This may have been mentioned, but I hope John's shotgun videographer keeps the camera rolling when the state police chopper is circling overhead and they're putting cuffs on him. Now THAT'S a video I'd like to see.

Street racing is simply dangerous (especially the speeds John achieves) and unnecessary, not to mention it was sorta stupid for posting the videos on a public formum if he ever is caught. I would imagine the DA would have a field day with all of this evidence.

I'm likely an old fart compared to others on this forum (Kevin can vouch for my lack of hair, but hey, I started thinning early). Wisdom is something that is supposed to be passed on to others. Yes, many of us (including me) have traveled at dangerous speeds on the street. Luckily we lived (and stayed out of prison for killing someone else) to tell others about the dangers. To me, there's just too much risk involved for simply bragging rights. Heck, if you only want to win bragging rights, there are far safer (and legal) ways of proving who's car is faster.

Just my $0.02, which was worth something when I was younger (damned inflation).

 

Make the board look any worse than THIS moron does? Impossible!

 

I think (hope) that was sarcasm, from an obvious AMAF imposter.

 

Jeremy, I appreciate your comments and honesty.

I wish I could tell you why street racing rubs me so wrong - truthfully, I do not have a sob story about losing a loved one or seeing a violent accident due to street racing. Perhaps it is the cocky attitude many street racers exhibit, or the false sense of safety I always see when folks post their stories ("We took every precaution - it was safe - no one else was around...) Perhaps it is because I've read about way too many news reports where street racing ended in bad accidents. Regardless, street racing is my biggest car-related pet-peeve. Perhaps I over-react when people post about it. Hey - we all get mad over something that bothers us now and again, right?

Regarding "Pizza runs," I've had my share of those as well - some good, some bad. Once I saw a Supra turbo come within inches of rolling down a cliff during a 'road rally.' Getting together for a jaunt up the mountain roads can be down properly or can be full of trouble - I've seen both. The problem happens when egos start up on these types of rallies, and folks have to prove who is the best with the "mad driving skillz, yo."

When "pizza runs" get out of hand, typically, they turn into mini-street races - folks in the group try to out do each other, which is just what street racing is all about.

While I don't condone 'test runs' of new equipment, I think they are a bit safer than street racing. Where there are two or more egos involved, the risk of danger increases exponentially. When testing equipment in a car by yourself there is no one else out there to 'beat.' The pursuit of winning a street race causes folks to loose common sense and judgement.

True - I probably push the limits of my own car more than I should on the streets. (You should see how I take exit ramps! ) but as a track junkie, I still won't push the limits of my car on the street as much as I do on the track. Why? Quite simply there are more safety nets available for me on the track than on the street. Run off areas, flaggers, safety gear (helmets, harnesses, rollbars, fire extinguishers) other drivers who can anticipate my driving, an ambulance seconds away - all of this disappears on the street: there is less room for error, and greater unknowns when street racing. While track speeds may be greater, and folks typically push their cars more on the track than on the street, the odds of survival are far greater.

Regarding my involvement with my church group - I stopped being a high school counselor for now - (Instead, I'm a closet street racer! j/k). That's just for the time being. Regarding sainthood - thanks for the vote, but I am not looking for anything like that! I try to live my life according to the Book, and that's it.

For the record, there was one time in my life that I actually did street race. Once. (SHOCK!) Years ago, my friend let me drive his 944 n/a and he told me to race against a VW Scirroco. I think we went up to about 70mph before he left me in the dust. I guess it didn't do anything for me, or I figured it wasn't worth it. I have had fun on country back roads with more than one car, and gone faster than the speed limit. I have driven too fast many times. I still drive too fast today.

Am I being hypocritical? I dunno. Go ahead and judge me if ya want. Doesn't matter. I still believe that if we line up all the 'bad' things that can be done with a car, street racing is still the most dangerous.

So, that's my view - I've been open and honest here. I know I've offended many with my 'rants on my soapbox' about street racing. I offer no apologies. I feel it is wrong, especially when there are growing opportunities for us to play with our cars in safe and controlled environments. Maybe my 'in your face' attitude turns some people off. But if my voice can prevent some folks from street racing, then I'd say it's worth it.

Thanks for reading,
-Z-man.

