He weighs in right at 190lbs without suit, helmet and gear.
When I built the car, finished it and put it on scales, we placed 3 1 gallon jugs of water in the rear deck above the fuel tank, sat driver in seat and I handed him his equipment through the window.
Went over to check scales and to my disbelief, the car was 2600 dead on the money.
Crazy, but, every decision to not cut out bracket X, every plot on roll cage tube lengths, braces, etc., etc. and it was 100% perfect.
He was in the seat when I was commenting that he wouldn't believe the scales so I had to make him sit perfectly still while I got a pic and went show him inside the car.
So basically, static, wet with fluids and zero fuel, this car is 23XX lbs with steel front fenders, doors, hood, rear quarters and some misc. factory brackets still intact.
Other than work scraping sound deadener, gutting doors, etc, car has only a Lexan rear deck and fiberglass sunroof panel.
The 100lbs lighter (944S 16V @ 2500 w/driver) was going to prove a challenge though, which I knew going in from previous builds.
That's why with this one, going with the bare tub to the oven first.
There's probably 10 lbs in just the under floor sound deadener/undercoat.
Car has FG front fenders and will have FG rear quarters as well but still, won't be easy to get down to 2300 wet.
T
My son's SP2 car is 2600 with 3 gallons of fuel and suited driver. He weighs in right at 190lbs without suit, helmet and gear.
When I built the car, finished it and put it on scales, we placed 3 1 gallon jugs of water in the rear deck above the fuel tank, sat driver in seat and I handed him his equipment through the window.
Went over to check scales and to my disbelief, the car was 2600 dead on the money.
Crazy, but, every decision to not cut out bracket X, every plot on roll cage tube lengths, braces, etc., etc. and it was 100% perfect.
He was in the seat when I was commenting that he wouldn't believe the scales so I had to make him sit perfectly still while I got a pic and went show him inside the car.
So basically, static, wet with fluids and zero fuel, this car is 23XX lbs with steel front fenders, doors, hood, rear quarters and some misc. factory brackets still intact.
Other than work scraping sound deadener, gutting doors, etc, car has only a Lexan rear deck and fiberglass sunroof panel.
The 100lbs lighter (944S 16V @ 2500 w/driver) was going to prove a challenge though, which I knew going in from previous builds.
That's why with this one, going with the bare tub to the oven first.
There's probably 10 lbs in just the under floor sound deadener/undercoat.
Car has FG front fenders and will have FG rear quarters as well but still, won't be easy to get down to 2300 wet.
T
08-20-2018, 01:47 PM
#35
Burning Brakes
T,
The weight of your son's car is amazing. I'm sure the gutted doors help a lot, but some of that is offset by the need to run a full cage. This makes significant modifications to the doors a major decision point for those of us wanting to lighten our cars as much as possible, while still being able to drive them on the street to and from the track. I guess the only true path to really light weight is to start with a completely gutted car, and adding back only the items that are truly necessary.
08-20-2018, 03:15 PM
#36
Race Car
OK, so I'm off by 16 lb, lol. Still, a very hefty piece of iron, although it at least sits low in the car.
T,
The weight of your son's car is amazing. I'm sure the gutted doors help a lot, but some of that is offset by the need to run a full cage. This makes significant modifications to the doors a major decision point for those of us wanting to lighten our cars as much as possible, while still being able to drive them on the street to and from the track. I guess the only true path to really light weight is to start with a completely gutted car, and adding back only the items that are truly necessary.
T,
The weight of your son's car is amazing. I'm sure the gutted doors help a lot, but some of that is offset by the need to run a full cage. This makes significant modifications to the doors a major decision point for those of us wanting to lighten our cars as much as possible, while still being able to drive them on the street to and from the track. I guess the only true path to really light weight is to start with a completely gutted car, and adding back only the items that are truly necessary.
Anyway, the other car he races that belongs to my friend that I posted the vids of, yellow 968.
That car made 2900 SP3 weight with 17" monoblock wheels, and 275s on the rear, factory glass rear hatch, full cage and doors not gutted like mine.
They have insert able Lexan window copies to close the car up.
No fiberglass at all.
Maybe it's not something wrong with factory reporting of curb weight as I see mentioned above.
Maybe it's something wrong with some of the people's scales....
T
08-20-2018, 09:27 PM
#37
Burning Brakes
Yeah, there is a surprising amount of variation in peoples' weight measurements. But as I said, there's only so far you can go by taking a street car, and jettisoning items out of it. Stripping it down completely as I'm sure you've done, giving you a clean slate, is the way to go if you have the facilities and resources, at least for a dedicated track car.
08-21-2018, 01:10 AM
#38
Rennlist Member
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Yes it is the car in the picture, and the weight includes the passenger seat and harness. I still have the front bumper bracing. By my calculations I could probably take an additional 150 out of it fairly easily. The crossmember, replace the windshield with lexan, same with the side windows. The front is all plastic. The NAs are a little easier to get down as the turbos have a bunch of weight they have to maintain due to the turbo. So turbos are at a couple of a hundred pound deficit from the get go.
2650 lb is impressive. I bet it's pretty gutted. But if the car driving in the rain is the one you're talking about, I see you still have the front bumper bar, judging from the location of the tow hook. I've removed both my front an rear bar (and relocated the tow hook). I haven't weighed it yet, but plan to in the next few months when I get some scales. I'm bracing myself for a major disappointment, after working very hard to take weight out of it.
08-21-2018, 10:25 AM
#39
Race Car
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Yes it is the car in the picture, and the weight includes the passenger seat and harness. I still have the front bumper bracing. By my calculations I could probably take an additional 150 out of it fairly easily. The crossmember, replace the windshield with lexan, same with the side windows. The front is all plastic. The NAs are a little easier to get down as the turbos have a bunch of weight they have to maintain due to the turbo. So turbos are at a couple of a hundred pound deficit from the get go.
