IcemanG17

If you change your mind and want a pristine 88 automatic that is just about perfect....let me know.....

GT's come at a premium...just because they say GT on the back...... In terms of "value" or performance for the $$$$ its hard to beat a nice S4....especially a 5 speed....99% performance of the GTS for a fraction of the price....

RyanPerrella

GT's make a bit ore HP then S4's. I would say closer to 20-30 RWHP MORE then the S4's. NOT the 10hp that Porsche claims in the literature. Its not JUST the badge, often times there isnt even a badge at all.

ptuomov

Yes, that's the type of car that I am looking for. It is in nice condition, but not perfect. It's almost completely original. The owner clearly thinks highly of the car and has most likely maintained it accordingly. It has colors that I like.

However, would you invest time and money for a pre-purchase inspection of a nice '91 gt with BIN price of $33,700.00? That BIN price tells me that the car is unlikely to be sold, so the PPI effort and expense is going to be a waste.

I have not noticed a discount for red exterior. I would say that black, silver/gray, and red are the exterior colors that fetch the highest prices. All those colors are acceptable to me. Some of the disco fever colors are not.

ptuomov

The important thing for me is the stick shift. I am considering both s4 and gt 5-speed manual cars.

Sailmed

Try, I say TRY, to get your hands on a low mileage 86.5 5spd - just my 2c worth.
Can you tell which is my favorite.

ptuomov

This is frustrating. Today was the third time out of three this year that I was the highest bidder on ebaymotors.com for a 32 valve stick shift 928. "Reserve not met."

If somebody is actually interested in selling their car, please let me know.

Rob Edwards

Maybe fantasyland pricing on good non-Rogerbox sharks isn't as fantastical as you thought?

ptuomov

If someobody would sometimes outbid me, then I would put my failure to buy one in my column. But if time after time I am the highest bidder, it's at least not obvious that I am wrong about the price levels.

When the price gap is bridged and these 5-speeds start trading again, I am happy to buy one. Even if the market price settles to a higher level than where I predicted. I just don't want to be the only sucker paying 2008 prices.

Look, I know I may be pissing some people off by writing stuff like this. I am not doing this to agitate anybody. I am just looking to buy a car at some price that is close to whatever the average price for 2009 will be.

The situation is the same with houses. Generally, one can't buy a house right now, because the asking prices are much higher than the market clearing level. Buyers don't buy and the sellers don't sell, until they have to because of a divorce, layoffs, babies, etc. And at that point, they'll be holding a firesale. Nobody wins.

Landseer

Well, that's one strategy.

Maybe take the uber-MBA hat off, call the latest attempted seller, offer 10% above your last bid and drive one home.

Charley B

The more rare a certain model of car is the less it is affected by market forces. An automatic S4 may require a large concession to sell in a bad market, but a well sorted, low mileage, 5 speed is going to be a different matter. Eventually the market will have it's say, but it will take longer to occur.

Signed: Junior Uber-MBA.

cold_beer839

Be careful on eBay, there is some junk on there. Don't rush to buy one.

Now eat the fortune cookie Grasshopper.

ptuomov

After all three auctions, I have exchanged emails with the potential seller after the auction. Look, I am very practical about this. I just want to buy a car, why does it have to be this difficult?

Landseer

I don't know why. Maybe just hang-out a bit.

We've seen some nice 5spds come available on both ends of the price spectrum. Just happens, hard to predict timing on it.

I've had far better luck discovering the cars that were maintained and cared for for years, just not lately, and have made economical purchases on a few. But I like doing the garage work as much/more than driving them, so that's a different equation.

Your best answer might just be patience and word of mouth, turning over rocks. Will keep eyes open for a sorted 5 speed.

Marine Blue

Remember that many people use ebay as a means of advertising their cars. Most don't expect to sell to the right buyer through ebay, they expect to complete the transaction after bidding has ended.

I sold my 87 S4 for $4K more than the highest bid on ebay. The buyer saw it listed on ebay and contacted me after bidding had ended. He wanted to see the car and test drive it before buying.

My point......Just because bidding reaches a certain level doesn't necessarily mean that is the going rate. Sellers who own the rare cars usually know what they have and where it should be priced.

If you want something bad enough and the supply is small enough you may have to pay more to get it.

Good thing is that the weather isn't cooperating and you have plenty of time to find a car before the spring.

Good luck and definitely feel free to post your progress.

Rob Edwards

Ptuomov-

Didn't mean to sound like I was being smug or a smartass, Sorry. I happened to buy the first GT I looked at, and even though the PPI checked out, I have subsequently put as much into the car as I paid in the first place. I paid $17.5K (full asking price) in 2006 for a '90GT with 107K miles on it. Too much? Probably. But I wanted the car, knew I was going to spend a lot more on making it as good as I can, and didn't want the hassle of chasing leads all over the country. It is generally true that buyers don't put as much of a premium on proper maintenance as sellers (who paid top dollar for parts and labor, or parts+sweat equity) do. Hence the pricing gap on nicer cars- the seller's got more into the car, they know they don't get back what they're in it for, but they're in no hurry to actualize the loss. This economy is going to weed out plenty of people who are going to HAVE to sell toys, it's going to be a buyer's market for quite some time. If it's not to your liking yet, then wait. It will be.

OR- You could be an optimist and rationalize that in 2009 if you pay 10% too much for a 5-speed in good condition, and you have to sell it at the end of the year, you're out 10%. BFD, cars depreciate. If you need to make money on ownership to have a 928, yer buyin' the wrong car. Besides, overpaying $2K, or 4K, or 5K on a 928 is jack compared to A) what people are paying on depreciation on most 2008 transportation applicances, and B) what you're going to spend on the car getting it to how you like it.
I would submit a 10% loss on a 928 purchase price ('investment' (hah...)) is better than you'll do in almost any equity market this year. And keeping your powder dry in money market accounts is BORING. So stimulate the economy, and get out there and pay a premium for a no-stories 5 speed in as good a cosmetic condition as you can. The mechanical stuff is cheaper to fix, and you sound like a DIYer given all your inquires about intakes and the like.

Like Nike says, just do it!