Frankly they all look like crap since the 964 anyway
Impressions: GTS Owner Drives a 991S
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From: Manhattan Beach & Truckee, CA
Vern: See the issue is just that you seem to think that it is some how impossible for guys to like their GTS better then the new 991 and have honest opinions as to why.
We are not "whining" but having open discourse on a Porsche forum where I thought these discussions where supposed to take place.
It seems that Lewis here actually drove the 991 and opted for the GTS. How do you explain him?
I think the symposer is an interesting idea but I think the reason most find it too artifical is that while a Tubi, PSE, Fabspeed add sound, it is external sound that the car is actually emitting to the world for all to hear and enjoy. The symposer merely pipe intake sound into the cabin to add sound for the passengers having nothing to do with the sound the car is actually emitting to the word. Its a small but signficant distinction. The symposer doesn't bother me at all as I think the exhuast sound the 991 makes is great at the pipes where it counts. I do have other criticisms however. Yesterday a Panamera was behind me and I couldn't help but notice the stricking similarity of the front to the 991. My son noticed it too.
Just say'n.
We are not "whining" but having open discourse on a Porsche forum where I thought these discussions where supposed to take place.
It seems that Lewis here actually drove the 991 and opted for the GTS. How do you explain him?
I think the symposer is an interesting idea but I think the reason most find it too artifical is that while a Tubi, PSE, Fabspeed add sound, it is external sound that the car is actually emitting to the world for all to hear and enjoy. The symposer merely pipe intake sound into the cabin to add sound for the passengers having nothing to do with the sound the car is actually emitting to the word. Its a small but signficant distinction. The symposer doesn't bother me at all as I think the exhuast sound the 991 makes is great at the pipes where it counts. I do have other criticisms however. Yesterday a Panamera was behind me and I couldn't help but notice the stricking similarity of the front to the 991. My son noticed it too.
Just say'n.
Like it, don't like it but some of these posts are like saying the new Boxster looks like an MR2 or the Ferrari 550 looks like a Celica. Not something I'd expect on this board.
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From: Florida
*sigh*
First of all I have no problem with open discourse and I have no problem with people liking their GTS. I like my cars too and this forum is a great resource. Its the 3 threads a day and 50 pages that has already been dedicated to this topic that becomes a little over bearing and reaks of desperation (just a little admit it). What oil is best?? Even that thread is better as there can be some objectivity to it. We get it, you like your GTS but the same guys saying the same thing over and over is tiresome. Guess its my own fault for reading them. There its all my fault
Second, defensivenss? I dont even know what that is supposed to mean in context of this thread. That I cant buy one? That I wont buy one? That I hate my mother?
Third, someone kept calling me relentless. Relentless refers to my first point. Pages and pages and thread after thread of the same stuff
Fourth, the personal insults about my intelligence etc? I stand by my first comment on that
And fifth, Sandwedge didnt even get what i thought was a pretty obvious joke on the original guys joke. Thats just hopeless...
I will try to not read anymore threads titled "How i learned to love my GTS even though I could afford a 991" and not make fun of you guys any more as it seems to upset many of you
Long live the GTS, last of the classic Porsches (****e I just couldnt help myself). Laugh at yourselves a little bit fellas, you might like it
First of all I have no problem with open discourse and I have no problem with people liking their GTS. I like my cars too and this forum is a great resource. Its the 3 threads a day and 50 pages that has already been dedicated to this topic that becomes a little over bearing and reaks of desperation (just a little admit it). What oil is best?? Even that thread is better as there can be some objectivity to it. We get it, you like your GTS but the same guys saying the same thing over and over is tiresome. Guess its my own fault for reading them. There its all my fault
Second, defensivenss? I dont even know what that is supposed to mean in context of this thread. That I cant buy one? That I wont buy one? That I hate my mother?
Third, someone kept calling me relentless. Relentless refers to my first point. Pages and pages and thread after thread of the same stuff
Fourth, the personal insults about my intelligence etc? I stand by my first comment on that
And fifth, Sandwedge didnt even get what i thought was a pretty obvious joke on the original guys joke. Thats just hopeless...
I will try to not read anymore threads titled "How i learned to love my GTS even though I could afford a 991" and not make fun of you guys any more as it seems to upset many of you
Long live the GTS, last of the classic Porsches (****e I just couldnt help myself). Laugh at yourselves a little bit fellas, you might like it
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From: New England
Point 1. Hearing intake sound is part of the "sportiness" deal for many people. A direct quote from Fabspeed's website while talking about their 997 Maxflow Competition Air Intake; "On a stock 997 makes the car sound very sporty and sound great." We're talking about intake here not exhaust and clearly Fabspeed considers intake sound part of the package. And please don't tell me that part of that aural enhancement, for exhaust or intake, isn't also for the benefit of the passengers, as opposed to just the outside world.
