tommo951

I agree with Patrick, $3500 sounds really skinny to me.
I think you are looking at more like $5000 even if you do the work yourself.
Most people start out turbo projects with $5k budgets and end up spending $10k
I would think you will probably be looking at $8-10k if you get somebody else to do the work at normal shop rates

333pg333

Maybe he's just missing a '0' off that figure tommo, that sounds more like it to me. lol

FRporscheman

I don't see where all the extra cost comes in. Remember I'm not aiming for anything more than say 330hp at the crank. The goal is just to get the engine running on some boost. I won't be touching the bottom end, at least for now. There will be no labor charges unless something needs machining. I might do any required welding myself, I might give it out to a pro. The rough parts list (8v) is

cometic HG (might not be needed - doesn't the 8v head already lower CR to 9:1? That's enough)
8v head (2.7 or modded 2.5), with necessary valves, necks, studs, etc
maybe dremmel the edges of the valve reliefs on the 16v pistons
cam box
intake, TB, boots, bov, box, injectors/rail, etc
chip
turbo, MM, etc
951 exhaust pips, a WG, etc
IC
other odds and ends, I have local friends with 951 parts cars, and I'm friendly with the local dismantlers

If I go 16v there will be some added cost for the intake, but I won't need to buy a head! I'll unplug the variocam so it never actuates. If a supercharger kit is $6000, the idea here is to create the same type of end result, but with a turbocharger instead... and turbo units are much cheaper than SC units.

StyleLab

I have to admit I admire you for taking on this project. Everythime someone suggests a 3.0 liter project, they get hammered into the floor from people calling them cheapos who want to cut corners.

This can be done without $1400 mahle pistons, $800 carillo-pauter rods, expensive EMS, custom plumbing and crazy turbos. Heck you can even use your stock DME with custom tuned chips. I'm sure you can use a k27/6 or even a k26/8 to reach the numbers you are looking for and have a very responsive car. I applaud you and encourage you. Best of luck to you!

cometic HG (might not be needed - doesn't the 8v head already lower CR to 9:1? That's enough) you can go widefire HG, the 8 valve head will lower your CR with stock 968 pistons. If you go 16 valve, use the thicker cometic HG with an adjustable cam gear.

-Nick

FRporscheman

Hey Nick, thanks for the encouragement!

From the reading I've done on this forum, I know what you're talking about how people bash the "cheapos" but it's not really bashing. The people with experience, who are the ones giving the info, are usually racers and builders, so they have moral and practical objections to compromises, and I respect that but I just can't do it that way. I would love to build this motor "right" but in my current situation, I have 2 options. Either leave it stock, or do it cheap. I can always revisit this in the future, with a new engine and more money, and do it better.

There are people who have done this though, like Mike on his S2 turbo cab (16v). If I go 16v I will pretty much copy what Mike did - HG, low boost, happy. I even considered doing what www.944968.com guy did, with the 2.5 crank to destroke the motor. But the aim of that is to have lots of boost, and with lots of boost I'll need a new maf, and then the slippery slope begins, so I won't go there.

If I go 8v I will be raising a lot of eyebrows in the "968 turbo S replica" community with all my compromises but this is my car and I'm not trying to make a replica or a racer, just trying to get 300hp or more.

For a long time I thought to just swap in a 951 2.5L motor and pump it up to 300+, which would be a lot easier and cheaper in every way. Plus it has bonuses like already has low CR, strong rods, light FW, etc. But it comes back to the SOUND. I've never heard a 2.5 turbo I liked. I heard Roger's 2.8 andial stroker and I liked that but I won't go there either.

Markus951

Hey

There is no point to swap 951 head in favor of 968 head..

Flat torque cruve because of variocam

Less egt

More ignition advance equals more hp at same boost level and much more reliable system..

You would need

951 intake manny, interocooler, boost pipes, turbo engine mount, crossoverpipe and 951 WG + 951 injectors..

Custom cometic head gasket aint that expencive I got one with 250 USD..

I bet you will get more then 300 with 1 bar boost. more like 300 at wheels..

Markus PS you HAVE TO got gor 26-8 because nr 6 hotside will be too small for hig CR 3.0 engine.. so...

porschefig

$250 head gasket.... I need to go back to Chevys....

gt37vgt

up to 400 crank hp is attainable on that budget just don't open the engine up at all run 10 or 12 psi with 85 . mikes cab turbo cab is doing it happy with an S2 motor .
1200 for a nice bb turbo 1000 for a pile of 951 bits fabrication and tuning for 1300 is a bit tight but possible . it is completely feasible to get 40% more power from any engine simply by by turbo charging it

George D

I have to completely agree with Patrick. Your best option is to purchase a blower kit from someone that has done the R&D. Trust me, or listen to me, a 300whp 968 is one fast, fun, fun, did I say FUN car.

Go to www.speedforceracing.com and see if they have a used blower kit ready to bolt up to your car.

Just my 2cents.

George D

I'll retract a bit. If marcus951 is available to help you turbo your car, you should have a gem of a street car. It's just that your budget will cause some grief, or maybe not. If you can do this within your budget, many HATS off to you.

333pg333

Agreed George.
Also, I was certainly not trying to discourage anyone either and more power to you if you can do it all for under $5k even. I would check with Markus and Mike with the turbo cab. They have done it and will know of any pitfalls. I've seen Mike's car and he has done most of it himself and I tell you it looks factory. I don't know how much he spent though??

FRporscheman

I'm familiar with SFR and their 968 supercharger kit. It looks perfect but it's almost double my budget price. I am planning on using their intercooler though.

And I'm not so sure I want to lay down the dough for a ball bearing turbo. Seems like it won't really be necessary, nor fully utilized in my set up anyway.

Markus951

It was custom order with 3.2mm thickness.. also the price is what I payd in europe (250 - 3% custom - 18% vat - 50 USD for transport)

I see that the main issue will be intake manny it would be alot easier to mount something under if it had different shape.

I have thoght about compressors as well.. why dont you go for the one witch is used in Buick 3.8 L engines (Riviera, LeSabre, Park Avenue, Century, Regal).

I am sure if the rebuilded one is somewhat 800 USD you can find used units from junkyars with half of that price..

SC buick Riviera (400)
Custom bracket to hold it put..
250 for Intercooler (some chinise one) +
Custom pipework 400 +
Custom belt to drive it some 150
Custom intake from Tim (speedforce 1099.-) http://www.speedforceracing.com/imag...ifolds_1_2.jpg
951 injectors (some money)
Custom chips
Clamps, silcone hoses etc.. some money..

I think you can install it instead of Air cond compressor since you have to rip it out anyways to make room for intercooler. So how much Air cond is worh.. you can get back some dollars..

Supercahrged 944 i think it uses same SC

http://213.132.112.100/images/18/1885273669.jpg
213.132.112.100/images/18/1810843626.jpg

Well no matter how you look its closer to 4000 USD..

Markus

Andial951

Arash,

I see your starting to get serious about this. Cool. I cant wait to see the end result. Good luck and let me know if you need any assistance. I'm good at supplying food and drinks...........lol

FRporscheman

I asked Tim at SFR once if they could sell the SC kit without the actual blower, and he said yes. The biggest cost is the blower, the rest of the kit shouldn't be too expensive. But I don't think I need the SFR intake if I want to use a supercharger, since it would mount where the alternator goes, right?

Roger- Yeah, I guess we'll never know if my 968 turbo will beat your andial 951... Well probably not since my goals are in the low 300s. If you lived closer to me I'd ask to rent your garage for the conversion, since I myself have no garage. If you have any sound clips or videos of your car, post them up. I want to hear a 2.8 stroker (again).