Block ID help
07-05-2009, 08:45 PM
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Block ID help
I was sorting through 30 years of receipts for my '79 and found one from Andial Porsche Road and Racing shop in Costa Mesa, dated back to 11/25/1986.
The p.o. had a new 5.0 liter block installed with heads and exhaust.
The description for the heads is hard to make out, it looks like-
NPN or HPH or MPM 81 or S1 Cyl Heads, Does this sound familiar to anyone? What type of heads are these?
Now here is weird part.
There are no numbers on the block.
Does anyone know how to identify a block without the numbers?
I appreciate any insight anyone might have on the issue.
BB
The p.o. had a new 5.0 liter block installed with heads and exhaust.
The description for the heads is hard to make out, it looks like-
NPN or HPH or MPM 81 or S1 Cyl Heads, Does this sound familiar to anyone? What type of heads are these?
Now here is weird part.
There are no numbers on the block.
Does anyone know how to identify a block without the numbers?
I appreciate any insight anyone might have on the issue.
BB
07-05-2009, 08:55 PM
#3
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NPN = no part #? Greg B. uses this on receipts for his custom bits.
EDIT: There oughta at least be some casting dates and numbers on the main block and lower girdle. IIRC the casting date is in between the webbing near the rear main seal?
EDIT: There oughta at least be some casting dates and numbers on the main block and lower girdle. IIRC the casting date is in between the webbing near the rear main seal?
07-05-2009, 09:33 PM
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Hmmm, Thanks James. Your positive about this info?
Rob, That's a great guess, but I think I did see some numbers are on the heads somewhere... So I should find some numbers near the main seal, on the bottom or top?
What does IIRC mean?
Rob, That's a great guess, but I think I did see some numbers are on the heads somewhere... So I should find some numbers near the main seal, on the bottom or top?
What does IIRC mean?
07-05-2009, 11:31 PM
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928 111 031 00 is the main exhaust muffler and it's $1000, not thinking 2 new heads would only be $600 in the eighties. Maybe a valve job? Or ...Used 81 S heads from HPH - High Performance House a Porsche tuner shop from the era. They still do 914, 911, 924 and 944 parts.
Heads will have the part numbers on them around the middle of the top lip where the head meets the block.
5.0L block sounds cool, wonder if they fly cut for that or just took thier chances a belt never broke? 5.0L blocks have a larger bolt for the alternator, going into the block. If you pull out the top alternator bolt all will be known... I had to use an insert to use my stock 81 bolt on my 85 blocks. It was too thin.
Heads will have the part numbers on them around the middle of the top lip where the head meets the block.
5.0L block sounds cool, wonder if they fly cut for that or just took thier chances a belt never broke? 5.0L blocks have a larger bolt for the alternator, going into the block. If you pull out the top alternator bolt all will be known... I had to use an insert to use my stock 81 bolt on my 85 blocks. It was too thin.
07-05-2009, 11:46 PM
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Woah! Great info Ricer! I will check out that alt bolt when I get a chance.
Could you explain what you are talking about with the fly cutting and belt issues?
Thanks!
Could you explain what you are talking about with the fly cutting and belt issues?
Thanks!
07-06-2009, 12:01 AM
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If they just stuck a 5.0L block under the 84 or earlier heads, the pistons can contact the valves if the belt breaks. Valves stop moving and pistons continue a bit. Crunch. Fly cutting the pistons puts back the stock pre 84 2 valve cut outs deep enough for the motor to once again be non-interference. Stock 4v pistons have to be modified like this:
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07-06-2009, 12:21 AM
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Your Awesome! I will be sure to check that once the engines out.
This whole time I was feeling pretty good about not having an interference engine. Is it possible to fly a cut a 32v engine? If so, do some guys do it for safety? How much doe it affect compression, is there a formula to calculate the change?
Thanks Again!
This whole time I was feeling pretty good about not having an interference engine. Is it possible to fly a cut a 32v engine? If so, do some guys do it for safety? How much doe it affect compression, is there a formula to calculate the change?
Thanks Again!
07-06-2009, 12:27 AM
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Haven't heard of 32v'ers flycuting for safety. They just keep up with PM and belt changes. Guess it could be done but would surely drop compression.
On the Hybrid engines, especially with the Euro S cams, the fly cuts are a must. Theya re easy to do with an Isky Cams fly cutter, just takes a few days of tedious work... or you can pay a shop to do it in a day, if you double check your measurements first. I have done it both ways and I will never do them myself again.
On the Hybrid engines, especially with the Euro S cams, the fly cuts are a must. Theya re easy to do with an Isky Cams fly cutter, just takes a few days of tedious work... or you can pay a shop to do it in a day, if you double check your measurements first. I have done it both ways and I will never do them myself again.
07-06-2009, 03:36 AM
#10
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Andial wasn't known for being inexpensive, $600 heads, $1k exhaust, and $2k 5.0L block, thats too little for new heads or a new block, maybe its some kind of sublet repair charge like for a rebuilt part. What are the associated labor charges on the bill? That might explain more what was done.
07-06-2009, 12:48 PM
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Total bill was 5000. 2000 in labor does seem kinda cheap, but then again we're talking late '86. This shop did all the repairs and mods to this car. He's spent over 30k in service to this one shop! Maybe they gave him a discount?
07-06-2009, 01:47 PM
#12
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IIRC back in 86 Porsche dealer labor was $85/hr. $3600 in parts, total $5000, only leaves $1400 labor or about 16 hours.
They don't say what the labor charge is for?
I can't read what it says after 5.0L engine "something" OC.
************************
What especially makes no sense, is that doing anything with heads would have a dozen associated parts also being replaced like the head gaskets, timing belt service, etc. This is more like paying the dealer to remove some parts from a car?
They don't say what the labor charge is for?
I can't read what it says after 5.0L engine "something" OC.
************************
What especially makes no sense, is that doing anything with heads would have a dozen associated parts also being replaced like the head gaskets, timing belt service, etc. This is more like paying the dealer to remove some parts from a car?