John Struthers

Final offer , RX-8.
But to be brutally honest. If I had the green to buy a used Lotus V8 or, dare I dream, a Low mileage TT V8... I would, literally, spend it on a sHARk for reliable HP, performance gains and do a serious upgrade in the handling department.
Preferably on a late model 928.
At our weight 390 HP + would be nice and as for the the handling I wouldn't go ***** to the wall.
Having tasted REAL curves again at SITO while driving nowhere near the potential of the sHARk. To do even 5/10's up there made me realize I had a long way to go as a DRIVER.
Points being: 1. I have more car than I can use without some serious focus and experience.
You guy's may have the experience to match the itch. Enjoy!
2. If I get to the point where you guy's are without the use of a track I will be deep into the Outlaw Zone.
3. The SITO folks were doing things with the sHARKs that verged on or went beyond the edge of FAST bike riding. For the most part EVERYONE STAYED IN THE CORRECT LANE where Bikes would have been cutting more than a few corners.
I would not have felt comfortable with a school of sHARKs pushing me to my traction limits on a Med/big bike or my power limits on a super quick RD-400. These cars handle so well that the majority of my handling problems were the person(s) in front of me braking earlier/longer than was required which does make Pattycakes slightly unstable. I don't believe these cars were meant to be overdriven, though it does pay to focus and think ahead.
In my case, not necessarily yours, I think the sharks can be upgraded to meet my needs.
Besides they are still gorgeous, and what a Butt! <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

Seth W

Did somebody say "reliable" and "ferrari" in the same sentence?? Is there a Devek to work on Ferrari's?? I have a very hard time comparing Ferrari (in the past) to a recent Lotus in reliability. In addition, I cant even imagine the service costs on those things. I'm going to put 5K into the Shark this year, and that might be a bit high (Tbelt, brakes stuff that wont happen every year) but I know that you can replace plugs w/o dropping an engine etc. Is the Mondial even close to the Shark on costs?? If it is, perhaps you have me interested.

Rx-8--To bulbous
350zx--To derivative (though a nice price--needs forced induction)

As to driver ability--after a 3 day race class and 2 track events I can safely say I suck (which makes me better than 99% of the idiots on the road who don't know that they suck) but that wont stop me from being a sucky driver in the car that "stirs my soul"

One thing is for certain, I am so glad all of those rich guys/gals are out there buying all of these cars for 70-100k so that us folks can start using them once they are properly broken in.

My 885sp New: $72, 954. Used: A lot less.

DougM

Older Ferrari V8 services are not that bad. Timing Belt and Water Pump on a 308 can be done with the engine in the car. On the Mondial, it needs to be dropped. Parts, like the 928 or any older sports car can nickle and dime you to death. The 12-cly cars however....$$$$
In the past 2 years I have had 4 sports cars: an '87 928 s4 5-spd(sold), an '84 Ferrari 308QV(sold), currently an '89 928 GT and a stroked and fuel injected '72 Pantera. After 3500 miles, which is the "least" amount of miles I put any of the cars in 8 months, the Pantera has been the least expensive to maintain while being the biggest brute of the bunch.

Snowball the 81 white 928

oops, didn't know about the engine drop requirement of the mondial. friend had an 86 model, only maintenance was a new clutch slave cylinder. got 130 going from 4th into 5th with plenty of pedal left. still a devotee, nothing like that ferrari howl.

<img src="graemlins/icon107.gif" border="0" alt="[icon107]" />

John V

With all due respect to Cavalino (and Johns freind)... IMHO, the mondial is not just ugly, it's f-ugly. The lines just dont flow like a 308/328 of the same vintage. I agree the 3.o v8 is not that horrible on maintenance but horsepower and torgue are seriously out of proportion with such luscious curves... even in the pre 86 qv varient.

