Exhaust and Intake studs...Sharky? + ARP stud torque?
06-04-2007, 06:20 PM
#16
Originally Posted by billindenver
Well we are in exactly the same boat then. My block and head were milled flat as well, new ARP's from EBS (to avoid future problems if that makes any sense at all). Started losing coolant on the track, then found still loosing coolant on spirited street driving. I think pressurizing the coolant was what took out my radiator (or sped up its impending demise more likely). I know when I was pulling the head I checked the torque on the nuts. Every one of them required 90 degrees before popping off at 65 ftlbs. Sure sounds like stretch to me....especially if we are both seeing the same thing. I don't think it was the headgasket that caused the problem.
How much was removed from head and block?
Did you change anything else? Like turbo or cam?
06-04-2007, 06:30 PM
#17
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Hmm, just now saw this thread.
I can't offer you any HG advice, but as far as my products go - it's a good idea to put some med. strength locktight (blue) on the intake studs. The "copper" (not really copper, just copper coated) nuts from Paragon grab pretty hard!
On the exhaust, if they come out with the nut - that's just as well. The broached end is so that you can pull the studs out if the nut comes off to make it easy to pull the manifold and/or head. If the stud comes out with the nut still attached, it's a simple matter to seperate them with a wrench and allen key prior to re-installation.
REMEMBER the anti-sieze if using the "copper" nuts from Paragon. They are some kind of 400 series stainless underneath and WILL gall on the stud if installed dry. If you put anti-sieze, your fine - just don't forget. If you use the factory nuts, anti-sieze is still not a bad idea - not not necessary.
I can't offer you any HG advice, but as far as my products go - it's a good idea to put some med. strength locktight (blue) on the intake studs. The "copper" (not really copper, just copper coated) nuts from Paragon grab pretty hard!
On the exhaust, if they come out with the nut - that's just as well. The broached end is so that you can pull the studs out if the nut comes off to make it easy to pull the manifold and/or head. If the stud comes out with the nut still attached, it's a simple matter to seperate them with a wrench and allen key prior to re-installation.
REMEMBER the anti-sieze if using the "copper" nuts from Paragon. They are some kind of 400 series stainless underneath and WILL gall on the stud if installed dry. If you put anti-sieze, your fine - just don't forget. If you use the factory nuts, anti-sieze is still not a bad idea - not not necessary.
06-04-2007, 06:31 PM
#18
Nordschleife Master
Regardless of bolt manufacturer (except for stock) I would say that re-torque is a good thing to do.
The "record" must be a Lotus Omega project I read about where they re-torqued the head about 7 times before releasing all the boost (30+ psi)...
IMHO you should also apply more torque than the usual 90 nm.
The "record" must be a Lotus Omega project I read about where they re-torqued the head about 7 times before releasing all the boost (30+ psi)...
IMHO you should also apply more torque than the usual 90 nm.
06-04-2007, 06:55 PM
#19
Originally Posted by special tool
How much was removed from head and block?
Did you change anything else? Like turbo or cam?
Did you change anything else? Like turbo or cam?
It was my understanding that the machine shop took off a very minimal amount from block and head, but have no exact figures. Witness marks on head were still very apparent.
Only thing extra added was MBC, and chips - boost at 15psi with AFRs around 11.5:1 at WOT.
I just talked to the machine shop I used, they recommend a re-torque on composite gaskets, no re-torque on MLS gaskets.
06-04-2007, 07:23 PM
#20
Burning Brakes
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My head and block were decked very little. Just enough to make sure they were flat. I don't recall off the top of my head what it was but still well within spec on both. Turbo etc remain the same. Its starting to sound like people are using significantly more torque than 65 ftlbs on these in the other thread.
06-04-2007, 07:27 PM
#21
Originally Posted by billindenver
My head and block were decked very little. Just enough to make sure they were flat. I don't recall off the top of my head what it was but still well within spec on both. Turbo etc remain the same. Its starting to sound like people are using significantly more torque than 65 ftlbs on these in the other thread.
Maybe I missed it - what type of headgasket?
Also - who's chips and is it maf or afm?
06-04-2007, 09:58 PM
#23
my take
I also hated the thought of having to re-torque the Raceware head studs what I am doing is final torque is 80 foot pounds instead of 65.
I talked to the Raceware tech and he told me the studs where rated to over 100 foot pounds. I figured with a MLS gasket and 80 foot pounds no re-torque would be needed.
-BB
I talked to the Raceware tech and he told me the studs where rated to over 100 foot pounds. I figured with a MLS gasket and 80 foot pounds no re-torque would be needed.
-BB
