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15% ethanol in gas

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Old 07-04-2011, 12:41 PM
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BC
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I'd just like to remind everyone not fully versed with ethanol, its chemical make up, how it operates in IC engines, to do some of their own research. Actually quite a bit. And make sure to read all sorts of articles, especially paying attention to WHO sponsored the information.

Understand also, that running ethanol in an UN-optimized IC engine - that is - one which has not been made to use the fuel not only in its fuel-carrying materials, but also in its combustion parameters like timing and compression ratio - is not going to net more MPG or very much more power. BUT - when you design and build an engine around the fuel - you get this:

Old 07-04-2011, 10:14 PM
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Glenn Evans
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Originally Posted by BC
I'd just like to remind everyone not fully versed with ethanol, its chemical make up, how it operates in IC engines, to do some of their own research. Actually quite a bit. And make sure to read all sorts of articles, especially paying attention to WHO sponsored the information.

Understand also, that running ethanol in an UN-optimized IC engine - that is - one which has not been made to use the fuel not only in its fuel-carrying materials, but also in its combustion parameters like timing and compression ratio - is not going to net more MPG or very much more power. BUT - when you design and build an engine around the fuel - you get this:

The energy content of a given volume of ethanol is about 34 per cent less than the same volume of gasoline, so higher MPG is not achievable using ethanol blends. Unless, perhaps, an engine with an open loop fuel system was set up to deliver a mixture appropriate for the ethanol blend, which would be too rich for straight gasoline.
Old 07-04-2011, 10:34 PM
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I didn't want to do this here, but these sort of statements are causing the public to think and react improperly to this fuel's increased usage. There is quite a bit of research going on, and the crux is that the mpg is a determinant which comes out of a more complex composite of factors than JUST btu. A btu is simply energy content - and it does not take into account the many variables that you can manipulate and engineer in a SI IC engine. These numerous variables have been proven to be able to increase AND SURPASS the total package efficiency of am SI IC engine when using ethanol. The main factor is it's detonation resistance, but also it's very good LHE. The very simplistic view of the fuel as evidenced in the statements below are share by many on the Internet, bit the conclusion is incorrect.

Originally Posted by Glenn Evans
The energy content of a given volume of ethanol is about 34 per cent less than the same volume of gasoline, so higher MPG is not achievable using ethanol blends. Unless, perhaps, an engine with an open loop fuel system was set up to deliver a mixture appropriate for the ethanol blend, which would be too rich for straight gasoline.
Old 07-04-2011, 10:35 PM
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Of course we are talking about a fully optimized package with the video and any IC engine pushing the efficiency envelope.
Old 07-04-2011, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by BC
Of course we are talking about a fully optimized package with the video and any IC engine pushing the efficiency envelope.
Indeed!

My concern was to disavow any expectation that fuel consumption would be reduced by changing from straight gasoline to an ethanol blend, certainly in anything other than an engine optimised for that blend. I do not see this as anything detrimental to ethanol blends, unless they are priced the same as straight gasoline.

As a matter of interest, NACA tested gasohol in an aircraft engine eons ago (I think back in the 1920s). When all other factors (such as energy content) were taken into account., NACA established that the fuel consumption of the gasohol was slightly better than straight gasoline because the gasohol burned more efficiently.
Old 07-05-2011, 12:11 AM
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Do you know what percentages gasohol was?



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