Kevin in Atlanta

Silent on cold start up, Oil pressure is good - 2.5 to 3 bars at idle once the car is at operating temperature. 5 bars above 2000 RPM. Temperature gauge barely cracks the first white line. Recently changed the oil - went with Royal Purple 20-50. Oil galley pins have been updated. Noise was there with Mobil 1, too.

I don't remember the lifters being that noisy when I changed the Mobil 1 last year.

Is 20-50 too heavy? I went with Royal Purple after reading a post by Roger. :-)

Suggestions?

The Forgotten On

If you hear noise then that would normally mean the oil is too thin but your pressure sounds normal and well.

Are you sure there is enough ZDDDP in the oil?

Others will chime in with better knowledge on this issue.

Mrmerlin

are you sure it is one of the lifters and do you know what ones? Use a stethoscope.
I am going to guess your working on your 87 5 speed correct?

Have the cam chain tensioners been off?

See the PET for updated tensioners date and part #

FWIW some of the early 32V cars had noisy lifters and swapping them out was the repair mode

Kevin in Atlanta

I guess I should add that at operating temperature the engine sounds like a diesel based on the reflective noise from cars next to me at stop lights. I replaced the cam tensioner pads when I did the top end refresh. I assume the ZDDP is ok in Royal Purple.

Originally I thought it was the injectors, but since the noise was absent at start up I assume it is tappets. I do have a diagnostic stethoscope -i'll listen later.

Thanks

MainePorsche

Probably not the often spoke of oil check valve up top because your good when cold.
I had saved a post from one of the engine gurus about two years ago to my Rennlist folder on my laptop which is dead due to logic board failure. This post spoke of symptoms of oil return check valve problems (I believe that is what it was called) - This valve is similar in configuration to our old friend in the cylinder head but is located by the oil filter. I'm sorry, I can not remember any more about it. Might it be related to your issue - I don't know, but perhaps the more wise will speak to it.
Best Wishes.

ROG100

Kevin - try Swepco 502 - works wonders on sticky lifters - I learnt the trick from GB. I have it in stock if you can't buy it locally.

dr bob

Piston slap is similar to lifter noise but a little deeper. It shows up when the engine is up to temp and the block grows. Drop the sump and inspect the bottoms of the bores and the skirts of the pistons. There will be telltales visible in the bores if you borescope through the plug holes. Most obvious is a burn pattern on top of the pistons, which some gewgel searching will find I suspect. You might see some scuffing in the bores via borescope at bottom of piston travel. If the engine has ever been overheated this is for sure something to look for. Solutions, unfortunately, are not simple.

M. Requin

Unfortunately, ^+1. OTOH if things look good here you have eliminated one bad thing.

outbackgeorgia

Kevin,
Have you replaced the cam plugs with pins ?
Exact symptoms you describe.
Call me tomorrow to discuss.

Dave

MainePorsche

Kevin,
With the wisdom you show here, I took for granted you have the superceded journal pins in place and not the rubber-prone-to-failure journal plugs.
You do have them ?

Kevin in Atlanta

There must be other symptoms associated with piston slap. Smoke, degraded performance, poor gas mileage... The car runs great, sips gas on the highway and responds well to my right foot.

I replaced it all when I did the top end refresh. I only hear the noise at idle - tap the accelerator and it goes away. I think I need to use the mechanics stethoscope to isolate the sound before I go to much farther.

Knowing what I do of the engine's history I can tell you it has never overheated. I looked at the bores when I did the pan gasket. They looked fine from what I could see.

I will report back later. Meanwhile I will continue to drive it like I stole it.

Chalkboss

I had a bit of lifter noise on a S4 engine with 86K miles. Used Swepco 502 and the noise was gone in minutes. Also switched to Amsoil ZROD 20W-50 and it runs quieter.

Rob Edwards

Did you clean out the lifters during the top end refresh? There's a lot of schmutz in a 20+ year old lifter. For now, +1 on the Swepco.

See the little volcanoes of filth coming out of the oil holes?

Landseer

I took the approach of oil changes, Rislone and Italian tuneup to rid my 85 of lifter noise.

Turns out it was chain / guide noise. Now I have a crashed right bank.

Don't just drive it.

worf928

What's the oil pressure at idle when the engine is at operating temperature?

And what's the idle rpm?