Anybody going 944 spec racing? I am!
01-01-2003, 12:36 PM
#16
Racer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 385
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
M758, I'm entertaining thoughts of making some Phoenix races this spring. I'd like to see how you SPEC 944 guys do things. The dates can't conflict with my racing commitments to Anderson Motorworks. Jan is too soon. The car will be prepared to POC specs because that's our home series. Probably GP class. What's your name? Take care, TC
01-01-2003, 12:49 PM
#17
Racer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 385
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Paul, I'm not sure how the SPEC 944 cars would fall under the POC rules yet. I'm thinking the simplest way to gather up the most 944's quickly is probably going to be the G Production class. You can go to the POC site and bounce their rules for GP against the SPEC-944 rules. I'll do the same. Hope to meet you soon, TC
01-01-2003, 02:58 PM
#18
Race Director
Well any competitive 944-Spec car will be minus interior. There is no other way to get the weight down to 2600 lbs with driver. I think that losing the 300 lbs and lack of interior would take you out of a production or improved class. I think my car would be V5 car based on POC rules if I ran with them.
You also have a PM
You also have a PM
01-02-2003, 11:28 PM
#19
Racer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 385
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
POC rules state: 83-87 944 production class weight is 2633lbs. Drivers are not figured into the equation. Removal of interior knocks you from production into V classes. Eventually, I'd like to strip the interiors and require cages, but we can't do that until we get enough cars to justify our own class rules, or everyone agrees to go up a class. TC
01-03-2003, 08:25 AM
#20
Track Day
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tim
I Started the Spec-944 about 4 years ago with my 84 944 which I ran in SCCA in the regional class of RS. After racing it for two years without any problems it was time to develop a spec class with the 944s. I worked with Projects Racing and Vic Rice in the late 80's and early 90's with their ITS 944 when I was with Bridgestone Motorsports.
If you need any support in getting a real race program together let me know. Check out the official web site for <a href="http://www.Spec-944.com" target="_blank">www.Spec-944.com</a>
I also started the other 944 site in the valley but am not affiliated with it's host.
Best to you,
Joe Stubblefield
I Started the Spec-944 about 4 years ago with my 84 944 which I ran in SCCA in the regional class of RS. After racing it for two years without any problems it was time to develop a spec class with the 944s. I worked with Projects Racing and Vic Rice in the late 80's and early 90's with their ITS 944 when I was with Bridgestone Motorsports.
If you need any support in getting a real race program together let me know. Check out the official web site for <a href="http://www.Spec-944.com" target="_blank">www.Spec-944.com</a>
I also started the other 944 site in the valley but am not affiliated with it's host.
Best to you,
Joe Stubblefield
01-05-2003, 02:48 PM
#21
Racer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 385
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hey Guys, Hope your year's started off well! After researching all 3 spec group's rules,
1. 944 Cup on the East Coast.
2. 944-spec,Phoenix.
3. Spec-944, also in the Phoenix area.
it looks like the 944's in our group out here will conform to and run in the V5/R7 (class/race group), but will be prepared to the rules of the 2 Phoenix groups. It is my intention to make crossover between the 2 Phoenix groups and our group as easy as possible so that,together, we can present the biggest field of cars possible(more fun, bigger show!). At the same time, we have to conform to some class in the POC rules. It looks like V5 fits the best. The 944's will be more like POC Production class cars, but the removal of the interior bumps them into the V classes. So while we may not be competitive in that class with other cars, it doesn't matter because we're racing against each other's 944's only. Some things undecided as of yet are the allowable compression ratio and the tire size. I want the cars to run on pump gas, but I also want to allow the higher HP 1988 944's in. We'll see what the consensus of owners/drivers out here is. TC
Cheaters will be banned for life! <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[nono]" />
FORMULA 944
Driving.....for the love of it!
1. 944 Cup on the East Coast.
2. 944-spec,Phoenix.
3. Spec-944, also in the Phoenix area.
it looks like the 944's in our group out here will conform to and run in the V5/R7 (class/race group), but will be prepared to the rules of the 2 Phoenix groups. It is my intention to make crossover between the 2 Phoenix groups and our group as easy as possible so that,together, we can present the biggest field of cars possible(more fun, bigger show!). At the same time, we have to conform to some class in the POC rules. It looks like V5 fits the best. The 944's will be more like POC Production class cars, but the removal of the interior bumps them into the V classes. So while we may not be competitive in that class with other cars, it doesn't matter because we're racing against each other's 944's only. Some things undecided as of yet are the allowable compression ratio and the tire size. I want the cars to run on pump gas, but I also want to allow the higher HP 1988 944's in. We'll see what the consensus of owners/drivers out here is. TC
Cheaters will be banned for life! <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[nono]" />
FORMULA 944
Driving.....for the love of it!