Edit
PS: Too bad that John (Porschh951) can't read this thead (Since I'm on his BAN list, I don't think he can read this entire thread!). IF he were man enough, he would unban Tifosi and I and contribute to this thread. So to all the fans of Porschh951 - tell him to stand up and post here. Thanks.

 

Getting caught up in the heat of the moment on the street with the girlfriend , testing or running into that Mustang is one thing , but going out and activly looking for and setting up to videotape street races is another.

 

Z-man, I can respect and appreciate that. There’s nothing wrong with it. I believe we’re all a bit hypocritical to a certain degree (some more then others). “We” drive “spirited” based upon what “we” believe our skills can tolerate. I too drive all out on the track but I will say some of my street testing would be considered (at least by the AZ judicial system) as dangerous and inappropriate. In the wild west, our legislation has determined that 20 over the speed limit is dangerous enough to get you in the bullpen and trip digits gets you in real deep ****. Maybe I shouldn’t have mentioned your faith in my post as you did not reference it in yours. I guess in the past I just recall it being a part of these threads so I apologize for that.

Street racing sure isn’t what it used to be. I remember when a couple hundred people in the desert for 6 or 8 hours wasn’t a real big deal. I remember 15 years ago sitting in Hunt’s Point markets on a Saturday while the NYPD watched large crowds of street racers without interjection. If it got out of hand, they called the FD to hose down the streets. Street racing has been part of our culture for a long time. It wasn’t until the last fifteen years or so that it transformed from being a politically incorrect hooligan activity to becoming a “boy scout” killing criminal sort of thing. I always find it amusing when people have more emotional attachment to street racing then they do to armed robbery and rape. I don’t know what it is about Honda’s and fart cans that really **** people off (actually I do).

What I will say is that while no one here agrees that street racing is smart, wise, or honorable………… there are at least 10 threads on this board every day that are clear examples of non-socially acceptable driving and no one says a word. John however, farts wrong and 50 people climb up his *** and kick footballs (even though he tends to bring it on himself sometimes). It just doesn’t seem right when someone is picked on because he is young, or is not a tuner.

 

http://www.sptimes.com/2003/04/24/Ta...hurt_rac.shtml

Enough said.

 

John's got the right to say what he wants, just like I (we, who disagree) have the right to bad mouth it. We/He also have the right to ignore what people say. But, and I could be wrong, shouldn't it be John D. who decides whether the street racing should be posted?

I, along with other people, have apparently gotten involved in this issue (some of us many times in the past) and are putting pressure on a handful of people on this board. One in particular. I'm not sure the intent is to point blame at one person (John) or to discuss our opinions.

 

IMHO theres a time and a place for "spirited driving". Yes I push my car on the street, but the roads I do that on are out in the middle of nowhere (HOURS from cities). No, I dont line up at traffic lights to drag race, I DESPISE people that do that, they are the reason my insurance rates are jacked in my area. Yes I gun it for the S Curve thats on my commute to/from work. No I dont highway pull every car I see, only one I have ever ""raced"" was my buddy in his MR2 Turbo, as he was tuning it. Yes I take entrance/exit ramps fast. No, I dont sit in parking lots and do donuts, etc etc. Yes, my car is modified to go faster. Could I be considered a "street racer"? Yeah, prolly. Am I? No, because who the hell am I racing if im hammering through a corner all by my lonesome?

To me "street racing" goes hand in hand with the Fast and the Furious type crowd, the ones whose cars arent at all good for the driving style most here prefer. I dont speed in downtown Vancouver, or go zipping around parking lots, or weave in and out of traffic, tailgate, cut people off, etc. But I dont park my *** in the far right lane and do 55 or 60MPH either.

Do I think what Big John does is 100% kosher, correct, blah blah blah? No I cant say I think that, but he is at least doing it in a somewhat proper place, with no traffic around and for that I give him a thumbs up. Nor do I feel the need to flame him about it. If hes going to do it, hes going to do it and certainly isnt going to give a **** about what some guy in Canada thinks. The only thing that will change is who gets to see his movies, as has already happened. I definatly enjoy watching his movies, because it shows what a 951 can do in that situation, just like watching track videos shows what a 951 can do there.

Are news articles about some dumbasses going to change my opinion? Obviously not, because I dont think ""street racing"" is good/correct/etc. Are those articles going to do anything to change my driving style? Hell no, because there are always a few glaring points in those articles... Young kids, crappy cars not meant to go fast (Crapalier), a PACK of kids (ie passengers), and pure retardation, like driving fast in the rain. None of those describe me, and I doubt they describe many people here.