Point 2. The Symposer is allowing you to hear intake sound that would otherwise be blocked by sound insulation in the 991, which is by all accounts quiet for a sports car. It's not artificial sound, it's sound that's there. In fact it is sound that the car is "emitting to the world" but is just hard for passengers to hear. Porsche thinks that passengers want to hear it, the way they want to hear a sporting exhaust note, and provide a way for you to do so.
If someone thinks the Symposer is unnecessay, and intake sound is not a valuable component of the overall sound of the car, so be it. Makes no difference to me. But it's not fake, any more than the baffles, shapes, and reflecting surfaces which channel and control sound in a concert hall are fake.
Point 2. The Symposer is allowing you to hear intake sound that would otherwise be blocked by sound insulation in the 991, which is by all accounts quiet for a sports car. It's not artificial sound, it's sound that's there. In fact it is sound that the car is "emitting to the world" but is just hard for passengers to hear. Porsche thinks that passengers want to hear it, the way they want to hear a sporting exhaust note, and provide a way for you to do so.
If someone thinks the Symposer is unnecessay, and intake sound is not a valuable component of the overall sound of the car, so be it. Makes no difference to me. But it's not fake, any more than the baffles, shapes, and reflecting surfaces which channel and control sound in a concert hall are fake.
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From: North Bay Area, CA
Strange analogy. Take away the baffles/shapes in a concert hall and an orchestra will not function properly unless you were sitting front row, making a concert hall useless. Take away a symposer and you still have a functional car. I agree with you, it is ok for folks to like this as a feature but it is not a byproduct of some actual and physical change in performance-no more than "my car seems to drive faster when its freshly detailed".
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From: Mid-South
It it very obvious isnt it, with each new generation of 911, Porsche will advance and change technology and design of the car in some way...for the better. But the true Porsche enthusiasts will always feel that soemething is lost everytime because every model of 911 was mechanically over-engineered compared its competitors..with very few exceptions. Jay Leno alluded to this once when talking about the Carrera GT but its so true of the 997 generation too. It is the best all-round sports car of its generation by common agreement.
So as Porsche enthusiasts, we can't have the next best thing without giving up something about the old car...it just changes and becomes next great 911. I took me while to realize it but I am going try to do the obvious...keep both. It doesnt make sense to sell my 997.1 for 50k. So i am going to to try!!
So as Porsche enthusiasts, we can't have the next best thing without giving up something about the old car...it just changes and becomes next great 911. I took me while to realize it but I am going try to do the obvious...keep both. It doesnt make sense to sell my 997.1 for 50k. So i am going to to try!!
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From: Vancouver, BC
6 pages? 
I am traveling in DE right now, so not much time to contribute... all I can add/confirm is that the weekend before I left, I test drove 991, GTS, and McLaren MP4-12C... before getting back to my lowly 997.1!
3 out of those 4 cars felt like SPORTS CARS, and one felt like a really nice and fast GT. I let you guess which is which!
I am traveling in DE right now, so not much time to contribute... all I can add/confirm is that the weekend before I left, I test drove 991, GTS, and McLaren MP4-12C... before getting back to my lowly 997.1!
3 out of those 4 cars felt like SPORTS CARS, and one felt like a really nice and fast GT. I let you guess which is which!
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Joined: Jul 2011
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From: Central New Jersey
so now the front end looks like a Panamera. C'mon, me thinks you are trying too hard to not like the 991. The 997 and 991 look very similar from the front, so by definition your car (and mine) look like a Panamera too.
Like it, don't like it but some of these posts are like saying the new Boxster looks like an MR2 or the Ferrari 550 looks like a Celica. Not something I'd expect on this board.
Like it, don't like it but some of these posts are like saying the new Boxster looks like an MR2 or the Ferrari 550 looks like a Celica. Not something I'd expect on this board.
The symposer is a neat bit of engineering and does add an aural character inside the cabin beyond what would normally be available. I have no objection to it and if that was the only issue it would not stop me from getting a 991 but...it is artificial in the sense that it channels vibration sound from the intake area through a channel and the vibratoin sound is amplified by a membrane. Its not true intake sound which is nothing more than air that gets sucked into an intake its the amplification of vibration. So to that extent one could say it's contrived. It does sound good though.
