How do you like the 928 compared to other Porsche models?
03-07-2009, 12:19 AM
#47
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C5 vette, a Mustang and 3 Firebirds - You gotta find better taste!
Edit: And I think there's a car behind the girl, she should get out of the way, girls always getting in the way when there's a camera present.
Edit: And I think there's a car behind the girl, she should get out of the way, girls always getting in the way when there's a camera present.
03-07-2009, 12:20 AM
#48
Nordschleife Master
You must have bought one of the rare convertible 928's then if it was TRIPLE black... The TRIPLE when describing the color of a car (in the beginning of the phraseology anyway) was exterior, interior and CONVERTIBLE TOP colors. So any car that was triple black would be black exterior, black interior, black convertible top material.
So, maybe you had/have a DOUBLE black 928 or maybe you are referring to the color of the tires, or maybe your wheels were painted black, or....what?
So, maybe you had/have a DOUBLE black 928 or maybe you are referring to the color of the tires, or maybe your wheels were painted black, or....what?
03-07-2009, 12:22 AM
#49
Nordschleife Master
I keep hoping I can find her and get her in the company of 7 beautiful 928's to get a little culture in that poor girl... She is hangin' with some real losers in that pic for sure! LOL!
03-07-2009, 12:50 AM
#50
Instructor
Careful throttle control... less forgiving? Not sure what 911 you drove that gave you that impression. Did it by chance have all 4 tires mounted? If you call keeping your foot planted to the floor and conquering twisties as if on a rail "careful throttle control", then that would be correct.
03-07-2009, 02:26 AM
#51
Race Car
Careful throttle control... less forgiving? Not sure what 911 you drove that gave you that impression. Did it by chance have all 4 tires mounted? If you call keeping your foot planted to the floor and conquering twisties as if on a rail "careful throttle control", then that would be correct.
Dan
'91 928GT S/C
475hp/460lb.ft
03-07-2009, 09:37 AM
#52
Reanimator
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Back in the seventies, I was just an EMT working in an emergency room. I got to know all the doctors, and they knew I was a car nut. I got to drive a whole lot of cars that i could never afford when the docs got some new chariot they wanted to show off. I drove three of the 911 series; I didn't like any of them. Honestly, despite their racing success, they're just built wrong. It was a great idea when the engine weighed a hundred pounds and made 38 horsepower, but it grew into something absurd. Think; how many racing prototypes have the engine behind the rear axle? None. They keep selling it the same reason Harley keeps selling outdated engineering, because people buy it; not because it's better.
To answer the original question, I'd like to try the Carrera GT. If I don't like it either, I can always sell it and buy a house with the proceeds. In the meantime, I'll continue to love my 928. Best driving, most comfortable vehicle I've ever owned.
To answer the original question, I'd like to try the Carrera GT. If I don't like it either, I can always sell it and buy a house with the proceeds. In the meantime, I'll continue to love my 928. Best driving, most comfortable vehicle I've ever owned.
03-07-2009, 01:02 PM
#53
Instructor
I'm not mad, just trying to set the record straight! Besides, I don't have any problems driving mine "on the edge".
If you want to talk physics... For the record, the 911 was desinged to UNDERSTEER, not oversteer. the 911's achillies heal is "throttle lift" in the curves. However, the same potential disastorous manuever can actually be used to ones advantage by helping steer the car in the twisties to account for natural understeer tendancy - hence the video you saw. Stock for stock, year for year, a 911 will leave a 928 in the curves every time. Ask me how I know... 9 out of 10 times it will out brake the 928 too. In example, a 928's weigh shifts to the front tires under hard braking, leaving only a tiny contact patch for the rear tires to help slow the car down. Wanna guess what the 911's contact patch looks like under hard braking since there's weight in the rear?
Not trying to stir up a 911 vs 928 debate here. But I feel it is important to understand the facts and not heresay.
If you want to talk physics... For the record, the 911 was desinged to UNDERSTEER, not oversteer. the 911's achillies heal is "throttle lift" in the curves. However, the same potential disastorous manuever can actually be used to ones advantage by helping steer the car in the twisties to account for natural understeer tendancy - hence the video you saw. Stock for stock, year for year, a 911 will leave a 928 in the curves every time. Ask me how I know... 9 out of 10 times it will out brake the 928 too. In example, a 928's weigh shifts to the front tires under hard braking, leaving only a tiny contact patch for the rear tires to help slow the car down. Wanna guess what the 911's contact patch looks like under hard braking since there's weight in the rear?
Not trying to stir up a 911 vs 928 debate here. But I feel it is important to understand the facts and not heresay.