Summary, "street racing" is too broad and silly a term (its a freaking media soundbite phrase that is somehow used to describe anything, like the retarded media companies do) to have a proper argument about it. Before the poll becomes useful, better terms MUST be described, because the media and other such groups will label almost everyone here a "street racer", simply because we drive fast or have meets. Few here are real street racers, IMHO not even Big John is. Seems to me he knows what hes doing behind that leather wrapped wheel of his, which is something few real street racers know. Till the media catchphrase-ism issue is cleared up, IMHO this poll is useless. Nothing against anyone at all, there are vaild points all around in this thread.

 

what a biased poll.

wheres the option where you generally disagree with street racing and don't neccessarily go out to organized street races but you will give it go if a (insert car brand here) wants some?

because MOST of us are guilty of that.

I refuse to vote in a biased poll.

 

Like I said in the other thread I have to say that I have speed before. I don't go 120 mph during the middle of the day on I-255. I usually go about 60-80 mph on the highway. I also don't see a problem with street racing if it is done in the right place at the right time. Now when people are street racing in the middle of the day and don't know how to drive and lose control I don't feel sorry for them. I am talking about the kids who turn 16 get their license and go out that night and race their Grand Prix against a Sunbird and get into a huge accident. That is just plain dumb. Speeding in excess of 20 over the speed limit is almost not neccessary and most of the time stupid. I love how everyone talks about pushing the limits on backroads but when someone is bashed for going 40 in 30 mph zone they are change their story and say oh that was stupid to do. Is it any different then pushing your car hard on the backroads. I think NOT. Also what is the point of modding a car/motorcycle if you can't have fun on the street. Like I said there is a time and place for doing that stuff. During rush hour is not one of them. That is my opinion.

 

I don't exactly aprove of street racing i just approve it when your sitting at a light and a honda civic with a 50 pound body kit, drag spoiler, and a 5 and a half inch exsaust tip says his car will smoke yours...

I do injoy the videos very much so but I would rather see racing done on a track or autocross course consitering I just did a school project of why racing should be kept on the track and not the streets hahaha...

-Ian

 

So street racing is wrong? and it's prohibited to display street racing videos on rennlist? I post all the time on streetracing.com and I have no hasless there. All my homies with SICK civic's and supras hang in there, you guys need to take a chill pill. I race all the time in the streets up to 240mph and I see northing wrong with that. As a matter of fact iam planning to add dual superchargers to my car my goal is 1000rwhp and with these superchargers i'll be able to acomplish my goal.

http://cgi.earthlink.ebay.com/ebaymo...e=STRK:MEWA:IT

 

No, Man...

Those are the ones you just laugh at and let drive away....they are not worth your time or energy, or your clutch (edit: or your license, or your car, or your LIFE), just like 99% of street racing scenarios.

Seriously though, how many times does this same thread have to be posted, with the same contributors all saying the same things they always do? Isn't it clear by now that your opinion on a controversial subject like this isn't likely to have ANY affect on another's opinion?

Z-Man - You mention impessionable youth...
Do you actually think some impressionable youth about to engage in some street racing will think "Oh wait, that guy Z-Man from Rennlist says this is stupid, I better not do it" ?? If so, you are kidding yourself.

I'm not disagreeing, I do think that the Fast and Furious need to be off the streets. I also think that some racing can be done on empty roads with a reasonable amount of safety.

I also would like to see one shred of legal precedent that could possibly indicate potential consequences to Rennlist if John (porschh951) was taken to court for the illegal actions portrayed in his videos that have subsequently been posted here.

Edit: Turbo X, do a school project on spelling next time, it will add something to your credibility.

 

Ok, you got me going now…

My main problem with street racing is that is usually in a straight line. Wussie drivin’! A true test of how hard you can push the gas pedal down, man am I impressed. Skill my butt. ‘Street Racers’ call winning a straight line acceleration test a ‘kill’….

In my opinion, however biased it is, the skill involved in street racing is minimal. Please don’t even come close to thinking of yourself as a skilled driver if you out accelerate some pimped out rice burner, given the right car my grand mother can do that too. oooh, the skill involved is mind boggling.

Chris White