951_for_John

Just something I've thought about....

What if one built an intercooler that used the A/C system (compressor etc.) to cool the intake charge....

This could be set up for turbo or mounted under a S/C...

Think about it.. have an intercooler that is chilled by the A/C system...Run the pump when you want that extra HP and get an extra cold intake charge...
Sure it would take some HP to run the pump...Do you think the HP gain be more than the drag of the pump.

The ricers do it by spraying N2O on the intercooler, but you have to carry the bottle and keep refilling it, this would be on demand and not run out.

This is just something I was thinking about. maybe some of the engineers out there can give your thoughts on this.

1fastmr2

I've seen debates on this in other types of cars,before the Ford Lighting god the boot they planned to do something very similar to this.

944obscene

Yes. Ford was going to implement this, but nothing ever came to be. I designed a system on paper for a personal application. However, I decided that this was going to be too much work as I would have to completely reroute everything.

One problem is the pressure changes in an AC system are what make it effective. If you use a core that cools the intake charge, then you wont be able to take advantage of the system as it was intended (interior cooling).

P.S. the "ricers" are on to something, but I think you could achieve the same effects with compressed air or Co2. This is cheaper and has less of a parasitic loss on your motor when using. It won't cool as much, but the differences are nothing to sweat over. Subaru guys have water sprayers on their IC's. This is a good idea too.

951_for_John

I agree, that when you use the system to cool the intake charge, you would not be cooling the interior, BUT, when I'm on track, ( or running a sim on the puter ) I dont have the A/C on.

I think the stock A/C pump may not have enough volume to cool enough air for the intake.

What I like about this system is that it would not need to be refilled, ready all the time, when you need it.

John

Loquat15

i wonder what the power cost of an AC unit is versus the gains

gt37vgt

well i have seen it done its better with conventional intercooling as well.
it was not that great but what i have done my self is used a gas avaperator in an lpg fueled car to chill the water air intercooler i had to use anti freeze but the results were brain melting 40 degrees of timing 12 lbs of boost with 10.5:1 compression and minus 10 C inlet air temp in + 10 ambient

333pg333

I think we've all thought of this one time or another. I still think you could do it pretty easily but water/meth inj. will probably get you a similar result and that doesn't cost anything after setup.

xsboost90

i accidentally ran my a/c on the track one time and i over heated the car because the hot condensor made the radiator temps go up.

Spidey944

The A/C is a closed system, so unless you wanted to encase the I/C in a box, route the a/c ducts into that box to cool the I/C. Either way this just sounds retarded. Why not just mount a big box fan in front of the car facing the I/C and plug it into a 12v source using an A/C D/C converter. Seriously........

eniac

This may be better on a larger engine. Our little 4cyls are very sensitive to the drag produced from A/C.

With any size engine I do not see how this could give more power then it takes unless of course you want to make another attempt at cold fusion. You'd be better off sticking a block of dry ice in front of your IC.

sawood12

Given the amount of air flowing through the engine, and the speed of the air flowing under boost you'd need a second engine just to drive the compressor. The small A/C compressors sap a good couple of HP so imagine how much HP it would need to run a compressor ten or twenty times larger. Not to mention you'd need a huge turbo to flow enough air to feed the thing.

gjoey66

this is a simple thermo problem...how many BTU's can the A/C system absorb...i haven't run the numbers but i doubt it even comes close to the ammount of heat our intercoolers dump into cross flowing air...so essentially you could cool the intercooler by one of the above mentioned methods...but it would only buy you a very small fraction of a percent in colder intake temps. The sprayers on the other hand work by absorbing energy through evaporation...it's a huge heat sink to convert liquid (you name it) to a gas...so when you spray even water on the intercooler it's able to absorb massive ammounts of heat in order to evaporate. injection systems work by the same principle but are more effective cause they actually cool the intake air more efficiently as well as raise the octane level of the mixture if used in combination with methanol/alcohol...and other additives. In the end this is similar to the question of why can't we turbo charge a car with vacuum...not even close to enough capacity for this application.

on a side not...if you're a drag racing guy you could use the A/C system to get the intercooler really chilled before a launch...and then the intercooler itself will be a heat sink for you...but will heat soak rather quickly...why it won't work on a track. I know my brother puts Ice on a lot of his engine bay before passes in order to get reach heat soak later in the pass. he's noticed only small differences.

88BlueTSiQuest

Why not just go for an air to water intercooler? You are discussing a plumbing nightmare to begin with, so instead of using freon and an A/C compressor, a simple electric fan, water pump and small radiator could run the cooling system for the intercooler, and shouldn't pose the heat issues and drag that running the compressor would cause.

If this is for racing purposes, you could probably even go further by having the radiator in an ice box filled with ice, for sucking out even more heat.

If you were really good, you could daisy chain the FMIC with a liquid IC for even more cooling.. But now you open up another can of worms in terms of turbo lag.

facboy

+1 lol. aren't u talking about something akin to a perpetual motion machine? simplistically, (i think it's the first law of thermodynamics, or the second, or a combination of both), a closed system can't produce more energy than it consumes. the a/c isn't a power source, it's a sink. it doesn't 'create' any energy, it just uses it up. so where is the additional power going to come from?

i'm sure there are smarter guys on this board who could explain this better.

rcatherton

You could cut the power to the compressor clutch under full throttle.