Another Newb with some questions
10-06-2006, 03:34 PM
#1
Racer
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Another Newb with some questions
Hey everyone,
So I have been using the search function like crazy and reading everything I can find about 944 Turbos and maintenance and what not. Im looking at an '88 Turbo and have a few questions that hopefully some of you knowledge gods can answer for me.
The owner of the car is a good friend of one of my good friends, so everything he has been telling I am pretty confident is true.
The car has about 168,000 miles, the ODO broke at 153,000, and is a 1988. It was repainted dark blue from white but the job was not high quality. I'm not too concerned with the paint though so not a big deal. Maintenance the car has had done:
1. Rebuilt head after timing belt failure, a $3500 job (owner has all records)
2. All new belts
3. Engine rebalanced
4. Rebuilt rear CV joints with new boots
5. New front A-arms due to worn out ball joints
6. New oil cooler seals
7. Rebuilt starter motor
8. New fuel injectors and fuel injector seals
9. New clutch master cylinder
10. New clutch slave cylinder
11. Brake and clutch system run on ATE Super Blue Race fluid
12. Dents pounded out
13. New tail-lights
The car also has had the following upgrades:
1. Rear torsion bar delete: Bilstein Escort Coilovers with 400lb springs from Lindsey Racing ($350 each)
2. DME and KLR chips from Lindsey Racing
3. Wastegate shims from Lindsey Racing
4. Bosch 3.0 Bar fuel pressure regulator from Lindsey
5. Lindsey racing boost enhancer
6. Disconnected ABS
7. Cut fender linings to fit larger wheels
8. Alpine CD deck, 2nd from most expensive
9. Infinity Reference speakers
10. 18x8F and 18x10R 911 turbo twist wheels
Ok so that takes care of the good, on to the bad...
Here are the imperfections, I attached prices based on the research I have been doing, some of it may be a little off:
1. Front crank seal is leaking-
2. Some of the dashboard and vinyl is cracking- $500 for recovered
3. Needs rear hatch shocks- $95
4. Needs hood shocks- $35
5. No Fog lights-
6. Bored out passenger door lock from break in attempt- $25
7. Water leak, pools up on rear floorboards every once in awhile.
8. Sunroof wont pop out, but slides open fine; Needs new wind deflector: $20
9. Power mirrors don’t work-
10. Needs a new power steering rack or a manual rack, lots of play in the steering due to lack of power assist- $500-$700
11. Rear view mirror falls off sometimes: cheap kit from AutoZone to fix
12. Rusted rear muffler-
13. Gauge cluster backlights are dim and ODO is broken-
14. Needs to flush coolant system and install new thermostat- $115 with 80degree thermostat and all new hoses
15. Turbo is a little whiney: $350 rebuild
16. Small exhaust leak right off the wastegate
Ok so thats the bulk of it. I can probably get the car for around $3500, maybe a little less or more depending on some details. I plan on doing all the work myself except for maybe the powersteering replacement, depending on the difficulty. I estimate that I will spend about $1500 on parts to get the car how I want it.
Do you guys think it is worth it to buy the car if I have a budge of about $8000? If I get it for 3500 I figure thats about $4000 in maintanence labor I would be willing to spend to fix some of the details. The car doesnt have to be perfect, I just want it to be reliable and dependable for the track and street.
Thanks alot guys and what a informative forum!!
So I have been using the search function like crazy and reading everything I can find about 944 Turbos and maintenance and what not. Im looking at an '88 Turbo and have a few questions that hopefully some of you knowledge gods can answer for me.
The owner of the car is a good friend of one of my good friends, so everything he has been telling I am pretty confident is true.