01-05-2003, 03:40 PM
#22
Burning Brakes
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: San Diego
Posts: 1,084
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
[quote]Originally posted by Tim Comeau:
[QB]
Cheaters will be banned for life! <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[nono]" />
QB]<hr></blockquote>
he he he he he
[QB]
Cheaters will be banned for life! <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[nono]" />
QB]<hr></blockquote>
he he he he he
01-06-2003, 03:06 AM
#24
Racer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 385
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sorry for not having all this info memorized accurately YET, but I believe the later 944's (87-88?)have a higher compression ratio. 10.2 to 1 versus the older 944's with 9.7 to 1. That gives them 158hp vs 143hp in the older cars. 15hp! If we go 11.1 to 1 for everybody, like the one Phoenix group, can we still run 92 pump gas?
01-06-2003, 12:02 PM
#26
Race Director
Tim,
Glad to hear you guys are planning on going with cleaned out light weight car rule set rather than heavy weight Stock Class rule sets. This really makes the cars fun to drive.
Personally I like the 944-spec rule set. It is simple clear and really keeps the cars pretty equal.
Wheels & Tires..
225/50 R15 Proably the perfect tire size for these cars.
15x7 Cookie Cutter or Phone Dials. Why they are cheap and plentyfull. Fuchs are nicer, but really pricey. Better to sell a set of 15x7 and 15x8 fuchs and by 3 sets of the PD or CC.
Keeping costs down will make it much more fun
As for tire type. The Toyos are actually quite nice. I had run Kumhos for a while they were good and cheap (cheaper than Hoosiers) and was skeptical about the Toyos. After 5 race days I really like them. This sunday beat the SNOT out of them and it looks like I can get AT LEAST one more Race day from them and still be fast. My Kumho would have been corded or gone away long ago.
Sure the Hoosiers are better, but they are not really in the spirt of low cost.
As for motors...
Euro cars came with 10.6:1 CR with flat top pistons
US 83-87 Cars came with 9.5:1 CR with dished pistons
All 88 Cars came with 10.2:1 CR with less dish on the piston as compared to 83-87 pistons.
I believe there are only minor block differences between the blocks
For some reason the 88 motors take well to chipping with a large HP gain. This is why the 944-spec rules do not allow chips in these cars.
I can only guess that 83-87 block with 88 pistons will also take well to chipping.
11:1 CR was allowed to ensure that if some one warped a head it could flatened to reused rather than replaced. Talk to John Anderson, but I believe that with 83-87 US pistons 11:1 at the limit of safe shaving of a head.
And yes John is right 11:1 CR cars need only PUMP gas 91 or 92.
I belive 88 motors can run with the 83-87 cars if they don't have chips.
BTW.. My rebuilt motor made 131.7 HP and 135.0ft-lbs on the dyno Thursday. This is right in line with the other 944-spec legal motors.
<img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />
Glad to hear you guys are planning on going with cleaned out light weight car rule set rather than heavy weight Stock Class rule sets. This really makes the cars fun to drive.
Personally I like the 944-spec rule set. It is simple clear and really keeps the cars pretty equal.
Wheels & Tires..
225/50 R15 Proably the perfect tire size for these cars.
15x7 Cookie Cutter or Phone Dials. Why they are cheap and plentyfull. Fuchs are nicer, but really pricey. Better to sell a set of 15x7 and 15x8 fuchs and by 3 sets of the PD or CC.
Keeping costs down will make it much more fun
As for tire type. The Toyos are actually quite nice. I had run Kumhos for a while they were good and cheap (cheaper than Hoosiers) and was skeptical about the Toyos. After 5 race days I really like them. This sunday beat the SNOT out of them and it looks like I can get AT LEAST one more Race day from them and still be fast. My Kumho would have been corded or gone away long ago.
Sure the Hoosiers are better, but they are not really in the spirt of low cost.
As for motors...
Euro cars came with 10.6:1 CR with flat top pistons
US 83-87 Cars came with 9.5:1 CR with dished pistons
All 88 Cars came with 10.2:1 CR with less dish on the piston as compared to 83-87 pistons.
I believe there are only minor block differences between the blocks
For some reason the 88 motors take well to chipping with a large HP gain. This is why the 944-spec rules do not allow chips in these cars.
I can only guess that 83-87 block with 88 pistons will also take well to chipping.
