Ed Scherer

FWIW, one of our other vehicles is a Chrysler T&C (a 2003 AWD version). I haven't done much on it, but on the stuff I have done, I actually find it to be pretty easy to work on. In fact, much of the stuff seems to be designed for easy maintenance. Cheap parts, but easy to replace. Headlight and taillight modules are amazingly easy to pop out and replace.

And then there's the cost of parts. I was pretty amazed when I discovered that you can get loaded calipers (i.e., complete calipers with pads) for all four corners for way less than I pay for just a pad set for the 928.

Replacing a hard coolant line on the T&C (that evidently is common problem; it corrodes and leaks somewhere in the vicinity of under the front passenger seat) was kind of a bitch, though.

The design and/or parts for some of the suspension bits (like the front sway bar bushings) are pretty crappy, though.



And after having done some recent wrenching on my 928, there are a few bolts on there that aren't exactly easy to get to, either. There's one, for example, (on a '90 S4) under the rear fuel pressure regulator that's unbelievably trapped.

Dannyfumi

I work on my Wife's ford expedition, a breeze compared to the 928. I also wrench on a E38-7 series, that car is a bitch.

Danny

Ed Scherer

That reminds me: I wandered over to visit a neighbor a few weeks ago who was wrenching on a Saab (or Volvo; can't remember which, they have both!) that had a transverse mounted engine. Probably 80s vintage. He was just replacing an accessory belt, IIRC. I swear, there was about an inch or so of working space between all the pulley bolts and the right side of the engine bay wall. Anything other than the shortest of sockets and flattest of ratchets just wouldn't fit. Tools were constantly getting wedged in there.

Pretty crappy design, IMHO.

Mike Frye

If it was a Saab, he should have consulted the manual. For the belts (and tensioner) you have to remove the passenger wheel, then two plastic inserts and bam! There are the belts. No, just kidding, it's still a PITA!

blown 87

You are 100% right about a crappy design if it was a 900 or a 9000, the idlers are just junk and will fail very quick, like 20-30 thousand miles.

The early 9000's had a special tool "C" shaped tool that was to hold it open while you changed the belt and the tool was weak and would open up just at the moment it trap your hand some place, you had to use water pump pliers to force it open, just awful and the idlers would last about 20 thousand miles.

Some had a left handed thread, some did not, I keep a set of both in my tool box.

Yea, awful.

blandis

On many cars, you can tell the guys who design them never have to work on them.

Landseer

^^^ Once I tried to change the fan belt on a Datsun 710 wagon.

The bar conversation in Japan, about the same time, probably went something like this...

"Ahhhh, craiscy Ahmerican! Think he vill change fan belt! No way! Only smallest Japanese hand can reach into there"

Ethre

My 08 Sonata had a very tight engine bay. Not fun to change to oil filter on that one either. Real nice car to drive though.

50s,60s,70s carbureted pickups - now those are easy to work on. Nice and simple. Lots of room in the engine bay.

hallowzeve

90 prelude - that dang thing just wanted to die. I ended up completely replacing the engine and computers. This was the longest, most drug out, knuckle busting, friend and tool losing, POS job ever.
I'll never own a Honda again. I'm convinced it was design by a japanese marquis de sade.

all that work just to have the (yes new) timing belt break and grenade the new block 20k later.
Ive got to go look at the p car just to cool off now.

jeff spahn

I don't work on my Acrua MDX. I just change the oil and drive it.

928mac

Man the one thing that surprises me is how many of you have Japanese.
Isn't it against the law there to not have at least 1 american Iron in your drive way, or do I not here about them because they are so easy to work on, except for the dodge that is.

BTW I'm a mechanic and I take my tundra into rapid lube. filter is in the pan.
No one touches the 928 but me, well unless I have to get the alignment tweaked and it will be at the porsche dealer.

The reason for the above is I no longer work at a shop so I do not have access to a hoist.

Rob Edwards

Yeah, 2003 V6 Accord- 2 sets of tires, 1 set of brake pads, a crapload of oil changes, and 2 partial tranny fluid changes. At 105K miles I finally paid someone else to work on it, they did another trans fluid change and TB/WP for $800.

I bet the 928s would be reliable now if I'd just drive 'em regularly....

danglerb

When my wife's Lincoln Continental isn't running well, wife isn't happy, so I have something of a time limit I can spend before it goes to the shop, and being a front wheel drive mess most of the time I let it go. I do try to at least do some diagnostic work, and fix the simple stuff myself. A "real" obdii diagnostic tool starts at about $350 (AutoEnginuity with Total Ford bundle running on a PC) and I am about ready to buy it.

OTOH my 91 Mustang goes in the same service queue as the 928's, which means I am ready to attempt any type of repair on it, but willing to pass off any of them when time or tools get in my way too long.

hallowzeve

I truly wish there was a sense of pride in American vehicles here again. I do think its down-right un-American to go out and buy a new car, and rule out american autos completely. Most do it simply because of the misconception that (japanese especially) foreign cars are better or more reliable. It's complete bunk.

They took r jobs!!{south park accent}

Ok so the Iococa years at Chrysler were pretty dark, but still. Any car will break with no maintenance, ever driven a renault? I bet not for long.

Cheers,
Bil

Rob Edwards

I am certain that if you go to Lincoln, AL and check out behind the factory, you'll find a 928 motor in the pile of things they test-fit into the Odyssesy to define the rear hatch dimensions. The Honda Odyssey is tailor made for hauling 928 motors. An S4+ catback fits behind the driver's seat with the rear hatch closed. And it's as reliable as the brick it's styled after.