Steve Cooper

I've been researching the used 951 market the last few nights and noticed that there seem to be a lot of cars for sale, and the only ones that seem to be closing are those priced at numbers far below what I would have expected. The strongest evidence for this seems to be previously ended auctions on eBay with 951s selling routinely for short change, unless the car has very low miles. Mods don't seem to be helping the matter.

Auto trader has a number of 951s listed for decent coin, but I doubt they have been moving. Here in the Rennlist classifieds, there seem to be expensive (wishful thinking perhaps) examples for sale with a few exceptions. But they've been listed for a mighty long time.

I've always discounted Andersen's Excellence market reports but am now wondering if he's right and the market is correcting to his his posted numbers.

Reason for the research? I may need to sell my 951, regretfully, to pick-up a better long distance commuter.

Anyway, I'd love any insights form sellers/buyers, and would love any advice on selling my car. I'd also like to hear guesstimates of what the car is worth.

I have a hunch that I should return it back to stock and sell the Guru kit. I don't have the stock suspension, shocks were junk, so that'll need to stay as is.

Cheers,

Cooper

Darius Juca

Depends on how the car looks..original paint,interiour..etc...and who is looking....

Steve Cooper

That's fairly obvious stuff, even so, thanks for the input.

The state of the market is what I'm "really" intrigued to hear opinions about.

Cheers,

Cooper

richbob

I've been looking all over, semi-seriously, for a nice 951, for about 5 months, and here are a few observations I have on the market. Probably most are fairly obvious, but WTF, take them for what their worth:

1. 1986 951s are, by far, the most plentiful, and rarely go for over $8K. In fact, that seems to be the magic number - anything over $8K, and you're probably talking a VLM car - Very Low Miles.

2. Unless its a VLM, mods seem to increase the value, though nowhere near what the mods cost. Just look at what Carter got for his heavily-modified 'Beast'.

3. Leaks are a killer - any mention, and you can forget the $8K.

4. The more pictures with the ad, the better: its irritating to have to ask for more pictures.

5. Its even more irritating when the owner doesn't respond to inquiries. If you're serious about selling, be serious about responding to any inquiries.

6. eBay seems to be the best indicator of where the market is. As they say, something is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

Steve Cooper

Excellent input! Thanks!

1. I agree on the price you've mentioned. That 8k figure caught me by surprise. I had an expectation of seeing the average baseline selling numbers closer to 10. eBay seemed to be the best indicator of what cars were actually "selling" for.

2. Carter and his "beast"? I'll have to do a search on that, I've been off-board for a while now with a few game industry trade shows.

3. Leaks?- I assume you're talking fluids rather than the pictures of me playing guard and prisoner with my wife

4. I'm a believer in lots of pictures as well. Out of curiousity, would you personally navigate to a website link in an ad to view more pictures if it was a car that interested you, or would you only want to see images in the actual ad?

5. Good advice. Got it.

6. The bottomline if ever there was one... I get the feeling it's a buyer's market these days.

Thanks again.

Cheers,

Cooper

richbob

Thanks. About the pictures - a link to a lot of pictures is just fine. And, yes, oil leaks; but I love the "guard and prisoner" comment!

Steve Cooper

So if I showed you those G&P pictures would you buy my car?

jyoon

i've been looking to purchase one also for a few months now. i also see the people trying to sell 86's and such for 15k. also see turbo s for 25k. imho those prices seem way high. i wouldn't think many get sold in that price range. also, as easy at it is to roll the miles back, i'm more interested in the condition and maintenance of the car, the mileage alone, isn't gonna convince me. most in my area seem to be listed between 6-8k. i don't think i'd pay more than 7500 or so for an 86 or 87 in good condition.

jyoon

oh yeah, and i love the adds that go into such great detail on the car. "86 red/blk, runs great, very fast 7000 obo." those adds are annoying.

Steve Cooper

Interesting point- It seems to me that if you're doing pre-purchase research on a 951 in a place like eBay or AutoTrader, you know about the 951 and you know you want a 951. You know as well that hearing about how it runs is taken with a grain of salt. Out of curiosity, if the seller doesn't say "it runs good" do you then think that it doesn't run right?

On the feature side you likely know it's a 4 cylinder, front engined, water cooled, turbocharged car, with x, y and z standard features and if you've done your homework you know about basic problems like timing belts or motor mounts. So it seems like taking a lowest common denominator approach to describing the car would be annoying. Other cars may need that history lesson, but I think that a potentail 951 buyer knows what the car is.

I saw a lot of ads that sounded like they were selling the 951 versus a RX7 versus a fill in the blank. There was a lot of copy that went on and on about how much they loved the car, found pleasure in the car, hated to let it go, enjoyed it more than any other other car, lots of hyperboles. Are those useful to read? IMHO, I'd think they'd indicate the seller is a bit of a ****** and that a buyer could be snowed or manipulated by the lover dumping the loved.

That said, I love my car and I'd hate to let it go

Joe Jackson

The problem with selling a car on Ebay is that you've only got that short auction period to sell your car (unless you run a reserve) and you have to hope the right buyer is watching. Plus, most people on Ebay are looking for deals so again you can't expect top dollar (or even medium dollar) for your car. One more thing, so many people have been screwed buying cars on Ebay that they budget that into the price (along with shipping the car or picking it up). If you have to take a few days off and fly to go pick up your car, is your price really $7k? No, it's more like $8k by the time it rolls into your driveway.

With that said, summer is a much better time than winter to sell a car so go for it now if you want it to move.

Brett951

Another indicator of market value is the insurance industry, since they have to pay attention to that stuff, so I'll offer the following data point:
I wrecked my '87 951 3 months ago. 162K miles, pretty much stock but with almost new tires on perfect 993 wheels, MP3 capable stereo, interior 9.5/10 (small crack on dash - near perfect other then that, even the center console hinges were intact), exterior 8.5/10 (mostly small rock chips, one large one that would have taken a sivler dollar to cover and scratch in the windshield - no dents). Car had never been raced, all adult drivers (I believe I was 3rd or 4th), ran perfect. They gave me just over $9K for it.
I'm now kinda looking for a replacement.
The wreck left me feeling really stupid and that I didn't deserve a 951 anymore, and I couldn't find one local to buy at all. So I ended up getting a Celica to commute in. With gas prices and the fact that I drive almost 90 miles a day, it might still be for the best, but I REALLY miss the Porsche...

NZ951

I guess you can take the and counting off the sig now... (sorry bad joke)

I would miss the Porsche going to a Celica also! Though you have a point about fuel prices. I am looking at a scooter to commute around in... though it is a special one.

FlyingPig

Cars get wrecked, **** happens. don't deny yourself the awesomeness of a 951 because of that!

Brett951

Scooter - I've been looking at Honda ST1300s - 0-60 in 3.69 sec, 1/4 m in 11.57... gas mileage even better then the Celica, and perfomance better then the Porsche 'course its a lot different. I think I'm over my "I'm a stupid *ss for wrecking the Porsche" and am thinking about getting another 951 (so Steve, I think I'm #3 on this thread who is looking to buy). The wife thinks I will kill myself on the bike...