ROG100

I have plenty of R12 and sell it for $25 a can.
I am waiting for a new shipment and maybe able to discount it a little as I bought a bulk lot.
Roger

dprantl

Well, sometimes people lose sight of the point they are trying to achieve. If a converted R134A system can get the inside of the car cold enough in a short enough period of time, does it really matter that it's blowing 35 deg F air out the vents instead of 29 deg F air? It really doesn't matter to me, my R134A GT (and my previous R134A '86 converted by me) can make my fingertips numb if I hold them to the vents for 30 seconds in a 97deg F 95% humid day of Atlanta heat. Why would anyone need more cooling than that?

Dan
'91 928GT S/C

Bill51sdr

I'm not saying there aren't exceptions, but just going on my experiences. I have a black car & EVERY degree counts .

Don Carter

If you are asking about Freeze12, I decided to give it a try about a month ago. Got a kit on ebay for about $43 with the fittings, the hose, 3 cans of F12, 1 can of oil, and 1 can of leak stop (didn't use).

I changed the fittings which was pretty easy, and put in the oil first, then sometime during the 1st can of F12, the compressor came on. There were still bubbles after the 2nd can, so I added the 3rd which cleared the sight glass. Didn't use any guages but I know that's the proper way to do it.

A/C has been working great ever since.

Freeze 12 is not propane, and is not flamable and IS approved as a replacement for R12. It's mostly 134A with some additives to make it compatible with R12.

May not work for everyone, but it worked for me, and If I have a slow leak, I can easily recharge each year.

Jadz928

I should have made it clear that I called the stealership today and they quoted $312 for an AC recharge.

Bill51sdr

Whew! I was a bit worried about you there. I imagine they must be quoting a full service there, but still...

I see Randy V's been busy/bored again.

Bill Ball

It's true that Freeze-12 is not isobutane or propane-based and is not flammable. Freeze -12 is 80% R-134a and 20% another CFC that is intended to make it compatible with R-12 systems. These blends have other problems with differential vapor pressures and oil carrying capacity/miscibility. So, in other words, should you have slow leak, and periodically top-off the Freeze-12, you could eventually end up with a ratio of components that fails. Might as well go all the way to R-134a.

http://www.epa.gov/Ozone/snap/refrig.../macssubs.html

The real bad ones:
http://www.epa.gov/Ozone/snap/refrig.../unaccept.html
http://www.epa.gov/Ozone/snap/refrigerants/hc-12a.html

joejoe

Bill, I am using a product called autofrost. It runs at lower pressure and is very, very cold. If you were a bit closer you could come by and try it or charge with r12 (I have 2 30lb. cans) and most testing equipment (looking for gas analyser now)

On a side note ROG100 when you get some cans I would be interested.

Bill Ball

Autofrost is an even more complex CFC blend. It contains mostly R-22 which can pentetate even barrier hoses.

ROG100

I have about 50 cans of R12 and another 36 on the way.
Because I am keen that owners have the opportunity to buy R12 at a reasonable price I will sell 3 cans for $20 a can plus shipping.
You must order 3 cans to get this deal.
817 430 2688 or Roger@928sRus.com

UKKid35

I have used Isceon49 by Dupont for the last four years, no conversion neccessary, very happy with performance.

http://refrigerants.dupont.com/Suva/.../isceon49.html

I contacted George Goble of Autofrost before choosing Isceon49 and he was very helpful. Checkout his Wikipedia entry.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Goble

Bill Ball

Isceon49 is 88% R-134a with 9% propane-derivative and 3% iso-butane (enough to be flammable) and is not approved in the US. The problems of dropping R-134a in an R-12 system without changing the seals or oil will eventually pop up.

UKKid35

Why does the MSDS say it's non flamable? Curious to think that a multinational like Dupont would risk stating something that is false.

Bill51sdr

Roger, that is a great deal. I will be in touch in the morning and will probably want 5 cans. Thanks for your service .

Nicole

San Carlos Radiator told me today what Bill Ball stated earlier: Most of the replacements are blends, and their components often leak separately. So you end up with some unknown mixture, and nobody will ever want to evacuate the system, because nobody knows what's in there now and what to do with it.

He highly recommended to stay with R12 until I'm ready to redo all seals, the compressor (as they often seize shortly after R-134 conversion), and a few other necessary items.