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Broken Water Pump Bolt Repair

 
Old 07-19-2007, 12:15 PM
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Earl Gillstrom
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Default Broken Water Pump Bolt Repair

I just discovered a new tool that could assist us in removal of broken water pump bolts. I have replaced many water pumps on 928s but have been very lucky. I have never had a broken water pump bolt. I just did a timing belt, water pump on a 944 and had two broken bolts. This 944 has 365,000 miles with the original owner. I broke off a drill in one and an EZ-OUT in the other. I did manage to get them out, but after a lot of cussing.

I just received a Quik Center broken bolt drill guide system.
Take a look at WWW.boltmasterusa.com for detail.
This is an interesting system since it is designed to center a drill for all types of bolt failures, bolt sticking up or flush or below surface.

The other interesting thing is that they have a kit to remove the most common sizes that break on a 928, P/N# QC2331C provides both 6mm-1.0 and 8mm-1.25 for $18.89 plus shipping.
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Old 07-19-2007, 12:56 PM
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That looks pretty cool. And the price is right too.

What's your take on how quickly these get used up? (I note that they carry replacement parts for the centering part.)

Their web site needs some help though.
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Old 07-19-2007, 01:34 PM
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I wish I'd had these when I've failed to remove broken bolts in past! Problem was always going off centre. Last time was with broken off corroded bolts for rear rotor dust shields (luckily they seem fine with 1 or 2 bolts left off). I may well order a set even with international shipping on top, or see if anyone is importing them here in UK.
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Old 07-19-2007, 02:32 PM
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What's your take on how quickly these get used up? (I note that they carry replacement parts for the centering part.)

Don't know. Just received mine and don't have any broken bolts right now (and hope never). That's why I bought them. To scare off the demons.

I guess it would depend how off center the drill motor is while drilling. Even if you have to buy one for every broken bolt, it would be worth it.
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Old 07-19-2007, 03:00 PM
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I've only had one broken bolt - my first TB/WP job. And, yes, I had a problem with center drilling due to the bad sight line to the lower holes even with the radiator pulled. I ended up turning the bolt removal into a bit of a nightmare, breaking off a tap in what I thought was a correctly drilled hole, while actually a cresent of the old bolt remained and the tap caught on it an snapped. I finally found the center by using the old WP as a guide, inserting a small bushing in the bolt hole in the pump housing. After that, the shell of the old bolt literally fell out.

This could be a handy tool, although I have been lucky and not seen any broken bolts in the dozen or so subsequent jobs. Perhaps the few simple steps I take to break the corrosion (penetrant soak, swift smack of each bolt head, better feel for bolts that are about to snap and treating them with more penetrant, heat and a few more smacks) is doing the job.
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Old 07-19-2007, 03:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Bill Ball
Perhaps the few simple steps I take to break the corrosion (penetrant soak, swift smack of each bolt head, better feel for bolts that are about to snap and treating them with more penetrant, heat and a few more smacks) is doing the job.
Yes I have to admit I broke dustshield bolts when I was getting over-confident and didn't bother with penetrant.

Also having broken some I now have a better idea of what it feels like when you're about to break 'em!
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Old 07-19-2007, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Earl Gillstrom
That's why I bought them. To scare off the demons.
Yeah. For the money they seem like a very cheap incantation.
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Old 01-22-2008, 11:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Bill Ball View Post
I've only had one broken bolt - my first TB/WP job. And, yes, I had a problem with center drilling due to the bad sight line to the lower holes even with the radiator pulled. I ended up turning the bolt removal into a bit of a nightmare, breaking off a tap in what I thought was a correctly drilled hole, while actually a cresent of the old bolt remained and the tap caught on it an snapped. I finally found the center by using the old WP as a guide, inserting a small bushing in the bolt hole in the pump housing. After that, the shell of the old bolt literally fell out.

