SoloRacer

I also just ordered a set for a friends K27/8 944 Turbo. I figure with the 30 day money back garauntee I can't go wrong. I'm willing to give them a shot and report back with the results.

AL951

Sometimes reality is more strange than theory!

I have seen it to many times to write somebody off, just base on my educated opinion

Regards,
AL

rberry951

Reality strange? I didn't realize you had actually been to my home before!

AL951

That is funny Russell!

So Russell any chance that you will be working on newer cars any time soon, like 996 turbo?

My brother has one and he wants to get some more power from his stock engine.

Regards,
AL

Thom

Interesting results.
Do you have AFR and knock curves ?

rberry951

Right now I'm just trying to get all the 944NA/S/S2 variants to market, also working on 968s at the same time. Next will be 911 variants, there are a LOT of them. As for what years and models I'll be able to do anything with, I'm not even sure yet. When you get into the 90's and up there are some pretty radical design changes. But an engine is still an engine... stay tuned...

Regards,
Russell

rberry951

Dave is going to get the AFR info from the shop, but since it's the weekend I don't know if I will have that on this run before he goes back for the next run after fixing the sensors. But I'll make sure we have all the info on those runs, which should be even more interesting with the car running well.

rberry951

Sorry Danny, I missed some posts looking through the thread. Yes the 26/6 and 27/6 will have different mappings. That's why we provide an inexpensive upgrade path and retuning so you don't get hit with the cost of yet another chip. People upgrade often, we try to to make it less painful.

Regards,
Russell

rberry951

Wow, missed your post too Max. I apologize for that. The current chips work with MAFs with piggybacks. The true 'MAF' chips will be available soon through Lindsey. And yes they will have the same characteristics of maintaining A/F across a range of boost levels.

Regards,
Russell

RKD in OKC

In the past two years of 944 Turbo ownership and living in OKC where Lindsey Racing is located I have seen a LOT of tuning and tweaking to get the most from these cars. Not only my car, but Lindseys cars, their customers cars, and other area 944 Turbos. It has been my experience that there are many factors that effect just how much power any one of these cars can make at a given level of boost. If everything hits just right, ie., air flow, fuel, spark, and the rate at which each of these elements change over the rpm range it can make a huge difference in power output. I've also observed that if any one of these is off, even just a tiny bit, the whole thing kind of falls apart and you end up with the same or less power than everyone else.

An example: When I had my car tuned to dyno 350 rwhp at 16 psi, 375 at 18, and 401 at 20, the car took 12 seconds to go from 2000 rpm to 7000 redline cut off in 3rd at 16psi according to my MafterBurner data log. That was with me 250lbs and a friend 300lbs in the car. At 12 seconds with both of us in the car I thought this was a little slow despite the high hp dyno numbers for 16 psi. This was with perfect A/F ratios across the rpm range at full throttle under our 2 big guy load.

We lowered the fuel pressure so a higher voltage would be required from the MAF thru the MafterBurner to get the same A/F ratios. This changes where in the rpm range and air measurement voltage the spark advance happens. After a couple of runs massaging the MafterBurner voltages we were not only getting the same A/F ratios as before on our fully loaded full throttle runs, the 2000 to 7000 rpm runs were only taking 5 seconds! I haven't dynoed the new tune, but less time means more torque. My friend noticed that the car felt slower despite the faster time because the acceleration was a lot smoother. The only difference was fuel pressure and voltages from the MAF.

So, what I am saying is that I feel LR and ProMax are achieving what they say they are with whatever they say the settings are as I can't think of any benefit to not being truthful. Making higher claims than what a customer with the same setup would get would only disappoint customers, disappointed customers don't buy more stuff. AND As soon as I get some other issues fixed on my car, I want some of those chips tweaked for my setup!

pk951

I don't want, to sound negative but all this testing beening done by the vender that sells these chips is a little biased no? I'am sure the chips work great, but if you look at the charts posted by Brian Morris
Addict, it seems he has a good point. Nice to hear from other people what they think about those charts that were posted. If other people who bought these chips that go on the dyno and get simular results that would be more, than enough to prove, that yes other people are getting the same hp or are not that far off from what the venders are getting.If not then people can come to there own conclusions.

