ot new bmw 3 series turbo
09-13-2006, 09:37 PM
#1
ot new bmw 3 series turbo
I just heard about a new twin turbo 3 series on the radio. Has anyone actually seen/ driven one? Thats gonna be a hell of a platform to mod for big hp.
09-13-2006, 10:11 PM
#3
Instructor
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Yeah. I'm a tech for our local BMW Center. I rode in one during a pre-delivery inspection. It's quick! I'd bet it would give my 951 a serious run for the money. They are rated about 305hp. I've heard some customers have dyno'd them and found 280RWHP bone stock. That's the same as my 951. The turbos come on so smoothly, you almost can't tell. I haven't been trained on the car yet, but I've heard that the wastegates are spring open. The vacuum signal from a separate reservoir holds them closed. This could make increasing boost w/software difficult. Also the exhaust manifolds are one piece welded to the turbine housings. Just like the SRT4, the aftermarket will have to come up with a manifold. The stock turbos are tiny. The smallest I've seen on any car. You get boost by 1600 rpm, but it doesn't seem to drop off like the 951 at high rpm. The engine pulls like a freight train! I"m definately impressed. I can't wait for the aftermarket to start coming out w/mods. We'll see what happens. The block is magnesuim (sp?), so I don't know if that will limit the HP capabilities. Even still, it's a fast car in stock form. I'd put it up against the E46 M3 in acceleration.
Ian
Ian
09-14-2006, 11:37 AM
#4
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Wow, nice write up. Funny how the car must be tuned then to get boost at 1,600 rpm (small turbo like you say) but doesn't have the drop off in the end. Does the car have a boost guage at all? Do you know how much boost it runs?
09-14-2006, 11:46 AM
#5
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If the block is Mag, does this mean it uses cylinder sleeves?
I have been reading the specs on the car. Maybe it's time to get a turbo BMW again? (Had, for a short while, a Alpina 635 Turbo, years ago).
I have been reading the specs on the car. Maybe it's time to get a turbo BMW again? (Had, for a short while, a Alpina 635 Turbo, years ago).
09-14-2006, 12:11 PM
#7
Race Director
From another forum, but might interest some people:
2007 BMW 335i Dynamometer Run
By Jason Cammisa
The 2007 BMW 335i will be in showrooms next month, and is the first application of BMW’s new twin-turbocharged 3.0-liter inline-six. This is a big deal because BMW has had only two short affairs with turbocharged gasoline production cars--the 2002 Turbo in the mid-70s, and the E23 745i in the early 80s--and neither was sold in the U.S. As the saying goes, third time’s the charm.
BMW fit this new engine with two small-displacement turbochargers--instead of one larger unit--in an effort to reduce lag. And for the most part, it worked. Behind the wheel, you’re vaguely aware that this engine doesn’t have quite as crisp a throttle response as its normally-aspirated siblings do. But you don’t care--you’re too busy trying to hold on for dear life.
This is one hell of a motor, pulling smoothly and strongly from idle all the way to its 7000-rpm fuel cutoff. There’s no boost gauge, and since you barely hear the turbos spooling, it’s easy to forget they’re even there. Once you’ve adjusted to the slight lag in power delivery following big, sudden throttle openings, all you notice is the sound of that silky in-line six.
BMW says that this engine makes 300 horsepower and 300 lb-ft of torque. We were so impressed with its power that we couldn’t help wonder if that was a conservative rating. Wasting no time, I swiped the keys and drove to a local dyno shop to find out.
We used a DynoJet chassis dyno, which measures an engine’s power output at a vehicle’s rear wheels. Because of frictional driveline losses, this number is always lower--generally by fifteen to twenty percent--than the quoted power output from the manufacturer, which is measured at the engine itself.
Here’s what we found:
The non-turbocharged 330i, rated by BMW at 255 hp and 220 lb-ft of torque, puts about 200 hp and 180 lb-ft to the rear wheels. That’s roughly a twenty-percent loss. Since they have similar drivelines, you’d expect the 335i to put down 235 hp and 250 lb-ft.
