SteveG

I'm pretty sure Freeze12 was mentioned as flammable. You might want to read the label carefully. Cheaper is not usu better. Maybe that is why they are no longer in business?
[edit] Upon seaching, what found is that Freeze 12 is not flammable by itself, but when mixed with oils, it will ignite if exposed to flame; same for R12 and 134a.

Don Carter

Freeze12 is not flammable, common misconception. It's mostly 134a.

MainePorsche

I have a retrofitted 134 system by Porsche courtesy of the PO. Sticker on inner side of hood. Is actually to cold sometimes. 134 shouldn't be shunned for it looks like 12 is being regulated out.

AirtekHVAC

You can usually get with the recyclers, Hudson refrigeration is one....they usually have great prices on recycled refrigerant....


http://www.hudsontech.com/

928 at last

My Experience...
Ran "DuraCool" (flammable hydrocarbon blend) in my previously R12 GMC products for years with good results and no random ignition events....
Downside is that once you use the product, no shop will service your system for fear of contaminating their equipment.
On my 928, the R12 charge I bought it with lasted three years with no issues, and then died. I took the easy way out and just tried the recharge with 134a. (no change in seals etc.)
This worked very well- better than expected with 32 degree vent temps in 90 plus humid conditions.
The higher pressure has been an issue and I still have a leak that I haven't located.
So, considering reverting back to "DuraCool" (readily available here) once the leak is located and corrected, and avoiding the potential issues with the "proper" R-134a" conversion procedure.....

69gaugeman

Don't worry Sean, not all canucks are tree huggers. I'm about as far from it as you can get. All previous 928's I had had 2/60 air conditioning. 2 windows down and 60 miles per hour....lol

The GT is the first working one I had. In case of future failure, I am subscribing to this thread....

SeanR

I'm a fan of R-12 want to keep a nice stash of it on hand for those that don't want to change over to the other stuff. I've been able to get most systems converted over to 134a and some feel as good as the R-12. I pretty much line it out to the customer on what the proper way to go is when it comes to R-134a and what I will give a guarantee on and some take it and some don't. Pretty simple, the cars are 20-30 years old, to do it properly is going to cost you because a lot of things need to be done. Up until this past couple weeks R-12 availability was really not an issue with me since I've been able to get some whenever I needed it. Started to look the past couple weeks and my usual suppliers are out and not getting more.

Suckish but it looks like I'll buy a few hundred lbs of 134a and just do conversions, that isn't going to make the OB owners very happy. I've had a few that just want me to change out the leaking parts and fill. Then the next weak link fails and we do it all over again.

SeanR

The higher pressures are an issues (along with others obviously.

The first test I do with a new a/c customer is put his system under a stress test with nitrogen, pretty easy to find leaks with a bottle of soapy water. If it holds then I put it under vacuum for a few hours and see if it holds and if it does then we are good to go with a refill. What some don't understand is I can't just shove 134a in a system that had R-12. I can't even give them that option since they will come back and want a warrantywork job when the whole system craps out. Sadly, it's a 50/50 on what comes in. Some are suck an fill conversions, some are ok conversions but don't know all of the seals and they leak out after a year or so........I'm almost to the point of just doing A/C jobs for my buddies since these are turning in to such a pain in the ***.

otisp

I did run into this too, topped up my son's BMW with 12a, and had a hard time getting a shop to work on it afterwards. Interesting that they were OK with whatever brand I had used (maybe Duracool actually) as long as it wasn't the brand Canadian Tire sells (Red Tek I think)Same crap, different can. In the end there was no problem with the equipment, they evacuated and refilled with R12.

928 at last

I'm impressed you found any R12. I looked everywhere last year with absolutely no success. (And I have good connections with farm and heavy equipment mechanics too).

otisp

Hmmm...I thought they used r12, maybe they just put 12a back in. I assumed that they knew what they were doing, but maybe they used 134a? I know r12 became unavailable in Canada a long time ago, but I thought maybe things had relaxed a bit or something.
Maybe I'd better go ask what they used.

eijun

I really don't like the 134a, with our car's potential fire hazard I rather re-refit the R12

Ad0911

And what is R414-b? It is advertised as R12 replacement and commonly referred to as "hot-shot"

Bigfoot928

the best way to cover yourself on conversions or fixnfill issues is provide a diagram of the whole system with each o-ring numbered. reciept shows, oring 12 replaced customer refused to upgrade existing system. warranty only covers the cost of oring 12. No refrigerant covered under warranty. customer refused replacement of dryer so no warranty on new compressor installed. Get a signature on the bill, and you are covered... it is a pia but I was there years ago, and if you explain that the weakest link failed and if you only do a fixnfill then every time the next link fails its on your checkbook. I even had a form that I had customers sign to agree that they read the problem and description..... the things you have to do to stay in bidness

Randy V

It is a highly flammable gas that can cause more problems than it solves.