rberry951

Hey pk951,

When skepticism is voiced in this way I don't mind a bit responding. Dave Lindsey didn't just wake up one morning and say "we need to carry the 951MAX chips." I contacted them looking for parts to package a kit to provide for customers who had no mods, only as a convenience, no markup at all. I got no response for a long time. Finally I emailed Dave and said basically "I'm selling chips, I'm going to sell a kit, I would like to use your parts, if not interested let me know so I can find another source". At this point he called me and explained that he and Mike had been considering what they should do, as far as working with me or against me. At that time I didn't even know they sold their own chips, much less identical kits. So Dave asked if I could send him some chips to evaluate, and they would go ahead and sell me the kit parts. I sent them, he liked them. He then told me they would consider replacing their current chips with mine if they live up to my claims. Off to the dyno he went in the red car. That's where the first 15.5 and 20psi charts came from. He sent me the charts and state that he was very impressed with the overall performance, and it looked like they would indeed like to carry my chips. So those charts were generated in their process of evaluating a new potential supplier. He further stated that the wastegate on that car was really dying and he wanted to put a new wastegate on and try again. He only just got around to doing that. But then again, only a couple of months have passed. In that short span of time Pelican Parts and Paragon Products both decided to become resellers of the 951MAX chips based solely on what they saw from my customers. The other charts on my website come from Rennlisters.

So now all the stuff Brian Morris posts, all but one chart from my site. I guess he missed where I already posted here that Dave 'attempted' a 20 psi run but the car was just breaking up too much to complete the run, and the numbers were 'only' 302hp/365tq. Don't have a chart from that, and if I did it would be ugly, lots of pieces missing. Dave and Mike were both standing there staring at the boost gauge as they were also making a comparison of their 3" vs 4" exhaust. I would have been perfectly happy if the car didn't make 300HP until they got to 20psi, and like others here was amazed to see it at 16. As for comparing the 16psi chart to the 20psi chart, yeah, they look a lot alike. Except that the 20psi shows a full tq 'spike' at about 4200 rpm, the 16psi hits full tq at 3800. The 20psi chart goes to 6500 rpm, the new 16psi only to 5800 because the car breaking up so bad at higher rpm. The 'other' chart Brian posted isn't even in RPM, so there's no reason for it to be here at all.

I post charts on my site my customers send me, and that collection will grow. With each chart I also post all the specifications of the car in question so no one is mislead into thinking they can get 427HP at 22psi if they haven't spent the money George D has on their engine. Dave Lindsey posts charts of dyno runs that he himself observes simply because he is not going to let his fine reputation ride on the word of someone else. If I thought for a second that he might be dishonest in any way I would not be doing business with him. My experience with the Lindsey's tell me they are upstanding people, and experts in their field. That's why I teamed up with them to help develop more products.

But as you say, more numbers will roll in as time goes on, more 'proof' per se. And when it does I hope Brian Morris and others like him who are calling us 'liars' have the backbone to come forth with a public apology. But the skepticism doesn't get under my skin at all.

Regards,
Russell

pk951

Thanks for the response Russell. From the guys that have bought your chips they seem pleased with them. From a cost factor it is very enouraging to see that kind of pricing.

amschnellsten

alright russel I am going to buy your chips very soon. When I get my car back together I wil send you what I have and can you burn me some custom chips?

95ONE

I'm surprised no one called BS when i posted my Dyno with 268hp to the wheels with my stock 86 26/6 turbo. Autothority chip, (terrible AFR's) Adjustable FPR, intercooler and pipes, Dual port wastegate, open 2.5" exhaust. That's it. 17.5psi max. Dropping to around 15psi. or less at peak hp. Lots of nay-sayers! why?

These numbers aren't that incredibly un-beleivable.

Comparing my results to the claims here, I don't see how it would need much tuning to reach these numbers on the 27/8. The only tune needed is to keep it safe, not peaky.

I say relax. If you don't have that horsepower now and have the same turbo, no big deal, you're less than a $1000 away from that same power, and I honestly don't think it matters who's chip you buy to get there. But I would certainly look at safety margin and reliability and consistency when purchasing. (My chip came with car) ......this is a good thing! Our cars truly rock.