The car has about 168,000 miles, the ODO broke at 153,000, and is a 1988. It was repainted dark blue from white but the job was not high quality. I'm not too concerned with the paint though so not a big deal. Maintenance the car has had done:
1. Rebuilt head after timing belt failure, a $3500 job (owner has all records)
2. All new belts
3. Engine rebalanced
4. Rebuilt rear CV joints with new boots
5. New front A-arms due to worn out ball joints
6. New oil cooler seals
7. Rebuilt starter motor
8. New fuel injectors and fuel injector seals
9. New clutch master cylinder
10. New clutch slave cylinder
11. Brake and clutch system run on ATE Super Blue Race fluid
12. Dents pounded out
13. New tail-lights
The car also has had the following upgrades:
1. Rear torsion bar delete: Bilstein Escort Coilovers with 400lb springs from Lindsey Racing ($350 each)
2. DME and KLR chips from Lindsey Racing
3. Wastegate shims from Lindsey Racing
4. Bosch 3.0 Bar fuel pressure regulator from Lindsey
5. Lindsey racing boost enhancer
6. Disconnected ABS
7. Cut fender linings to fit larger wheels
8. Alpine CD deck, 2nd from most expensive
9. Infinity Reference speakers
10. 18x8F and 18x10R 911 turbo twist wheels
Ok so that takes care of the good, on to the bad...
Here are the imperfections, I attached prices based on the research I have been doing, some of it may be a little off:
1. Front crank seal is leaking-
2. Some of the dashboard and vinyl is cracking- $500 for recovered
3. Needs rear hatch shocks- $95
4. Needs hood shocks- $35
5. No Fog lights-
6. Bored out passenger door lock from break in attempt- $25
7. Water leak, pools up on rear floorboards every once in awhile.
8. Sunroof wont pop out, but slides open fine; Needs new wind deflector: $20
9. Power mirrors don’t work-
10. Needs a new power steering rack or a manual rack, lots of play in the steering due to lack of power assist- $500-$700
11. Rear view mirror falls off sometimes: cheap kit from AutoZone to fix
12. Rusted rear muffler-
13. Gauge cluster backlights are dim and ODO is broken-
14. Needs to flush coolant system and install new thermostat- $115 with 80degree thermostat and all new hoses
15. Turbo is a little whiney: $350 rebuild
16. Small exhaust leak right off the wastegate
Ok so thats the bulk of it. I can probably get the car for around $3500, maybe a little less or more depending on some details. I plan on doing all the work myself except for maybe the powersteering replacement, depending on the difficulty. I estimate that I will spend about $1500 on parts to get the car how I want it.
Do you guys think it is worth it to buy the car if I have a budge of about $8000? If I get it for 3500 I figure thats about $4000 in maintanence labor I would be willing to spend to fix some of the details. The car doesnt have to be perfect, I just want it to be reliable and dependable for the track and street.
Thanks alot guys and what a informative forum!!
10-07-2006, 04:31 AM
#2
Burning Brakes
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Off the Autobahn.
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Welcome to the forum 
Your write up is very informative about the state of the car at the moment however I think most people will tell you to go get a PPI done. You could save some money in the long run. 8K is a pretty good budget and for that money you could find a lower mileage one. If you are confident in the car and your own mechanical abilities, then simply talk the person down as much as possible and buy the car.....TODAY!
Post pics as soon as possible.
Your write up is very informative about the state of the car at the moment however I think most people will tell you to go get a PPI done. You could save some money in the long run. 8K is a pretty good budget and for that money you could find a lower mileage one. If you are confident in the car and your own mechanical abilities, then simply talk the person down as much as possible and buy the car.....TODAY!
Post pics as soon as possible.
10-07-2006, 11:57 AM
#3
Racer
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Oh yeah, I forgot to mention a I was going to have PPI, compression, and leakdown tests done before pulling the trigger. Im pretty sure I can fix most of the minor stuff myself, just not sure how involved the power steering rack and front crank seal is. I would probably have to pay someone to do that. Any idea what kind of labor would be charged for those?
10-07-2006, 12:19 PM
#6
Racer
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Exactly, I was looking at this car because I know it has a few problems that I would need to address. For the most part however, the maintenance has been taken care of and I think the rest of the car , ,besides a few of the problem areas, is solid.
I would want to be able to daily drive the car and be able to track it as well without having to worrying about it breaking down all the time. Considering the maintenance the car has had done, if I fix the problem areas would that goal be out of the question?
