intercooler
#31
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Originally Posted by Porschefile
Hehe, it's a good thing you didn't go that large! Generally, in my experience, much over a ~3-3.5" thick core and the rear half of the core is significantly less effective at cooling. Going with something like 5" thick would be a waste of time as opposed to simply going with say a longer or taller core since you'd have more total surface area.
ST, thanks for responding to my PM. Just fyi but, I'm copying you and using the same IC. I'm getting lazy and after seeing that pic it just appears to fit too well! Thank god for Asia and Ebay. $160 IC + $80 for 6 aluminum pipe bends, 6 reinforced couplers, and a bag full of T-bolts is nice for a change and cheaper than an end tank mod!
ST, thanks for responding to my PM. Just fyi but, I'm copying you and using the same IC. I'm getting lazy and after seeing that pic it just appears to fit too well! Thank god for Asia and Ebay. $160 IC + $80 for 6 aluminum pipe bends, 6 reinforced couplers, and a bag full of T-bolts is nice for a change and cheaper than an end tank mod!
#32
Originally Posted by TRP951
You can find a good IC that would fit for 160?
THe max width is 24"-25" between the two rails with a core size width of 18".
I could box it up and sell it for 1000 bucks if it will make everyone feel warm and fuzzy.
#33
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by TRP951
You can find a good IC that would fit for 160?
This is the one I bought: Link
That's a bit too thick for the average 951 owner's power levels and is geared more towards high power levels. For something more moderate like 300-400hp, one of these would bit a bit better of an idea and should still fit just fine: Link
I also bought a IC piping kit from the same seller, and everything was very high quality, especially for the price. The aluminum piping is good quality (not cheap cast stuff or pot metal) and the couplers are reinforced kind of like Samco hoses, so they aren't some cheap thin couplers. As far as the performance of the IC goes, it's tough to say as I haven't exactly used it. Honestly though, if it has a few psi more pressure drop then say a considerably more expensive core, I really could care less as it's like 1/5th of the cost and still gets the job done.
I'll post some pics and info about the install hopefully in the next few weeks.
#34
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I really don't understand why none of the tuners offer a reasonably priced intercooler for our cars.
I know there are many people like me who will not go to the trouble of trying to find something that will fit and then try to fab parts to install it.
Seems like someone could easily put together a kit for ~$200, add instructions and sell it for $400.
I'd buy it, and I'm sure many others would too.
I know there are many people like me who will not go to the trouble of trying to find something that will fit and then try to fab parts to install it.
Seems like someone could easily put together a kit for ~$200, add instructions and sell it for $400.
I'd buy it, and I'm sure many others would too.
#35
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Originally Posted by special tool
I agree - this is what I have done also.
Thanks
#37
I picked up a FMIC from Ebay too for my 937 project...
Core = 18"X12"X3"
Overall = 25" Wide w/ 3" In/Out
Cost $130
My plan is to run a low profile puller fan between the IC and the Rad to help air flow. Is this necessary or no?
Core = 18"X12"X3"
Overall = 25" Wide w/ 3" In/Out
Cost $130
My plan is to run a low profile puller fan between the IC and the Rad to help air flow. Is this necessary or no?
#38
Originally Posted by special tool
I put about 600 HP through it at high boost.
#39
Originally Posted by schnellfahrer
I really don't understand why none of the tuners offer a reasonably priced intercooler for our cars.
I know there are many people like me who will not go to the trouble of trying to find something that will fit and then try to fab parts to install it.
Seems like someone could easily put together a kit for ~$200, add instructions and sell it for $400.
I'd buy it, and I'm sure many others would too.
I know there are many people like me who will not go to the trouble of trying to find something that will fit and then try to fab parts to install it.
Seems like someone could easily put together a kit for ~$200, add instructions and sell it for $400.
I'd buy it, and I'm sure many others would too.
Brian
#40
Originally Posted by Tms951
But that does not mean it can realy "handle" it, if it could handle it why are you upgrading? Your response seems misleading to me, I don't actualy think the stock intercooler can handle that sort of power in the real would. Your glory run on the dyno is different and that power curve was ugly. Do you have any IAT logs of that run?
I answered the ****ing question.
Don't read into my statements.
OBVIOUSLY (to a non-moron) the stock cooler is not good for sustained 600 HP.
