Mike Frye

This morning I got in my car and found that my previously comfortable shift into 1st was sloppy.

There used to be a spring somewhere (in the tranny?) that I could feel compressing as I pushed over into the 1-R gate, but now it's gone. It's never really (since I got it) had the feeling of centering from 4-5 over to the 2-3 gate where it belongs.

I found a reference in another thread that said the '85-'86 has a single spring somewhere in the tranny that is supposed to do this, while the '87+ have two springs IIRC.

Anyway, in the past year I've replaced the forward shift ball cup, rear coupler, release arm ball cup as well as the clutch, T/O bearing, and clutch slave cylinder.

The shifting was crisp except for the lack of centering from 4-5 to 2-3. Now it doesn't offer any resistance to the shift over to 1-R.

Can someone point me to what I'm going to have to fix?

The searches I did turned up some references, but no thread that explained exactly what the part was or how to fix it.

Also- Is there now a part floating around in my tranny that will hose something up (I have a 2 mile drive home from the train station).

WallyP

The spring in question is a leaf spring on the side of the case, and is the last part to come out of the case...

Bummer!

If I remember correctly, the manual for rebuilding the transaxle is on the Jim Morehouse tech info CD set, as well as bing in the Factory Shop Manual set (also on the CDs).

Vilhuer

Yes but if selector went numb without immediate gearbox destruction its likely that slow speed drive will not destroy anything since loose piece(s) are very likely already in drain
plug magnet. Check post #12 in this thread for pictures whats in there and how it breaks:
https://rennlist.com/forums/928-forum/227420-main-input-bearing-seal-leaking.html

There is only one troublesome sideways spring in all '85-95 5sp boxes. '85-86 is even more difficult to remove than '87-95 version but both versions can be changed when just one gearbox internal selector shaft is partially removed. Hopefully '85-86 spring is still available. If not, several other parts need to be changed for '87-95 spring to work.

Since gearbox needs to come down anyway its good practice to do many other things while at it like change all shaft seals and reverse gear lock spring (if available still) even if its not worn.

Mike Frye

This is not what I wanted to hear at all! Thanks for the responses Wally and Erkka. I really appreciate it.

OK, calling all transmission gurus!!! (Kevin)

Let me know what you want to eat or drink and how you feel about spending a few Saturdays in my garage this fall/winter or at least on-call while I'm there with my laptop and camera next to me.

I'm going to be a 5-speed expert by the time I'm done with this or I'm going to die trying.

I've always been deathly afraid of tackling anything inside the transmission because it looks like a Swiss watch in there. This will be the last piece of the puzzle though and since I've already replaced virtually everything that affects shifting it should be smoooooth when I'm done, right?

Looking for WYAITS...

Edit: Errka, great pics and write-up. Thanks a million!

Mike Frye

Thanks Wally, I've got the CDs. Looks like I've got some homework to do...

Vilhuer

More than you ever wanted to know about 5sp rebuild. Read it all, twice

https://rennlist.com/forums/928-forum/349802-rebuilding-1988-manual-transaxle-after-wasting-2710-at-local-shop.html
https://rennlist.com/forums/928-forum/333495-reverse-gear-lock-and-spring.html

Mike Frye

Got it, thanks. I think I remember reading that first one. My search either yielded several pages of barely related stuff or nothing. Thanks again.

*shakes head contemplating the work involved*

I am NOT looking forward to this. The car was running so well too.

Mike Frye

Can anyone clue me in on a list of parts I'll need or any WYAITs for this job?

Vilhuer

For '85 MY box:
- Complete seal kit, well under $100 I think
- Sideways flat spring, $150-200 or little more even
- Reverse gear lock spring, $10-20

Thats minimum. Maximum is all new syncro rings, bearings, selector mechanism, gears etc. Sky is the limit. I would change two small bearings which support internal selector shaft at least since they seem to be almost always in bad shape when fairly used box is opened. They only cost maybe $10-20 but are somewhat difficult to change, especially if all gearbox stuff is in.

Mike Frye

Thanks Errka,

I'll be placing a call to my friendly neighborhood parts supplier soon. Just wanted to get an idea. I've never opened one of these up before so I'm more than a little nervous...

I really appreciate the advice and your time.

GregBBRD

That spring is very big and it is very rare to not have it go between the gears and ruin a bunch of expensive stuff. I would not assume that the magnet on the drain plug will grab ahold of it and keep it contained. I'd pull the drain plug and try to get the debris out, even if you plan on only using the vehicle on a minimal basis.

There are three versions of that spring, only two are offered as a spare part. The early version is retained by a circlip on the "pin" that the spring rides on and is virtually impossible to remove, with the gearbox together. The later version does not have a circlip and actually can be replaced without disassembling the transmission. Your '85 model will likely have the circlip. If you can figure out a really trick pair of circlip plyers, it would be possible to replace the spring, however, with 213K, you probably should go in and look at the wear pieces. The input bearing (which is almost always worn and replaced on a rebuild) is right at $500.00, BTW. The syncros are now also more than a $100.00 each.

The springs seem to be breaking quite frequently, as the cars get older. We are to the point where we will not rebuild a gearbox, without replacing the spring with a new part. Porsche has no stock, in this country, and the spring must be ordered from Germany, so plan ahead. (We do stock both versions, if you get into a bind.)

Vilhuer

It can be done. Circlip can be removed and installed with small flat screwdriver. During installation small piece of tape also helps. Suitable magnet is also very useful. Though you are right that its very good idea to do complete rebuild while at it and it gets expensive very quickly.

WallyP

Greg said:
"The input bearing (which is almost always worn and replaced on a rebuild) is right at $500.00, BTW."

Our web site shows "Transaxle Input Bearing - 5-Speed, '85-'86,
P/N 928.302.152.10, $50.02"

Different part?

Mike Frye

I definitely need to work with someone who has done this before. I'll be starting another thread once I do some more research with part numbers and diagrams so the masses can chime in and newbies can learn right along with me.

Erkka,

That first link is great stuff! But it ends in a cliff hanger on page 12.

Maybe mine will be more complete...

Jim bailey - 928 International

The 78-84 input bearing is nearly $500. The 85-86 is part # 928 302 152 06 and does shows a $50 list price I do not have any in stock to confirm the price. The 87 input bearing is part # 999 052 138 00 @ $280.