11:1 CR was allowed to ensure that if some one warped a head it could flatened to reused rather than replaced. Talk to John Anderson, but I believe that with 83-87 US pistons 11:1 at the limit of safe shaving of a head.
And yes John is right 11:1 CR cars need only PUMP gas 91 or 92.
I belive 88 motors can run with the 83-87 cars if they don't have chips.
BTW.. My rebuilt motor made 131.7 HP and 135.0ft-lbs on the dyno Thursday. This is right in line with the other 944-spec legal motors.
<img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />
01-07-2003, 01:33 AM
#27
Racer
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 457
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My roomate and I just decided this evening that we are going to spec race a 944... and we have one... and it needs TONS of work just to drive (i.e. no motor, no heads, suspension is shot, needs bad body work, windows are busted, etc.) But we're in, anyway... when, is another question.
I am pretty damn inexperienced, and my roomate has never done ANY performance driving, so we're going to try and get the car built by summer, then we're going to just work on getting our licenses (2 races with TCRA and I'm good to go - if I don't hit anyone <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> ).
But, we'll be driving with TCRA, POC, NASA, and PCA (sometimes), so we'll be out there with our car... just look for the orange 944 with the white Atari logo on the hood that's bringing up the rear (until we learn how to drive... then its on!)
I am pretty damn inexperienced, and my roomate has never done ANY performance driving, so we're going to try and get the car built by summer, then we're going to just work on getting our licenses (2 races with TCRA and I'm good to go - if I don't hit anyone <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> ).
But, we'll be driving with TCRA, POC, NASA, and PCA (sometimes), so we'll be out there with our car... just look for the orange 944 with the white Atari logo on the hood that's bringing up the rear (until we learn how to drive... then its on!)
01-07-2003, 10:41 AM
#28
Race Director
rcldesign,
Welcome <img border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" title="" src="graemlins/bigok.gif" />
When you get the car built just remember to get as much seat time as you can. Be that DE/Open track or autocross. Don't discount the value of Autocross in teaching car control. You can learn quite a lot of this at 40 mph when an error just means knocked over cones. I think the San Deigeo PCA has frequent Autocrosses at Qualcomm.
<img border="0" alt="[bigbye]" title="" src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" />
Welcome <img border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" title="" src="graemlins/bigok.gif" />
When you get the car built just remember to get as much seat time as you can. Be that DE/Open track or autocross. Don't discount the value of Autocross in teaching car control. You can learn quite a lot of this at 40 mph when an error just means knocked over cones. I think the San Deigeo PCA has frequent Autocrosses at Qualcomm.
<img border="0" alt="[bigbye]" title="" src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" />
01-07-2003, 07:05 PM
#29
Racer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 385
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RLCDESIGN, (Chris?) I would like to offer the suggestion that you find a chassis in better condition so that you don't have to spend all your weekends from now till Summer getting the poor car running, let alone ready to run hard. There are cars here in San Diego that are running, rolling and cheap. Get one of those and paint it orange. I'd love to have an orange car in our group. Email me and I'll turn you on to 2 cars. One is a stock 944 for $2500.00(with sellable extras), the other is a 924S which is nearly 100% prepped for $6000.00(with extras). You might get either one for less money. Oh, and keep the exhaust stock/quiet so that you can run with the local PCA at the stadium. As suggested already, that's great seat time. Email me. timcomeau@***.net Let's go racing!
01-07-2003, 09:37 PM
#30
Racer
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 457
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tim... thanks for the offer, but the car isn't as bad as perhaps I said it was. I just need to replace a fender and header panel and (maybe) one window pane. I have a motor to put in it with head and all that stuff... besides, I have my roomate to share the workload...
Oh, and Atari informed me today that they will sue me if I try and use their logo since they have some contract with NASCAR... so I suggested making ourselves number 76 and just putting that on the side of the car in blue with a circle (i.e. a 76 gasoline logo), but my partner really didn't like that idea... so now we've decided that we will definately be orange with white interior... now we just need to think of a gimmik to make the absurdly bright orange even more cool... and we start stripping the chasis down this week! I'm so excited already.
Oh, and Atari informed me today that they will sue me if I try and use their logo since they have some contract with NASCAR... so I suggested making ourselves number 76 and just putting that on the side of the car in blue with a circle (i.e. a 76 gasoline logo), but my partner really didn't like that idea... so now we've decided that we will definately be orange with white interior... now we just need to think of a gimmik to make the absurdly bright orange even more cool... and we start stripping the chasis down this week! I'm so excited already.