kos_007

I was able to fix a few things (the last one was 1986 944 Turbo cruise control brain) by replacing electrolytic capacitors. They frequently go bad with age. There are 2 of them in your relay, they are 1-2 bucks at Radio Shack. Worth a try ?

Alan

Indeed as you say these truncate the delay feature - so worth checking out - most likely here would be the lock switch 31z.

The (other post) idea of the capacitor breakdown is also a reasonable thing to check out via replacement - certainly cheap.

Alan

kos_007

Clearly the best solution is to fix the relay.
The next best solution is to jump the relay.
My suggestion is to replace the incandescent bulbs with LEDs if you decide to jump the relay - it will greatly reduce the current via the door and hatch pins.

jerybak

ok...sorry i am confused, are you guys responding to me?

again i did the bench test on the relay, and when i touch the TK pin with ground I get a click but when i removed the ground i get another click immediately.... no delay, I then tested for continuity from 31 to 31L with the TK pin grounded, and i have no continuity...looks like a bad relay....I also jumped 31 to 31L and the lights do come on.

So it looks as if I had a bad relay correct?

Also, I was trying to test continuity from TK (on CE Panel) to the door bolts to verify the signal(ground) to bring the relay in and I was not getting continuity.....shouldn't I get continuity when i hold a test lead in the TK slot on the CE Panel and touch the bolts on the open doors jam, with the door open, key off? Is that the proper way to check the signal to bring in the delay relay, to check that continuity on the TK slot?

That pin is smaller than a standard 1/4 male blade so I was just kinda pushing the test leads point into the slot where TK is located, pretty sure I was deep enough but i couldn't get continuity. My door chimes do work when the key is on and the doors are open so I feel the push pins are working, but was kinda surprised/ pissed when I was not get continuity from the CE Panel TK slot to the door bolt.

AO

Wow... I have absolutely no recollection of ever posting this thread. Cool.

jerybak

so i opened up the relay and got an immediate smell of burnt ele......what testing should I perform prior to sticking a new $160 relay into this socket?

jwyatt8171

Make sure you have a good connection in the socket with the meter lead. You can take a 1/4 male blade, and cut it in half to make a 1/8" blade to fit in the connector, but if your sure your making contact with the terminal then your good.
I would ensure both door pins are showing the same (open) continuity to ground.
Connection F15 on the CE should be the connector from the door pins the the CE panel. Check continuity from the connector to ground with door open, should read ~0 ohm doors closed should be Open. Or visa-versa.

Then check the socket on F15 to TK pin slot on socket XXI.

jwyatt8171

I think the timing circuit is gone, but sounds like your not getting the ground signal to make it work. You stated you can bench test it, and hear it click, but not getting continuity between 31 and 31L.

I must ask, how are you bench testing the relay?

I have not tested, or looked at this particular relay/timer, but i would first connect 12v source to pin 31Z and 0v(gnd) to the TK terminal. You should then have continuity between 31 and 31L. Removing gnd you should have a 25-second time delay before 31 and 31L opens. If it happens immediately, i wouldn't lose any sleep over, and call it good.

jerybak

bench test was as follows: (used a spare 12V battery as source)

POS to 30A
NEG to 31
touched TK with NEG

When I touch TK with NEG i get a click, as soon as I removed NEG from TK i get another click immediately. With NEG clamped to TK, I test continuity from 31 to 31L while TK was grounded with NEG.....no continuity.

Relay smells of burnt electronics, so I am concerned about plugging a new relay into the CE socket until I do some more testing, what testing should I do to ensure I wont burn up the new relay? Again the door chimes work as they should when the doors open and close, which leads me to believe the doors are working, however I will check ohms when I do the testing I am looking for to ensure I wont trash a $160 relay.

What is F15?, I have a 15a on my relay....

jwyatt8171

F15 refers to plug F pin at column 1 row 5
Careful pulling the plugs out of the CE. They can be brittle and break. There is a red tab on the bottom of the CE(behind wires) that unlocks all the plugs at once. You have to shift it left or right to lock/unlock the plugs. After you shift it I think there is an additional tab to get the plug out as well. Look at it carefully before tugging. Or search for illustrations here might help.

Alan

You pull the red tab striaght out from the panel - the locking bar is what moves left/right as a result of this.

Alan

jwyatt8171

Thanks for the clarification Alan. I had forgot about the locking bar.

Alan

I think you will need to modify the test method to be sure it is a relay fault.
Re:
15a - Ignition - truncates delay with ignition on (optional)
31Z - Negative Lock - truncates delay when locking (optional)

You need to make sure 15a is grounded and that 31Z is at battery voltage - so here connect it to 30A. Then test again.

What you smell in the relay may just be quite normal.

Test again - I think you may still find it works OK

Seperately: test for continuity between CE panel: F15 and ground. You should have continuity when either door is open

Alan

jerybak

holly cow, i will need to buy some new test leads....lol.... I luv buying stuff like that.

so, to be clear the below is my new bench test:

POS to 30A & 31Z
NEG to 31 & 15A
with TK grounded I should have continuity from 31 to 31L.... correct?

chfs911

Kos-007 is spot on. Before doing anything replace the can capacitors in the relay. This will be the most likely fix. Electrolytics degrade and do not always show leaks or bulging of the can.

I do this for 70s amps and they sound much better when the electrolytics are renewed.

Just make sure you fit the identical values.