It's not that difficult to understand. Just try throwing a dart backwards and you will see... But seriously, a car that has most of its weight behind the rear axle requires more care when driven at the edge, don't you think? Kinda reminds me of a video of a 930 doing a real fast lap on the Nurburgring. It was funny because the driver kept "sawing" at the steering wheel during turns because the momentum of the rear kept wanting to swing it around. Don't be mad, it's just physics.
Dan
'91 928GT S/C 475hp/460lb.ft
Dan
'91 928GT S/C
475hp/460lb.ft
03-07-2009, 03:02 PM
#54
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Here's , my '79 930....It has 55k original miles and needs restored because someone let it collect dust for years, but runs and drives.
I'm pretty familiar with the 928 vs. 930 discussion. They both have tremendous merit, and really, it's all about how you feel that day. Do you feel like driving to work, or being driven. To me the 928 is point and go, which is why it's known for making bad drivers look like great drivers. The 930 makes bad drivers look like corpses in a morgue (actually). EDIT, It does not do 90 in first- I have fuzzy memory going back a decade to the last healthy 930 I had a chance to rock..
Regards,
Mason
I'm pretty familiar with the 928 vs. 930 discussion. They both have tremendous merit, and really, it's all about how you feel that day. Do you feel like driving to work, or being driven. To me the 928 is point and go, which is why it's known for making bad drivers look like great drivers. The 930 makes bad drivers look like corpses in a morgue (actually). EDIT, It does not do 90 in first- I have fuzzy memory going back a decade to the last healthy 930 I had a chance to rock..
Regards,
Mason
Last edited by 928worldwide; 03-07-2009 at 09:10 PM.
03-07-2009, 08:35 PM
#55
Race Car
Mason, I don't know how you can drive a car and not know max speed in 1st gear, but you are wrong. A 1979 Porsche 930 has these gear ratios:
1st: 2.25:1
2nd: 1.30:1
3rd: 0.89:1
4th: 0.65:1
Reverse: 2.43:1
Final: 4.22:1
A 25" total tire/wheel diameter is approximately right. 26" maximum. So assuming you had the biggest diameter wheel and tire combo at the rear tires (I used 295/35-18 for my calculation), your speed in 1st gear at 7,000RPM would be 57.31 MILES per hour. But look, coincidentally that's 92.3 KILOMETERS per hour. Sounds familiar huh? Please trust me on this, no car with under 1000HP has such a long first gear. A 1979 930 is a 3.3 liter 300hp car that did 0-60mph in 4.9 seconds. If it did have the 1st gear you say, it would accelerate from 0-60mph like a Yugo.
Dan
'91 928GT S/C 475hp/460lb.ft
1st: 2.25:1
2nd: 1.30:1
3rd: 0.89:1
4th: 0.65:1
Reverse: 2.43:1
Final: 4.22:1
A 25" total tire/wheel diameter is approximately right. 26" maximum. So assuming you had the biggest diameter wheel and tire combo at the rear tires (I used 295/35-18 for my calculation), your speed in 1st gear at 7,000RPM would be 57.31 MILES per hour. But look, coincidentally that's 92.3 KILOMETERS per hour. Sounds familiar huh? Please trust me on this, no car with under 1000HP has such a long first gear. A 1979 930 is a 3.3 liter 300hp car that did 0-60mph in 4.9 seconds. If it did have the 1st gear you say, it would accelerate from 0-60mph like a Yugo.
Dan
'91 928GT S/C
475hp/460lb.ft
03-07-2009, 09:05 PM
#56
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Man, it sure seemed like 90 mph.... Honestly, My recollection is coming from 10 years ago when I drove my dads a handful of times, mainly while he was standing in the driveway sweating and swearing because i was only supposed to go around the block! 
This one I have hasn't done more than 30mph around my neighborhood before it smokes the entire zip code out.... like I said, she sat for a very long time... and needs attention....
DAMN IT! I wanted to put the license plate 90in1st on it.... I guess 70 isn't too shabby either. At least not in 1979. Good math Dprantl...
This one I have hasn't done more than 30mph around my neighborhood before it smokes the entire zip code out.... like I said, she sat for a very long time... and needs attention....DAMN IT! I wanted to put the license plate 90in1st on it.... I guess 70 isn't too shabby either. At least not in 1979. Good math Dprantl...
03-07-2009, 10:16 PM
#58
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I'm not mad, just trying to set the record straight! Besides, I don't have any problems driving mine "on the edge".
