LuckyRR

I am sure this has been brought up before, but......

Where do you think the 928 market is in, and where do you perceive it to be 5 years from now?

I have been remotely watching the pricing for the past several years, and my

perception is that it hasn't changed much. Do you forsee and of the early cars

become collectable or increasing much in value? I think the end of the model

run manual trans S4's and GT/GTS will hold value and maybe slightly

appreciate, but how about the rest of the cars? Do you think the market on

these cars will be stagnut? As these cars continue to age, do you believe the

scarcity of parts and rarity of the cars will help or hurt the values? Thanks for

your advice, input, and thoughts. Let's discuss!

LndShrk

Pesonally I hope the market stays the way it is right now. I've just gotten into the 928 scene and I intedent to stay in it and if prices go up I won't be able to own mutiple sharks.

IcemanG17

This topic has been discussed at length many many time.....but heres my opinion

928 values have been slowly climbing according to certain Porsche magazines.....it seems that the price is highly dependent on the MY-transmission and condition.....of course a nice low mileage concour winning condition 928 will command top $$ vs a 175K mile beater that barely runs....

I do think that the "deferred" maintainence 928's that are neglected are slowly dying....and will all find their way to the junkyard...once the bulk of the beaters are gone...only nice 928's will be left & the prices will rise accordingly...since most of us would not sell out nice 928's for anything less than top $$$

928ntslow

Courtshark

Brian hit the nail on the head. Keith has the correct amount of popcorn to wait out any significant rise in a 928's value; they don't yet, and may never, have the nostaligic appeal of the 60s and 70s muscle cars; when I was in high school (sorry guys, only 11 years ago) I could have bought a decent running 71 GTO for $3500. Today that same car, in the same decent condition, would be well over $10k, if not $20k. Color & transmission don't matter as much as they seem to with 928s. The market for the old muscle has undeniably taken off, though.

I view the 928 as the most refined muscle car of all time, and so I see the potential for them to enjoy the same rise in value. But as Brian said, once the beaters get either resurrected or sent to their graves, only prime examples will remain; simple supply (and higher quality of supply) and demand principles will apply at that point (note the Pano article this month about the guy who always wanted a 928 and now he finally has one; and he's not Kevin Spacey; "they" are out there, or are here as lurkers!).

Larry Velk

I'll brag that I've got a decent record on predictions as I had 3 Vette's and 3 TR250/6's that I got at the bottom and made a few bucks on. I'm predicting 928's, Fiat 124 Spiders, Alfa GTV6's, and 50's US cars to go up slightly. A crash is coming in 60's US stuff. This was my era (B. 1950) and, I'm sorry, the cars were junk. The 50's stuff is more interesting and will replace the 60's as the hot item. "Sports Car Market" - kind of a bible, hates 928's. One of the main contributers is a big air-cooled guy who says our car are stupidly complex and hard to work on. The editor is a Ferrari guy. They usually have bad things to say about 928's that are sold (BTW, this mag gives sales results, NOT asking prices - then gives a car review of the sold vehicle condition and value).
Thanks to our great parts suppliers owning a 928 and DRIVING it is a real practical proposition. I'm against anything that makes that less realistic - whether that means the price going up OR down!

AO

Supply and demand. Ebay is a great litmus for the general market, but you have to take MY, equipment, and condition all into consideration.

I would say similar to Brian's comments that the junky ones are becoming more plentiful and are driving the "average selling price" down. The nice ones that are current on PM, and in good overall condition are relatively scarce and thus values are rising, but you just don't see them as often.

Wait until September when people begin thinking about wintering their broken 928 one more year. There will be a flood of crappy 928's with a few descent cars intermixed. If'n you're lucky, you can get one of those good cars at the price of the crappy ones.

bronto

Ebay is a great litmus test for the bottom of the market. By definition, an auction is a desperation sale....there is a firm date at which time the highest bid gets the car. No waiting for the right buyer to find it here. No marketing, etc., and you (the seller) are praying that the high bidder follows through.

Yes, you can set a reserve price and a minimum bid, but in the eBay market those don't attract bidders; until a reserve is met or an initial bid happens, interested parties will often wait for a car to be relisted without those constraints. When those things do happen, then it's back to a desperation sale with a firm closing date.

AO

I disagree with your assessment. I think Ebay is one of the best indicators for establishing an equilibrium/market price given the current supply and demand for the vehicles that are indicative of the type of vehicle normally seen on ebay. Are there some desperate sellers? Yes. But an auction is not a desperation sale per se in the guise of Ebay. Now if we're talking about Bob's Used Car Lot having an auction, then I would tend to agree with you.