But it didn’t. It put down a whole lot more: 275 hp and 300 lb-ft. A few quick taps on our trusty calculator shows that this engine is likely putting out closer to 350 hp and 360 lb-ft of torque.
Technical editor Don Sherman’s ears perked up at all this number crunching. With all that power, he wondered, is the 335i faster than the outgoing 333-hp E46 M3? We waved goodbye to the shiny new coupe’s rear tires, and sent him to find out.
Don coaxed the 335i to 60 mph in 5.1 seconds--only 0.3 seconds slower than the M3. The 335i covered the quarter-mile in 13.6 seconds @ 104 mph--again, only 0.2 seconds and 1 mph behind the M3.
So in an all-out drag race, the 335i comes close, but can’t quite match the M3’s blistering acceleration. Those numbers, though, only tell half the story. Have a look at the top-gear acceleration figures. In sixth gear, the M3 needs 14.7 seconds to get from 30 to 70 mph – but the 335i does it in only 12.5.
That, my friends, is the beauty of this engine. At full bore, it’s as fast as an M3. But at moderate engine speeds, it’s even faster. What a great way to keep us all interested until the next M3 comes along.
Test - M3 - 335i
0-60 - 4.8 - 5.1
0-100 - 11.5 - 12.7
0-110 - 14.5 - 15.6
0-120 - N/A - 18.6
0-140 - N/A - 28.2
1/4 mile - 13.4@105 - 13.6@104
peak g - 0.7 - 0.68
30-70 (6th) - 14.7 - 12.5
30-70 (3rd) - N/A - 6.5
70-0 - 162 - 150
Peak g - 1.12 - 1.12
Weight - 3480 - 3560
%F/R - 50.6/49.4 - 51.1/48.9
Redline - 8000 - 7000
Power - 333 - 300
Torque - 202 - 300
Tires 255/40 ZR-18 255/35 WR-18
2007 BMW 335i Dynamometer Run
By Jason Cammisa
The 2007 BMW 335i will be in showrooms next month, and is the first application of BMW’s new twin-turbocharged 3.0-liter inline-six. This is a big deal because BMW has had only two short affairs with turbocharged gasoline production cars--the 2002 Turbo in the mid-70s, and the E23 745i in the early 80s--and neither was sold in the U.S. As the saying goes, third time’s the charm.
BMW fit this new engine with two small-displacement turbochargers--instead of one larger unit--in an effort to reduce lag. And for the most part, it worked. Behind the wheel, you’re vaguely aware that this engine doesn’t have quite as crisp a throttle response as its normally-aspirated siblings do. But you don’t care--you’re too busy trying to hold on for dear life.
This is one hell of a motor, pulling smoothly and strongly from idle all the way to its 7000-rpm fuel cutoff. There’s no boost gauge, and since you barely hear the turbos spooling, it’s easy to forget they’re even there. Once you’ve adjusted to the slight lag in power delivery following big, sudden throttle openings, all you notice is the sound of that silky in-line six.
BMW says that this engine makes 300 horsepower and 300 lb-ft of torque. We were so impressed with its power that we couldn’t help wonder if that was a conservative rating. Wasting no time, I swiped the keys and drove to a local dyno shop to find out.
We used a DynoJet chassis dyno, which measures an engine’s power output at a vehicle’s rear wheels. Because of frictional driveline losses, this number is always lower--generally by fifteen to twenty percent--than the quoted power output from the manufacturer, which is measured at the engine itself.
Here’s what we found:
The non-turbocharged 330i, rated by BMW at 255 hp and 220 lb-ft of torque, puts about 200 hp and 180 lb-ft to the rear wheels. That’s roughly a twenty-percent loss. Since they have similar drivelines, you’d expect the 335i to put down 235 hp and 250 lb-ft.
But it didn’t. It put down a whole lot more: 275 hp and 300 lb-ft. A few quick taps on our trusty calculator shows that this engine is likely putting out closer to 350 hp and 360 lb-ft of torque.