If you want to talk physics... For the record, the 911 was desinged to UNDERSTEER, not oversteer. the 911's achillies heal is "throttle lift" in the curves. However, the same potential disastorous manuever can actually be used to ones advantage by helping steer the car in the twisties to account for natural understeer tendancy - hence the video you saw. Stock for stock, year for year, a 911 will leave a 928 in the curves every time. Ask me how I know... 9 out of 10 times it will out brake the 928 too. In example, a 928's weigh shifts to the front tires under hard braking, leaving only a tiny contact patch for the rear tires to help slow the car down. Wanna guess what the 911's contact patch looks like under hard braking since there's weight in the rear?
Not trying to stir up a 911 vs 928 debate here. But I feel it is important to understand the facts and not heresay.
If you want to talk physics... For the record, the 911 was desinged to UNDERSTEER, not oversteer. the 911's achillies heal is "throttle lift" in the curves. However, the same potential disastorous manuever can actually be used to ones advantage by helping steer the car in the twisties to account for natural understeer tendancy - hence the video you saw. Stock for stock, year for year, a 911 will leave a 928 in the curves every time. Ask me how I know... 9 out of 10 times it will out brake the 928 too. In example, a 928's weigh shifts to the front tires under hard braking, leaving only a tiny contact patch for the rear tires to help slow the car down. Wanna guess what the 911's contact patch looks like under hard braking since there's weight in the rear?
Not trying to stir up a 911 vs 928 debate here. But I feel it is important to understand the facts and not heresay.
03-07-2009, 11:56 PM
#59
Instructor
Kevin,
I'm not sure I follow your apples to oranges comparison. Take the 917's weight for example. You're comparing the stopping power of S4 brakes on a car that weighed less than 2000lbs?!
What's your point? I can put 912 brakes on a go-cart and have equivalent braking to an Ultima GTR. What is obvious to me is that you've never experienced the eyeball escaping stopping power of a stock 993 with Big Reds. If you want to compare like for like, put a stock 928 GTS w/ Big Blacks up against the 993 and check the skidpad. There ain't no way your 3600lb pig is going to out-brake the lighterweight 993 (less 600lbs) with more contact patch in the rear. Go drive a well sorted 993 and you'll see.
Oh, and just in case it wasn't obvious for you, I won't even respond to that last sentence.
I'm not sure I follow your apples to oranges comparison. Take the 917's weight for example. You're comparing the stopping power of S4 brakes on a car that weighed less than 2000lbs?!
What's your point? I can put 912 brakes on a go-cart and have equivalent braking to an Ultima GTR. What is obvious to me is that you've never experienced the eyeball escaping stopping power of a stock 993 with Big Reds. If you want to compare like for like, put a stock 928 GTS w/ Big Blacks up against the 993 and check the skidpad. There ain't no way your 3600lb pig is going to out-brake the lighterweight 993 (less 600lbs) with more contact patch in the rear. Go drive a well sorted 993 and you'll see. Oh, and just in case it wasn't obvious for you, I won't even respond to that last sentence.
A lot of my friends here will not touch this post, b ut I am just not a creature of restraint. I have owned more 928 and 911's than most anyone here I would bet. The same type brakes on the 928s4 were used to stop the Porsche 917 racer and no 911 I have ever owned could even think of stopping like that. You would be into 997 territory to get the same, look it up( 60-0 ,80-0 , 100-0 braking tests) Porsche owners get so exited about their particular model, and just say these things without knowing. For instance I would never get on a public forum and say my S4 can out-brake a Carrera GT. Ain't happenin'! As far as handling,drive a WELL sorted 928, and get back to me on that.
Last edited by sliceolator; 03-08-2009 at 12:40 AM.
03-08-2009, 12:22 AM
#60
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Do you think I have no experience with the 993? The point of the 917 was not it's weight, though it has some relevance. My point was that car could race 24 hrs at a time without substantial brake fade or glowing rotors. It is what helped it achieve its status . The weight over the rear on a 911 actually hampers brake performance, simple physics dictate this, not my opinion. The 928s4 when tested in 87 was second only to the Ferrari in stopping power. The 911's (all variants) were pretty low on the list. In 2009 not many cars can outbreak the S4 and up variants of the 928. You would need a 997 TT to match it.
I am not being an internet know-it-all, them's just facts. One of the reasons I sold my last 930 was the inadequate braking, squirrelly handling etc. I kept a lot of my 911's for only one reason. They were very fun to drive around town and some backroads. I'd like to have my 930 back though sometimes.
I am not being an internet know-it-all, them's just facts. One of the reasons I sold my last 930 was the inadequate braking, squirrelly handling etc. I kept a lot of my 911's for only one reason. They were very fun to drive around town and some backroads. I'd like to have my 930 back though sometimes.