jej3

Unfortunately, there isn't anything significant to report. Emptied the fuel tank and thats about it...

A prior gorilla torqued the inlet side of the fuel filter down so hard that it would not move at all. I guess I'll be shopping for a new line from the fuel pump outlet to the fuel filter inlet.

A little frustrating but better to struggle in my driveway than on the side of the road.

I'm going to search and possibly open a new thread on removal of 02 Sensor.

Updates later in the week (after FedEx brings me new parts)

jcorenman

Could have been Fritz at the factory, those things can be tight. A little anti-seize (on the threads) on re-assembly doesn't hurt.

Do you have a flare-nut wrench to fit that? The problem with a normal end-wrench is that it only gabs two of the flats, and rounding off the fitting is a common problem. A flare-nut wrench is like a box-end wrench (with a beefier section) that is cut away on one side, to allow it to be slipped over the metal tubing. It grabs four of the flats, and can apply a lot more torque without damaging the fitting.

Also be sure to counter-hold the fitting. The fittings always have a place for a second wrench, something to grab with a conventional end-wrench to take the torque instead of the filter or tubing. That will save you twisting things into a prezel.

On the O2 sensor, disconnect it first inside the car, there will be a 3-pin rubber disconnect lying along the bottom edge of the CE panel, or maybe tucked underneath the bottom of the CE panel. Follow the cable under the carpet to where it disappears through the side of the tunnel-- there is a 25.4mm grommet there, push the grommet, cable and the connector on through. (You might want to tie a string to it, to make reassembly easier)

Under the car, the cable goes behind (above) the center heat-shield, to the O2 sensor in the top of the exhaust, forward edge of the CAT section (for a stock setup). Disconnect the air pipe, remove the three bolts each side that secure the exhaust to the manifolds, lower the front of the exhaust a few inches and secure it with the piece of wire that you remembered to bring under the car with you. Be careful not to stress the O2-sensor cable (just for practice, this one gets tossed). Pull the cable through the heatshield, unscrew the O2 sensor (22mm wrench IIRC), screw in the new one and tighten (medium-snug, don't overdo it-- or 41 ft-lb if your coveralls say "Fritz").

Cheers,

jej3

Thanks! I think it was Fritz or maybe Hans on one wrench and Franz on the other

I had flare-nut wrenches for both the fitting and for a counterhold. My 8 year old learned some new words today as the flare wrenches wouldn't budge in either loosening or tightening directions (even with PB Blaster sitting on the connection for 60 minutes)...

Since I bought the universal 02 from 928intl, I am going to need to swap the ends where it attaches in front of the CE panel. I'll follow your advice on this one, as I've already put eyes on the grommet from below the car and above.

Since I'm ordering the hard fuel line from pump to filter, I think I am going to order a new TempII, as well. Certainly cannot hurt.

If this all works well, I'll probably put off the top-end refresh for some other time. If it's still rough at all, I'm going to go with techron and italian tune-ups next

Thanks again for the advice (oh and my kids remember you helping us at SITM last year!) They seem to have every detail of that event permanently etched in their memory (which is a GREAT thing!)

jej3

I became bored so I figured I would cut the heat shrink off the ground cable I replaced.

Here's the end farthest from the battery....



and here's the end closest to the battery....



It is probably hard to see but the copper color changes from bright at the far end to dull and then grey at the battery end.

More later....

jej3

As an update, I've now done the following:

New Plugs, Caps, Rotors and Plug Wires
New Temp II Sender
New 02 Sensor
Replaced internal Fuel Pump with Strainer and changed Fuel Filter
CEP Refresh

Problem still hanging around BUT, I'm leaning toward the need for an Italian Tune-Up. with 8gal of gas and a bottle of tecron (said good for 12 gal)

If that doesn't clear it up, I'm inclined to think there might be some issues with injectors. (of course, I'm psychologically blocking that it could be the LH )

I'll update after the Italian Tuneup.

jej3

Okay. I need help It is tough to find the right words because I'm a bit frustrated.

Here's what is happening...

Car has had all of the above replaced and new Engine to Frame ground strap this AM.

While it will start and idle low (like 500) and sometimes normal (like 900) it still struggles when accelerator is pushed from in the car.

When directly manipulating the throttle body I can rev it up to 5K RPMs (although some times it does stumble while accelerating)

I decided to give it a road test and the results were bad. Car acted like it was about to cut off with what seemed like only minor surges of fuel.

What would you recommend I do next? I know I can possibly look for vacuum issues, LH Troubleshooting (need to find a thread), fuel pump could have ingested some nasty bits from failed internal pump but I'm at the point where I could use some guidance.

jej3

Anyone? ???

pjg

You may have injector issues, get a wooden dowel and place one side on your ear and the other on each injector while the car is running, they should be clicking away if not you have a bad injector or poor connection. Also how do the new plugs look ? can you post some pics of the plugs ?

jej3

I'll listen to injectors in morning before I head to work. Might also ****** the plugs out but they've literally run for minutes (less than 30).

Any other ideas?

outbackgeorgia

For what it's worth,
Try your LH in a car that is working correctly. They go bad with age due to a hybrid circuit degradation that is time/age based, so need to eliminate it as an issue.
A failed LH can produce a myriad of symptoms that defy logic, some are temp/heat based.
Dave

SeanR

Sounds like bad coil/coil wires to me.

The excessive richness could also be the wiring harness at the temp II or the MAF. Peeling back the boots will tell you a lot.

tailpipe

I had the same problem on a 78 OB it would idle but ran like crap and would not accelerat at all I changed everything in the fuel system and ignition still not fixed finally ended up being the 14 pin connector at the front right of the car was loose and a little corroded not sure if this applies to you car just thought I would throw it out there. good luck

jcorenman

Trey,

New ignition wires, right? Check that they got reinstalled correctly.

There are some troubleshooting steps for the LH in the WSM (temp-II sensor resistance measured from the LH plug will spot a harness problem, for example) but the basic LH test is to try yours in another car, or a known-good one in your car. Who is nearby?

Do you have a fuel-pressure gauge? (Roger has a gauge kit with the proper fitting). Since the problem is showing up in the driveway, you can put the gauge on and monitor fuel pressure while idling and revving.

Also do the fuel-volume test in the WSM-- remove the fuel-return line at the tank, connect it to an extension hose and run it into a jar for measurement-- should be 1.25L in 30 seconds. This goes hand-in-hand with the pressure test, and measures fuel delivery from the pump through the 55 psi regulator (checked with the pressure gauge) and back to the tank via the return line. Don't start the motor for this, bridge the fuel-pump relay (carefully) instead.

If it is still stinky-rich out the tailpipe then it is either too much fuel (stuck injector, LH, MAF gone bad, temp-II sensor harness) or ignition (unburned fuel from spark failure). The plugs will tell you if all cyl's are too rich (LH, MAF) or only one (stuck injector) or a few (ignition, i.e. crossed wires or a bad coil). Even new plugs will get sooty or wet (from fuel) pretty quick.

John Speake

Does either the red or green LED light up on the Igntion protection relay ? An ignition or injector problem was almost certainly trigger it.

If it isn't lit, then your symptoms also tally with "limp home" mode that can be due to no MAF output (or a bad connection from the MAF).

jej3

No LED lights. Good advice all. I have WSM and I think I know what I am doing this weekend.