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From: New England
The point is, like the concert hall, it's simple acoustic tuning. Interior materials, shapes, speaker placement and design, sound insulation, muffler systems, and a myriad of other features throughout the car are engineered to either control or enhance sound. The symposer is just one more feature, but I guess because it has a special name and Porsche has touted it specifically, people are annoyed by it. Whatever. I've seen no claims that it is a byproduct of performance changes, so I'm not sure what you're referring to on that score.
Addict
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From: Georgetown, TX
What's the big deal?
My 993C4S (a classic air cooled Porsche by anyone's standard) came equipped with an option called the "Motor Sound Package". It was simply and air box cover drilled with a couple dozen holes and a fancy chrome intake horn as opposed to the stock plastic. Lots of 993 owners drilled their air box cover to achieve the same effect. It simply increased the amount of intake suction noise that you could hear in the cabin.
Now many of those folks put down the "Sound Symposer" as a gimmick. What really is the difference? Both add to the aural enjoyment of the driving experience.
Some folks to to "unwad" their panties.
Now many of those folks put down the "Sound Symposer" as a gimmick. What really is the difference? Both add to the aural enjoyment of the driving experience.
Some folks to to "unwad" their panties.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,720
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From: New England
My 993C4S (a classic air cooled Porsche by anyone's standard) came equipped with an option called the "Motor Sound Package". It was simply and air box cover drilled with a couple dozen holes and a fancy chrome intake horn as opposed to the stock plastic. Lots of 993 owners drilled their air box cover to achieve the same effect. It simply increased the amount of intake suction noise that you could hear in the cabin.
Now many of those folks put down the "Sound Symposer" as a gimmick. What really is the difference? Both add to the aural enjoyment of the driving experience.
Some folks to to "unwad" their panties.
Now many of those folks put down the "Sound Symposer" as a gimmick. What really is the difference? Both add to the aural enjoyment of the driving experience.
Some folks to to "unwad" their panties.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,060
Likes: 1,565
From: North Bay Area, CA
My 993C4S (a classic air cooled Porsche by anyone's standard) came equipped with an option called the "Motor Sound Package". It was simply and air box cover drilled with a couple dozen holes and a fancy chrome intake horn as opposed to the stock plastic. Lots of 993 owners drilled their air box cover to achieve the same effect. It simply increased the amount of intake suction noise that you could hear in the cabin.
Now many of those folks put down the "Sound Symposer" as a gimmick. What really is the difference? Both add to the aural enjoyment of the driving experience.
Some folks to to "unwad" their panties.
Now many of those folks put down the "Sound Symposer" as a gimmick. What really is the difference? Both add to the aural enjoyment of the driving experience.
Some folks to to "unwad" their panties.
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Joined: Mar 2006
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From: in a happy place
Fred, Mike grab a chair
One is the actual sound the device is making, the other is a derivative physically directed to the surface of a candy-assed tuned port and ultimate diaphragm to actually make the sound.
One is the actual sound, the 360 deg radiance, echo and sublime dynamic timbre and range of a source. The other a speaker cone and tube.
Chalk and cheese physically and intellectually for me.
But I'll drink to both cuz I love Porsches!
Got a treat comin' this Friday. Guess it's an early Good Friday for me.
Pics to follow...
One is the actual sound the device is making, the other is a derivative physically directed to the surface of a candy-assed tuned port and ultimate diaphragm to actually make the sound.
One is the actual sound, the 360 deg radiance, echo and sublime dynamic timbre and range of a source. The other a speaker cone and tube.
Chalk and cheese physically and intellectually for me.
But I'll drink to both cuz I love Porsches!
Got a treat comin' this Friday. Guess it's an early Good Friday for me.
Pics to follow...
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,160
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From: Manhattan Beach & Truckee, CA
Originally Posted by alexb76:9396352
6 pages?
I am traveling in DE right now, so not much time to contribute... all I can add/confirm is that the weekend before I left, I test drove 991, GTS, and McLaren MP4-12C... before getting back to my lowly 997.1!
3 out of those 4 cars felt like SPORTS CARS, and one felt like a really nice and fast GT. I let you guess which is which!
I am traveling in DE right now, so not much time to contribute... all I can add/confirm is that the weekend before I left, I test drove 991, GTS, and McLaren MP4-12C... before getting back to my lowly 997.1!
3 out of those 4 cars felt like SPORTS CARS, and one felt like a really nice and fast GT. I let you guess which is which!