Courtshark

I think eBay used to be the desperation sale site, but now you often see very respectable sellers and high quality cars on eBay. I've had my share of headaches buying and selling cars on there for sure, but today I think it's a great sales tool. It gives the seller and buyers a definitive end date whereas with classifieds the sale could take arguably far longer than it should. eBay also provides a significantly wider audience of buyers for the cars than you'd get from just posting it here or in the Pano, or in your local paper. With respect to valuation, eBay will tend to run lower for beaters, but not horrendously off. It can run, high, too, for quality or rare examples. Cars.com and Autotrader can be good, too, but are more for dealers these days.

How did the Frog sale end up (the '79 with no miles on it posted here a while ago)?

mj1pate

I agree. It didn't take long to find a good example on Ebay, owned by an enthusiast, for a decent price. Coordinating PPI and obtaining information from the owner was no problem. I drove it 4000 miles in 11 days after picking it up with no issues. There were certainly "other" cars that either had no pedigree, or were of indiscernible quality. In 2.5 weeks, I located 2 that were worth buying. That's not bad....

Mike

bronto

Alright, "desperation" is hyperbole on my part, but it's still not a good place to sell special interest vehicles for what they're worth. You still have a very short sales period, and you are limiting your market to buyers who are comfortable buying a car 1) often sight-unseen, 2) have quick access to cash, 3) can figure out delivery obstacles in short order, and 4) can deal with drivability issues and PPI prior to delivery. That's a very narrow market.

Compare that scenario with two near-alternatives:
1) High end auctions. Not many cars can justify this, but those that can get "marketed". Brochures, announcements, hype, even a chance to be seen on Speed. Lots of lead time for interested parties to plan on bidding, PPI, delivery, financing, etc. This is a real test of market value for cars like Kermit.
2) Major metro area auto listings. This is the best opportunity to get a good price for the rest of us. Classifieds are inexpensive and can run a long time. There are enthusiasts for your vehicle in every geographic areas. Buyers in outlying areas are accustomed to going into "the city" hunting for treasures and are prepared to do so. Online listings can pull buyers from across the US just like eBay. There's usually more time to arrange for financing, PPI and delivery (you're not desperate, remember?).

Ask yourself this question: If you're looking for a "deal", where's the best place to look? eBay, because we (rennlisters) are usually prepared to use our expertise to minimize the risks that eBay presents.

Kermit, BTW, got one bid at 45k, the starting price, which was apparently no where close to the reserve price. But he said that he didn't expect it to sell, and listing it on eBay was a very effective way of getting exposure to the car and letting people know that it is available. And that it's gonna cost an aweful lot more than 45k. Very cheap advertising.

Either way, an eBay seller is saying "I'll take whatever I can get by such and such a date". If that's NOT desperation, it's close.

heinrich

ad nauseam yes speculation ... if you search for 928 prices or 928 values you will have enough to read for the next decade

Dan87951

I just sold my 88 928 S4 auto on ebay for $12,700. All service up to date and only 70k original miles. Have close to 4k in receipts in the last year including belt service. I believe the buyer got an excellent buy on my car. In my opinion there are alot of people who are unrealistic with there asking prices and these cars tend to let people think this is the market for them but no one is willing to pay it on a 20+ year old 80's supercar. Ebay seems to be a better judge of what people are willing to pay. I was not desperate to sell my car at all! I knew I had a nice car and it would eventually sell! Sure I could have waited 6months or a year and probably got a few thousand more but its just not worth my time. Plus you can look at the completed auction and get an idea of what your car will bring in your area which I was happy with so I listed it. I knew full well that the car would bring at least 12k on ebay and I was right. To tell you the truth I just got sick of the BS'ers out there. I just don't have the time to deal with them.
I will have another 928, but this time it will be a manual..

bronto

We have buyers talking here. Of course you're happy, you got good deals. What about sellers? Every eBay seller I've talked to thought that they could get more for their vehicles if the stuck with local classifieds (including the "traders"), but were tired of the process and wanted to dump it. That's how I got mine. Mine is a pretty good example and he had it listed in St. Louis for 6k. After he got tired I bought on eBay for a little over 4k. And I had to figure delivery cost into the "is it worth it" bid. I'm very happy with my eBay purchase. If I ever sell it, it won't be there unless I'm desperate.