Technical editor Don Sherman’s ears perked up at all this number crunching. With all that power, he wondered, is the 335i faster than the outgoing 333-hp E46 M3? We waved goodbye to the shiny new coupe’s rear tires, and sent him to find out.
Don coaxed the 335i to 60 mph in 5.1 seconds--only 0.3 seconds slower than the M3. The 335i covered the quarter-mile in 13.6 seconds @ 104 mph--again, only 0.2 seconds and 1 mph behind the M3.
So in an all-out drag race, the 335i comes close, but can’t quite match the M3’s blistering acceleration. Those numbers, though, only tell half the story. Have a look at the top-gear acceleration figures. In sixth gear, the M3 needs 14.7 seconds to get from 30 to 70 mph – but the 335i does it in only 12.5.
That, my friends, is the beauty of this engine. At full bore, it’s as fast as an M3. But at moderate engine speeds, it’s even faster. What a great way to keep us all interested until the next M3 comes along.
Test - M3 - 335i
0-60 - 4.8 - 5.1
0-100 - 11.5 - 12.7
0-110 - 14.5 - 15.6
0-120 - N/A - 18.6
0-140 - N/A - 28.2
1/4 mile - 13.4@105 - 13.6@104
peak g - 0.7 - 0.68
30-70 (6th) - 14.7 - 12.5
30-70 (3rd) - N/A - 6.5
70-0 - 162 - 150
Peak g - 1.12 - 1.12
Weight - 3480 - 3560
%F/R - 50.6/49.4 - 51.1/48.9
Redline - 8000 - 7000
Power - 333 - 300
Torque - 202 - 300
Tires 255/40 ZR-18 255/35 WR-18
Trending Topics
09-14-2006, 02:46 PM
#9
Originally Posted by 89951DREAMER
Yeah. I'm a tech for our local BMW Center. I rode in one during a pre-delivery inspection. It's quick! I'd bet it would give my 951 a serious run for the money. They are rated about 305hp. I've heard some customers have dyno'd them and found 280RWHP bone stock. That's the same as my 951. The turbos come on so smoothly, you almost can't tell. I haven't been trained on the car yet, but I've heard that the wastegates are spring open. The vacuum signal from a separate reservoir holds them closed. This could make increasing boost w/software difficult. Also the exhaust manifolds are one piece welded to the turbine housings. Just like the SRT4, the aftermarket will have to come up with a manifold. The stock turbos are tiny. The smallest I've seen on any car. You get boost by 1600 rpm, but it doesn't seem to drop off like the 951 at high rpm. The engine pulls like a freight train! I"m definately impressed. I can't wait for the aftermarket to start coming out w/mods. We'll see what happens. The block is magnesuim (sp?), so I don't know if that will limit the HP capabilities. Even still, it's a fast car in stock form. I'd put it up against the E46 M3 in acceleration.
Ian
Ian
Ve have vays of making zem talk.............
09-14-2006, 02:49 PM
#10
Burning Brakes
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Impressive car!
Apparently the turbo will have an aluminium block while the non turbo 325 and 328 will have the magnesium blocks? There's a pretty nice article on it here
I wonder if my dad will wish he didn't buy his 05 M3 now.
Apparently the turbo will have an aluminium block while the non turbo 325 and 328 will have the magnesium blocks? There's a pretty nice article on it here
I wonder if my dad will wish he didn't buy his 05 M3 now.
09-14-2006, 03:29 PM
#11
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I drove one last week. A buddy is the sales manager of the local BMW store and he owns a e46 m3 as well. We went out in the rain in an auto and it was willing to kick the tail out easily without the traction control. My buddy said that it seem marginally slower than his M3, I thought it pulled strong, but it stickered for 51k with all of the options seems pretty expensive for a non M 3 series!
09-14-2006, 03:49 PM
#12
Three Wheelin'
I believe the engine block is a magnesium base with a silocon/aluminum insert for the cylinders and water jacket. BMW has been using this since 2004, and I dont think anything is different about this new engine, but I could be wrong.
