6mil928

Despite what the manual says I'm gonna say no to the lube. Always install dry and never hear the screeching.

Bill Ball

So, this looks like pretty common antiseize : graphite, aluminuim and zinc. Or am I wrong about that? It has no copper, which you want to avoid with aluminum on steel.

Tails

I use Racol Anti sieze compound on thread and collars and torque up with a tension wrench to specified torque.
I also lining up the red tipped wheel stud in line with the valve stem on each wheel to ensure correct balancing of all rotating parts of wheel.

Over 9 years of use of RACOL on wheel studs and nuts and no problems. As a matter of fact, all removed nuts, bolts and set screws or set bolts always have their threads coated with RACOL to ensure ease of removal in future.

Tails 1990 928S4 Auto.

WallyP

I have had to drill a seized and broken lug nut off of an expensive wheel - it wasn't pretty. We tried everything available before resorting to the hole saw. The wheel was still usable, but scarred.

It didn't help that the broken nut was 2" deep in a tight hole...

RKD in OKC

When I first started driving Porsches over 10 years ago the local Porsche shop told me to always use a little daub of anti-seize on the threads before replacing lugs. Told of the numerous times their custom made hole saw/lug removal tool was necessary to get wheels off.

Don't forget to point the crest on the center cap at the valve stem.

Jadz928

WTF? Yea, that's top on my list.

Incendier

Amen to that. This is one of the worst jobs known to man.

Believe it or not, it's Porsche "protocol" that the valve stem, point of the crest, and one lug are in line. Not that it matters one hoot.

worf928

I remember reading the WSM page a decade ago. I dimly recall doing some googling (search engine of the day was Alta Vista back then) and determining that the Optimally TA was more-or-less aluminum-based anti-seize paste and the CU was copper-based anti-seize.

To this day I've never once had a nut that was either too loose or too tight.

We didn't quite try everything. The Dremel with the snake attachment was MIA. I've successfully removed the lug collet with a Dremel and various of the cutting tips. It's a real PITA, but you can do it with less damage to the wheel than with a hole saw. It certainly isn't as quick as a hole saw though.

But, in the case you reference, the primary issue was someone (other than you or me) using an air impact wrench with a cracked socket. The cracked socket only applied force to the top of the lug nut. This if course just banged the hex part of the nut off of the collet. The socket in question was a 'normal' socket and not an impact socket. So, it's also possible that the socket cracked while the air tool was being used the first time. I don't think lube/anti-seize of any sort would have helped in that case.

That particular incident was the final nail in the air-tool coffin for the magnesium OEM nuts as far as I was concerned. Prior I'd never used air tools on those nuts. But at this point I tell folks around here never, ever to use air tools on those and relate our little nut experience to reinforce. Never use air tools on those. They don't like them at all. Since then I've had to replace nuts or chase wheel stud threads on other people's 928s on which air tools had likely been used prior.

WallyP

Yeah, not fun. But if you'll notice, I said that we tried everything available. The better Dremel, the custom hole saw - all that would have been nice, as would have been killing the culprit.

worf928

Whoops. Missed 'available' at the first read.

Heh. There were quite a few rather pissed folks in the vicinity. One of them rather tall and large. It would have made for a smallish - but effective - lynch mob.

DR

Yeah, and unless you feel comfortable with only 4 lug nuts at 150MPH+, the wheel isn't really usable :-(

What's even worse is those were a borrowed set of wheels from a 928 friend, trying to find a perfect exact replacement wasn't easy and lead to even more drama, but is too long of a story.

Thanks to both of you for reminding me of this nightmare...but the "culprit" was also a friend who was just trying to help out. so its not like we really could have lynched him...???

ew928

They need to make a EZ-Out socket sorta like a left handed hole saw to grip the last vestiges of the lug nut collar so it can be spun off the lug.


Never knew about those black impact wrench sockets till then.
I'm not going to repost the pictures of the de-threaded alloy lug nut that's been through too many of the air impact wrench dance.
And no Mr. Mechanic, you can't use those torque stiks on my alloy lug nuts.
Putting a funny colored piece of steel between the 200 fl-lbs PLUS impact wrench and the lug nuts don't make it right.

So everybody, go lube your nuts.
Or don't.

dr bob

There are many that will argue the issue of using graphite products on the aluminum. IIRC, the Porsche recommendation is for applying a thin coating to the cone face of the nut, but they do not recommend adding any to the threads. Adding any oil or friction reducer to the threads changes the pressure applied to the face at a given wheel nut torque, so there would be a threat to inadvertently over-pressure the metal face junction.

I've been using a thin coating of waterproof non-graphite grease (Redline CV-2) for years now with good results. My use pattern may not be typical, since the wheels are off regularly for cleaning and inspection. The only water that the wheels and suspension parts see is when washing the car. There is no salt used on our sunny warm-weather-only roads, so electrolysis in not an issue. Add in religious use of the torque wrench too.

For those who follow the red-stud philosophy, a reminder that the red stud is an indicator of how the wheel and tire combo was installed at the factory, useful for diagnostics only when the original wheel and tire is installed. Many of us have replaced the wheels, all but one or two museum cars have had tires replaced. That said, I still follow the habit. Unless you are doing on-car balancing of the whole rotating assemblies and need to reinstall the wheels/tires back in their as-balanced relative postions, the practice is of no real value.

hacker-pschorr

Good post Dr.bob - I was wondering about that.

In some shop manual (Audi, Mercedes, Porsche, cannot remember) it stated if lube needed to be applied to the threads, use a small drop of conventional motor oil. Nothing else. I've been trying to find that document for clarification.

worf928

I was trying to protect the innocent by not naming folks.