Fronkenstein

Hey I thought I would start this thread to see what if anything has been done to improve the state of sealing our beloved drivetrains.

I was disappointed at best when I purchased a Victor Reinz "complete engine set". It was missing the camshaft seals and a few other minor items.

The biggest disappointment is the use of ancient technology for materials. I've been around long enough to recognize the same-ole-same-ole. Heck these gaskets are behind Caterpillar engine sets! There are no updated materials such as neoprene cork, silicone, viton, etc, etc. A really basic improvement would be silicone beading of many of the gaskets and daisy chaining the intake ports using a web-reinforced material to improve sealing and protect against suck-in.

I have seen some areas improved by R.E.A.L and others for water web, oil pan and a few others but nothing that addresses the problem from end to end. The same holds true for the 944.

Of course let me qualify this by setting the cost expectation. The best price I have found of a complete VR set is $350 delivered buying onsey twosey. That is an insane amount of money for the very little number of items included. I've bought far more complex engine sets for the same money for other vehicles.

Are there really too few 928 / 944 enthusiasts to warrant a major improvement?

Thoughts?

Fronkensteen

17prospective buyer

Well if it ain't broke don't fix it. I'd say a good percentage of leaks come from installer error/incompetence. If it didn't come off with RTV, don't put RTV on, pretty simple. If they were really that problematic you'd see entreprenurial people coming up with solutions, but like you said REAL's silicone gaskets are there and work pretty good for sealing, and can be reused. They also are less fussy as to the surface RA of the substrate they are sealing. I do agree with you on the intake gaskets though for the early intakes, a stamped steel gasket with embedded silicone would be better, that's what's used in most newer metal intakes.

Leon Speed

Seems to me these seals held up over 25 years so why change. One candidate for change is the cork oil pan seal.

Fronkenstein

I think we are all in agreement. Obviously not going to fix something that isn't leaking.

My point is that in the early days of Porsche the whole premise of an "upgrade" (better known as an ECO Engineering Change Order) was to continuously improve the state of the model line. This hasn't happened with gamers and seals. This problem plagues Porsche to this very day with cam seal issues on certain lines.

I have found significant one-off improvements in the following areas:

1) head gaskets (arguably not really something to count due to specialty performance) in copper, ss composite and ss graphite

2) cooling web seals in silicone

3) oil pan available in neoprene/cork and silicone

4) cam tower rear seals in silicone

That is a short list. At the very least adding a silicone bead to the paper would be a big improvement. But several are candidates for new materials.

I am pursuing production of a daisy chain intake seal made of a composite providing significant heat isolation to reduce intake runner temperature without compromising fitment of the intake component path due to thickness of the seal / isolator.

I had initially thought I would oring my head intake ports but I don't think a lot of folks would pursue that.

I guess my point is shouldn't we be improving the state of our favorite mark? Heck this is the "maker's movement" era!

Fronkensteen