This could be a handy tool, although I have been lucky and not seen any broken bolts in the dozen or so subsequent jobs. Perhaps the few simple steps I take to break the corrosion (penetrant soak, swift smack of each bolt head, better feel for bolts that are about to snap and treating them with more penetrant, heat and a few more smacks) is doing the job.

THATS AWESOME!
No more broken bolts...
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Old 01-23-2008, 12:06 AM
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No real broken bolt issues, but have had issues from people doing them on others cars in the past, and have stripped the threads in the block.
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Old 01-23-2008, 10:18 AM
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This looks like a neat tool Earl. Thanks for the link. I'll add one to the boatbox too. (Now if someone can come up with a way to just move the Perkins over so I can drill, I'd get at the heat exchanger mount - I'd love to get rid of the glob of JB weld.)
I seem to remember a thought of Jim's about building a WP jig - did anything ever progress with that?
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Old 01-23-2008, 11:15 AM
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This looks like a neat tool Earl. Thanks for the link. I'll add one to the boatbox too. (Now if someone can come up with a way to just move the Perkins over so I can drill, I'd get at the heat exchanger mount - I'd love to get rid of the glob of JB weld.)
I seem to remember a thought of Jim's about building a WP jig - did anything ever progress with that?

How about a right angle drill instead of moving the engine over?
I don't know if Jim ever did anything with the jig. Too many golf tournaments, I think.
I am probably one of the few that thinks 928s are easy to work on. Too many boat engines in the past. I think the boats were too small. Never worked on one of those > 65' boats with a walk-in engine room.
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Old 01-23-2008, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Earl Gillstrom View Post
How about a right angle drill instead of moving the engine over?
.
I'll be trying that when the tool arrives - centering the drill has been the problem. I can get my head in for a look, but sticking my head in an area and then swinging a hammer? Maybe it's genetic, but somehow this has never worked for me without injury.... and I didn't want to make a mistake in the Aves when I did the repair... It would have meant no head or engine
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Old 01-23-2008, 12:30 PM
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The drill guide issue can sometimes be addressed by putting the pump back on, and using a guide bushing with the hole the old pump housing. I haven't tried this. I have used pilot punches in similar situations though, to at least get the drill started in the right spot on the bolt. A set of those punches is not so expensive, but you do need some room to work. The radiator needs to come out for sure, but that's not a big deal when you have almost all of the connections loose already. The AC condenser needs to be moved forward if possible and protected, or removed completely.


My last "big boat" project had a little Yanmar diesel tucked into a tiny well. Might as well have been in a 15' runabout as far as access. Still tight, standing on your head, to do almost anything to it. I was smart enough to put a hatch on the deck above it so it could be removed easily. The good news is that the little diesel was bulletproof, and would motor our 60' sailboat easily at 8+ knots. The boat was pretty slippery...
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Old 01-23-2008, 01:47 PM
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great if some threads are sticking out. But then I would turn a nut on and mig weld it to the bolt. 9 times out of ten it would turn out after flash heating the bolt.
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Old 01-23-2008, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Firemed View Post
I'll be trying that when the tool arrives - centering the drill has been the problem. I can get my head in for a look, but sticking my head in an area and then swinging a hammer? Maybe it's genetic, but somehow this has never worked for me without injury.... and I didn't want to make a mistake in the Aves when I did the repair... It would have meant no head or engine
I sheared a bolt off below the surface during my TBWP (one next to the oil pump that holds on the rear cover).

I had the same problem centering a punch - it kept slipping off the knurl in the middle.

In the end a local 928er recommended I make a guide by chopping the top off another bolt (leave some shank to stick into the hole to keep t located), and drilling through the center of it on the bench. I used the head of the bolt that sheared - trimmed it slightly so that it fit properly into the hole without touching the stuck shank.

dr bob's also right about removing the radiator - makes a lot more space in there.. but cut some ply to cover the AC condenser, so it doesn't get damaged by bashing it with tools.

Here's the pieces including the guide..



Here's the guide held in place with some vise grips..

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