Oddjob

There is a taper to both the inner and outer spring plate bushings, or more correctly the bores of the torsion bar tube and the carrier flanges are tapered.

The weltmeister polygraphite bushings that I tried to use a few years ago were so poorly molded that they were a loose fit on the torsion bar cap and in the torsion bar tube and carrier flange, so Ski, Im sure there was no need for any custom fitting.

At the time, I took some close tolerance measurements and had a local machine shop make me some delrin bushings for the spring plates. They were a very snug fit and I had to take a dremel and grind out the weld spatter in the torsion bar tube, but no other machining necessary.

I also used synthetic wheel bearing grease on the delrin spring plate bushings. I have not heard of delrin degrading from exposure to either synthetic or standard oil/grease (anyone else?). So the only reason that I can think of for not using a lube, is that it will collect dirt and potentially draw sand into the bushings. I would probably worry about that more on a street car that will see a lot of mileage, weather conditions, and road dirt.

I have not seen the Racer's Edge delrin bushings. Karl's products are high quality so I am surprised that his spring plate bushings would require machining to fit (if they are not tapered, it would take a lot of work to get them to fit).

Yes, removing the original rubber off the spring plates is a big pain. I cut as much off with a razor/xacto knife as possible, then used a wire wheel on a bench grinder to take the remaining residue off. Another good reason to stick with the original rubber unless you have a very good reason of going to solid.

Trackin951, if you are still located in Mpls (the picture link in your signature block is definitely not MN), get in touch with me and I can help you out with info, talk you through or help, and probably help you find some of the suspension parts you are looking for from within the local PCA club.

jerome951

Karl designed the delrin bushings oversized on purpose because the castings for the factory parts vary so widely. He will let you know about machining them if you speak with him. He mentioned a brake cylinder hone can be used.

I took the rubber off by using a sharp chisel and making cuts radially around the center (so it looked like a starburst). Then turned the chisel flat against the tube and cut downward. What was remainging came off w/a wire wheel (though it was a mess to clean up all that rubber dust).

Ski

The Weltmeister bushing we had actually fit really snug and even with the grease, Jim said it took some serious work to get it all back together.

Alpine951

I thought I recall Skip at Paragon saying Karl at RE said use some moly. Now I have to double check. Has anyone put stiffer bars in along with reindexing the bars without dropping the assembly and getting it right?

Alpine951

Just called racers edge. They say yes to the moly grease.

ian kam

Well thanks for all the info very helpful so far sounds like a job to do right will take about a week. The zinc plating looks like a great idea. How heavy is the whole piece once out of the car ??

jerome951

I would guess the entire assembly (minus the banana arms and hubs) weighs ~40 lbs (with the end mounts in place and full diameter t-bars).

There is a method for indexing the t-bars before installation in the car. I have a spreadsheet that shows how it is done. I've never used it (I went w/ 10mm bars, so no need to index) so I cannot comment on its ease of use or accuracy. It involves measuring ride height before disassembly, calculating your increase in spring rate and future desired ride height, and calculating the necessary t-bar adjustment.

jc22

Too heavy for me to lift into place by myself. For this job I needed two jacks and 4 jackstands not counting the ones holding the car off the ground.

ehall

So, on a similar topic, how often, in a street only application, do the stock bushings wear out? I ask, because I'm getting ready to remove my t-bars, in addition to new coil overs, and was thinking of going to delrins also. After my tech explained the process, and the cash register in my head went berserk, I would like to maintain the stock bushings. What issues/ problems do the stock bushings have? What kind of service life can be expected? TIA E

jc22

If you're completely removing the tbars you DO NOT want the stock rubber bushings left in there even if they are new.

Secondly, if you're getting that much work done, removing the old bushings and replacing with aftermarket shoudn't add much to the bill as far as labor goes, maybe an hour.

Thirdly, if you are getting that much work done I would really encourage you to replace them now. Take a look at Chuck Moreland's posts linked on this thread to see why. He has pictures of the bushings.

As far as service life goes, is there any original (15 year old) rubber left on your car that is in good shape? I'd say that these spring plate bushings are probably the most protected from the elements, but still......

ian kam

ok i have a bilsten coil over on order so to do this suspension correctly I have also added these items....

Delrin inner and outer bushings (t bars will be removed)
shock upgrade bolts(after having bushing replaced in shock)
Weltmeister bushing torsion tube mount front
weltmeister bushing torsion tube mount rear

front
weltmeister front control arm bushings
updated caster blocks
bushing grease
extras
steering rack delrin bushing
new tie rod assembly(clean up steering)

Soon weltmeister racing lightweight swaybars front and back.

please let me know if I have over looked anything....
always nice to have all the parts needed before ripping somthing apart.

jc22

How are your ball joints? Upper strut mounts? I just replaced the whole suspension on my car and I replaced everything on your list plus the two I mentioned here.

ian kam

jc22 how does it hanndle now ? I'm going with camber plates will i need new upper strut mounts ?

ehall

Thanks for the Chuck Moreland lead. I had forgotten about Elephant Racing. I'm going to bite the bullet on those polybronze bushings for the spring plates. After all, this isn't an area that you can handle a failure, nor is it an area that will need any further thought for a long time to come with new bearings. Thanks.

J Chen

If I had known about Elephant Racing I would have
gone to the Polybronze bushing as well