I would want to be able to daily drive the car and be able to track it as well without having to worrying about it breaking down all the time. Considering the maintenance the car has had done, if I fix the problem areas would that goal be out of the question?
i'll help with the maintenance
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10-08-2006, 07:28 AM
#9
Tempting project, huh? Good survey of the issues and mods....good enough, I would think to encourage you to keep looking. If this car was for sale at $8K with all the issues solved it would be a "Buy It Now" recommendation from this desk, but seems to me you've got a triple dose of a potentially bad voodoo here.
1) A bad paint job
2) A bunch of mods
3) Niggling issues and missing parts
Finding a more original car with fewer issues for $5-$6K and then taking your time to sort through needed maintenance and upgrades might be a better use of your first $8K.
FWIW, I bought a low mile original (64K odo), salvage title NA with everything working and nicely repaired from a rear hit for $4K...and have enjoyed the living daylights out of it as I slowly turned it into a DE/autocross playtoy.
More recently, I paid $13.5K for a 68K 1989 Turbo that was clean and original, with full 968 M030 suspension upgrade and many receipts. I can eat street ricers for breakfast after upgrading to a 3" stainless cat bypass, dual port Tial/MBC, billet BOV and adjustable FPR. Previous owner's Protomotive chips are sitting in my desk drawer, but not needed right now, as it runs with the Cayman S of your choice for 1/4 of the price with the OE chips.
Point being, buy the best car you afford to start with. That way all of our incremental cash goes for improvement rather than repair. Very good advice has been rendered by many here at Rennlist and in many mags that the temptation to create value in a car with issues is rarely rewarded.
1) A bad paint job
2) A bunch of mods
3) Niggling issues and missing parts
Finding a more original car with fewer issues for $5-$6K and then taking your time to sort through needed maintenance and upgrades might be a better use of your first $8K.
FWIW, I bought a low mile original (64K odo), salvage title NA with everything working and nicely repaired from a rear hit for $4K...and have enjoyed the living daylights out of it as I slowly turned it into a DE/autocross playtoy.
More recently, I paid $13.5K for a 68K 1989 Turbo that was clean and original, with full 968 M030 suspension upgrade and many receipts. I can eat street ricers for breakfast after upgrading to a 3" stainless cat bypass, dual port Tial/MBC, billet BOV and adjustable FPR. Previous owner's Protomotive chips are sitting in my desk drawer, but not needed right now, as it runs with the Cayman S of your choice for 1/4 of the price with the OE chips.
Point being, buy the best car you afford to start with. That way all of our incremental cash goes for improvement rather than repair. Very good advice has been rendered by many here at Rennlist and in many mags that the temptation to create value in a car with issues is rarely rewarded.
10-08-2006, 01:30 PM
#10
Racer
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Thanks for the advice. I dont know where you guys are finding turbos for less than 8 grand though, the cheapest I have seen is 8500?
And I just found out the car has had some other service done, new radiator, brake rotors, and the powersteering job I was fearing actually just needs a new PS pump, not a whole rack like I thought.
The paint I would probably leave as is for awhile since the car is going to be a autox/DE and somewhat daily. Eventually I will repaint it the original white, but I can wait for awhile on that.
Again, I'm not an expert but most of the problems are little things that I could find on ebay for less than $100, and my budget would allow me to fix a large portion of them.
I'm definitly still looking around as this car wont be available till january anyway. It just seems that for $3500 + about $1000 to $2000 in maintenance I could have a really fun street/track car.
And I just found out the car has had some other service done, new radiator, brake rotors, and the powersteering job I was fearing actually just needs a new PS pump, not a whole rack like I thought.
The paint I would probably leave as is for awhile since the car is going to be a autox/DE and somewhat daily. Eventually I will repaint it the original white, but I can wait for awhile on that.
Again, I'm not an expert but most of the problems are little things that I could find on ebay for less than $100, and my budget would allow me to fix a large portion of them.
I'm definitly still looking around as this car wont be available till january anyway. It just seems that for $3500 + about $1000 to $2000 in maintenance I could have a really fun street/track car.
10-08-2006, 01:34 PM
#12
Rennlist Member
The rear hatch shock and leaking problem may be the rear hatch glass is coming loose from the frame. It cost me $150 here in OKC to get the rear hatch glass refitted and resealed. No more leak and it also didn't need the rear hatch shocks.