#41
Originally Posted by special tool
Here is a picture of my latest ic.
This core is the same as Alex's, except it's 1/2 inch thicker.
In this picture, the mounting is finished.
All the bodywork fits perfectly on top.
This core is the same as Alex's, except it's 1/2 inch thicker.
In this picture, the mounting is finished.
All the bodywork fits perfectly on top.
Last edited by Bri Bro; 03-23-2007 at 12:08 AM.
#42
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Originally Posted by robinsonracing
The way I understand it that HP really is not the key but air flow more of a factor. Basically stock head, No need for more than a stage two IC ( stock w/upgraded ends) until you increase the head flow pass say stage two then there is a call for better IC. So a stage two could hold 400rwhp no problem as most common upgrades put you. So crazy mods = crazy custom IC, common upgrades + slightly altered IC otherwise you loose low end air pressure in the IC if you go to big IC without the right flow.
Brian
Brian
I understand what your saying but and your on the right track but, think of it this way.
If you change the boost levels then, you are pushing more air through the stock engine. The IC, IC pipes, head, intake and t-body were not intended to move that "new" amount of air. Changing one part of the puzzle creates a bottleneck somewhere else.
You can get away with putting a huge turbo on the motor "making" the existing parts work but they will be operating out of their effeciency range.
Even with "common" upgrades, its best to improve the t-body, intake and IC, Then you can put your large turbo on there and "make" the head work. You should always think of it as a system.
ps- don't forget about the exhaust too.
#43
Three Wheelin'
Another aspect to consider is intake air temps. While a stock or modded stock IC might "support" a certain power level, in many cases using larger components will provide for less restriction (the whole grape through a straw analogy) which will reduce intake temps, which ultimately will result in more power and can have the benefit of increased reliability (as a result of less "stress" on the setup).. The stock IC has a really small inlet and outlet, an odd shaped bend to the end tank on one side, and doesn't have a huge amount of surface area. Of course there are other bottlenecks such as the throttle body, intake manifold, stock head ports, etc. Though, that doesn't mean that there still aren't beneficial improvements you can make to these pre-port components. It's the same concept as increasing exhaust diameter when increasing boost pressure or generating more power in other ways on a turbocharged car. The smaller the diameter, the hotter the airflow temps and the harder the engine has to work. The flip side is there is a balance as going too large in some areas (generally everything on the pre-turbine and intake airflow side) can cause undesirable side effects like increased lag, loss of low-end power, etc. It's been my experience that the size of all the intake side components on our cars is pretty small and poses a definite restriction on 300+whp cars.
The stock IC is really nice for a stock turbocharged car, as most tend to have crappy small side-mount IC's that aren't too efficient. However, personally I feel that a thinner IC (isn't the stock one ~5" thick or so? can't remember) with more total surface area and larger inlet/outlet would be a much better idea for typical 300+whp setups. The end tank mod is definitely a cheap and easy way to go about it though, and we've seen plenty of dyno evidence in the past that this alone is definitely an improvement.
Robinsonracing, you're right that technically IC size should be measured by the intended airflow volume. However, generally specific horsepower levels require certain airflow volumes, so people generally "measure" these things in horsepower as it is a bit easier to judge that way. It's a matter of semantics to most I guess.
The stock IC is really nice for a stock turbocharged car, as most tend to have crappy small side-mount IC's that aren't too efficient. However, personally I feel that a thinner IC (isn't the stock one ~5" thick or so? can't remember) with more total surface area and larger inlet/outlet would be a much better idea for typical 300+whp setups. The end tank mod is definitely a cheap and easy way to go about it though, and we've seen plenty of dyno evidence in the past that this alone is definitely an improvement.
Robinsonracing, you're right that technically IC size should be measured by the intended airflow volume. However, generally specific horsepower levels require certain airflow volumes, so people generally "measure" these things in horsepower as it is a bit easier to judge that way. It's a matter of semantics to most I guess.
#44
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Originally Posted by evil 944t
Patrick, ST emailed me this.. maybe this pic helps.. I'm not sure if its true.
#45
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If we look at increasing the size of all these pre-port components, what part does the actual turbo inlet/outlet play? For example if we have a 2" outlet isn't this the restriction from the get go?