Yes it is the car in the picture, and the weight includes the passenger seat and harness. I still have the front bumper bracing. By my calculations I could probably take an additional 150 out of it fairly easily. The crossmember, replace the windshield with lexan, same with the side windows. The front is all plastic. The NAs are a little easier to get down as the turbos have a bunch of weight they have to maintain due to the turbo. So turbos are at a couple of a hundred pound deficit from the get go.
Which one and what would you do with it..?
Just curious as to whether I'm missing some potential here because I'm going as far as roasting the whole tub in an oven for $1600 to lose 10-20 lbs...
You gotta have the front one and I doubt there could be a multi purpose piece lighter than the cast alu that supports engine, is mounting point for front a-am and also steering rack...?
And the rear crossmember that hangs the transmission...., well, it's pretty light already.
T
08-21-2018, 11:32 AM
#40
Rainman
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
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Yes it is the car in the picture, and the weight includes the passenger seat and harness. I still have the front bumper bracing. By my calculations I could probably take an additional 150 out of it fairly easily. The crossmember, replace the windshield with lexan, same with the side windows. The front is all plastic. The NAs are a little easier to get down as the turbos have a bunch of weight they have to maintain due to the turbo. So turbos are at a couple of a hundred pound deficit from the get go.
Yes it is the car in the picture, and the weight includes the passenger seat and harness. I still have the front bumper bracing. By my calculations I could probably take an additional 150 out of it fairly easily. The crossmember, replace the windshield with lexan, same with the side windows. The front is all plastic. The NAs are a little easier to get down as the turbos have a bunch of weight they have to maintain due to the turbo. So turbos are at a couple of a hundred pound deficit from the get go.
if you gotta carry the weight of a turbo, it seems a good way to balance it F/R a little.
...could you be legal in your race class if you started with a 924S (or even an old 2.0 924) bare tub and "turbo'd" it (brakes/suspension/drivetrain etc)?
08-21-2018, 12:21 PM
#41
Race Car
you guys put the battery in the trunk?
if you gotta carry the weight of a turbo, it seems a good way to balance it F/R a little.
...could you be legal in your race class if you started with a 924S (or even an old 2.0 924) bare tub and "turbo'd" it (brakes/suspension/drivetrain etc)?
if you gotta carry the weight of a turbo, it seems a good way to balance it F/R a little.
...could you be legal in your race class if you started with a 924S (or even an old 2.0 924) bare tub and "turbo'd" it (brakes/suspension/drivetrain etc)?
924 is not an eligible model for SP3 because there is already a niche in SP1 and 2 for it.
In the case of Bob, there is no rule disallowing a 924 base tub if in fact, as I suspect, his car is GT.
And yes, rear is ok for battery even though we mount on passenger floor directly under the factory spot, these cars DO handle a tad better with rear weight bias (full tank) but a lot of people mount the cool suit box there where the factory spare went. Water/ice/box/pump.
The distant battery relocates add unnecessary complexity, weight from large gauge cable runs, another item to crash protect etc.
T
08-21-2018, 12:22 PM
#42
Rennlist Member
The crossmember we were talking about is the aluminum bumper. The car as it is presently set up is GT2 as it is running a 3.1 L engine with a stand alone ecu. When I started playing with modifications I did not have an eye to racing but to performance and handling. It has evolved to what it is. The car was in GT3 until the recent engine rebuild. It could be run in GT3 again if weight was added to the car.
Battery is in original location. You really need to corner balance your car to determine where you want the weight.
Battery is in original location. You really need to corner balance your car to determine where you want the weight.
08-21-2018, 03:53 PM
#43
Burning Brakes
As a slight deviation from the intent of this thread, but still tangentially relevant - what do you guys who have had a lot of experience ligthening these cars think is the lower limit for a car that is not raced compettivitely (I NEVER want to own and maintain my own race car - arrive-and-drive is the only way I'll ever race), and needs to remain just streetable enough to drive to and from the track, and maybe pick up a few items from the grovery store onthe way home? My car already has the AC and stereo removed, but I still have the heater. I can put up with a lot, but it needs to at least look secure enough to not arrouse temptation in a parking lot as an easy target for a break-in. It needs to look like it's locked, in other words.
08-21-2018, 03:54 PM
#44
Race Car
Oh, ok, that crossmember...,
On a 944T front end conversion to an SP2 NA car, I used the factory piece but cut off the entire bottom half of the twin aluminum flat bar.
I have seen people that hole sawed it to take some weight off, but, unless you are running the factory lights in the cover, there's no need for both of the twin bars, just the top one.
I'll take it that was aimed at the other person....
T
On a 944T front end conversion to an SP2 NA car, I used the factory piece but cut off the entire bottom half of the twin aluminum flat bar.
I have seen people that hole sawed it to take some weight off, but, unless you are running the factory lights in the cover, there's no need for both of the twin bars, just the top one.
T
08-21-2018, 04:05 PM
#45
Rennlist Member
As a slight deviation from the intent of this thread, but still tangentially relevant - what do you guys who have had a lot of experience ligthening these cars think is the lower limit for a car that is not raced compettivitely (I NEVER want to own and maintain my own race car - arrive-and-drive is the only way I'll ever race), and needs to remain just streetable enough to drive to and from the track, and maybe pick up a few items from the grovery store onthe way home? My car already has the AC and stereo removed, but I still have the heater. I can put up with a lot, but it needs to at least look secure enough to not arrouse temptation in a parking lot as an easy target for a break-in. It needs to look like it's locked, in other words.
Yup