Seth, I'm on the limb with you... my shark, while dearly loved and enjoyed, has not satiated my quest for the ultimate driveing experience. The power is good, but as an extremely stable car it is less nimble than I would like. For me the car I have been most in tune with was first my 1972 240z. In fact the whole Z family (of which I've owned 10) have been more fun to drive than my P car. With the exception of the 260z, the first generation of the 300zx, and this new under powered, ugly 350z, the z cars are excellent toys with ameneties very comperable to our sharks. Just not very quick or exotic(with the exception of the 300 turbo at 300Hp).

I actually like the RX-8 but its a tad generic...

-Pantera... Sexy lines! How is it to drive? Does she have the 351 cleveland or has she been "messaged".

Snowball the 81 white 928

ok, so the mondial is a dark hair and eyed italian and you prefer socal blonds. who's going to argue with subjective judgments? as for me, i wish i hadn't been in the hole with snowy when this 86 went up for sale cuz i'm sure you know which one I would prefer to own.

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Robert

Greetings,

Speaking of which cars "speak" to you. This may seem odd, but years ago a friend of mine had a Lotus Elan that he had fully restored. It was georgeous and just a very sweet little car. I drove it a few times and he had a toneau cover on it, so just the driver side was open. On a beautiful Sunday morning down Highway 1 (along the coast in California), that little red sweetie was wonderful. I could very easily fall for a car like that.

Then again, if Catherine Zeta-Jones was in a Pinto...

Rob <img src="graemlins/oops.gif" border="0" alt="[oops]" />

DougM

John V,
To answer your questions, the Pantera has the original 351c but has been stroked to 396" and has a Haltech FI with 8 throttle bodies. It's pretty wild to look at and drive with a great sound. Pics are at <a href="http://briefcase.yahoo.com/ziggymeredith" target="_blank">http://briefcase.yahoo.com/ziggymeredith</a>
Not the most comfortable car in the world, but like any rare exotic, who cares. Comfort is what 928s are for.

John Struthers

Seth,
Roger that!
Robert,
How old was the Elan...Late 60's was gorgeous.
Excellent choice.
John S.
Now if I could just get hold of one of those new Carrol Shelby all Aluminum 427's ........and a forged steel TT..... <img src="graemlins/burnout.gif" border="0" alt="[burnout]" />

Robert

John,

Ironically enough, it was a 1969 S4 Elan. After I posted on the board I called up my friend (who I hadn't spoken to in years) and we talked for about 2 hours. When I told him that I now had an S4, he was floored. When he found out that my S4 was a Porsche... he just started to laugh and say that you always loved those big-*** cars. I had to laugh too... I do love those big-assed cars !

Especially, 928s !

Rob <img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" />

John Struthers

Seth and John,
The two of you are rather difficult customers to please....
I was flipping thru the June edition of Road & Track when lo and behold!
It is a bit pricy $77,200 as a NEW car, but the Maserati Coupe is a tasty option to your wish list. 4.2L V8, 390 HP at 7000, 330 Lb. FT. of torque at 4500, plump at 3675 lbs she still scoots.
0-60 in 4.8 sec, 1/4 about 13 sec. For you two speed (sport) freaks may I recommend the Cambiocorsa Paddle Shifter option at a mere $4000.00. Adaptive acceleration and cornering sensors, upper & lower A arms all around, standard.
This is where it gets ugly to those with discriminating tastes...seats 4, and room for a couple of golf bags - for those so inclined - in the - Bite my tounge , Heresy, Oh the shame - TRUNK!
It's a nice looking car with a bit of Jaguar styling on the nose.
Now dammit you two, if thats not enough we can strip out the Spyder Convertible saw off the windshield pillars and run ram air to head heigth - add the optional seqential JATO bottles - GREAT FOR PICKING UP A PLACE OR TWO OFF THE BACK TURN - though judgement would be more critical here than say a Circus Fat Lady with a sudden yen to go bungee jumping over the Victoria Falls.
Actually, I know the feeling and can live with the fact that CASH is the only thing keeping most of us off the edge.
Have fun, wish you luck in the Search/Aquisition of a near perfect sport machine...and someplace to play with it, too!
<img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" /> <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />

EspritS4s

Seth,
I'm currently on my second '95 Esprit S4s. I absolutely love my Esprit and there aren't many cars that I would trade it for. It's low, wide, and very fast. I've had my car for several years, and it has been very reliable. From what I've read on this list, the Esprit is similar to the 928 in that a properly cared for model is usually very reliable. However, a neglected car can be a real headache. Although, they aren't very difficult to work on, it's not always easy to find someone with Lotus experience. Parts are expensive, but certainly no more expensive that Porsche parts. That being said, most of the Esprit owners that I know do not use their cars as daily drivers. It's not a very practical car and is pretty tight inside. As for the V8 models, they are even faster. I would steer clear of the '97my V8, but I'm not aware of any common reliability issues with the newer V8s. As always, try go find a car with a complete service history and have the car inspected before you buy. <a href="http://WWW.espritfactfile.com" target="_blank">WWW.espritfactfile.com</a> is an excellent resource for information. There is also a very active mailing list at groups.yahoo.com (turboesprit).

-Gary

Normy

I'm gonna go ahead and post this-

Though it is not at all the fastest car I have driven, the most fun in any car that I have ever had was behind the wheel of a Dodge Omni.

Omni GLH Turbo, that is-

Chrysler decided to drop its corporate 146 hp turbo 2.2 in the Omni, and not notify the general public. I'm sure this was to avoid the general expressions of outrage. 146 Hp is not much, but the 180 ft/lbs of torque bolted into a 2300 pound package was another story.

Performance? About the same as an early Shark with an auto transmission- 86 mph in a quarter mile. The difference? You show up at a stoplight in your 928 and everyone expects you to leave them behind. In an Omni?

Well, lets just say that I was the designated driver one night, and I think I had more fun than the drunks I was ferrying home!

Simply put, it is fun when you are driving junk that can BAR-BE-CUE whatever shows up next to you at a light!

THERE's a term for this: "sleeper"-

Just make sure you grip the wheel firmly if you ever drive one of these; Torque-steer thy name is "GLH Turbo"-

I really like Lotus Esprits, because they believe in what is a central tenent in my life- minimalism. I keep my person lightweight, and try to avoid clutter in my home and life in general. Sir Colin Chapman realized that proper handling comes from lowest possible curb weight, and handling is everything in high-performance driving. The only problem with these cars is reliability- I lived with an English girl for a while, and she [a gear-head like me of course...] made me promise to avoid anything with a British name-plate screwed on.

-However, a story about the original Esprit is that during testing, they took the prototype onto the track for the first time and it promptly broke one of its major rear suspension pieces. The fact that a company would produce a prototype that was so basically flawed in the first place should tell you something!

I looked at [and test drove] an NSX a few years ago. Too revvy for me, not enough personality [I don't eat ice cream; if I did I wouldn't eat VANILLA.....] and ugly styling. No thanks.

Viper? I like these, though they are as crude as my '66 Ford F100 [HappyTruck].

corvette? I think not. I won't own a gm product, first of all, and I think that quality shows. A recent article in CAR magazine talked about these, and how they have the ability to go WAY fast...and how you can scare yourself WAY silly by doing such! Also, they are a dime a dozen. I'd rather a Mustang if I was going to do that. At least the price reflects the performance!

-I nearly bought a '79 Ferrari 308 GT+4 a few years ago from a guy who worked at Zims. I drove it..it was fascinating! Everything worked on it and I was happy with the performance, which was less than my '92 Corrado VR6, but oh well. I wound up having a dose of reality [I flew for an infamous commuter airline at that point; I earned about $22,000/ year then] and realized that Ferrari ownership [read: maintenance!] was not an option at that point.

What would I buy now?

How about a diesel Jetta. I'd set it up with some kewl graphics [bright non-metallic blue paint] and some wild 18 inch BBS rims, and a body kit to boot. Add tinted windows, a crankin stereo and obligatory black leather interior. 110 mph and 50 mpg...

-Of course, it would sit in my driveway, as my shark would occupy the garage....

Normy!
'85 S2 5 speed

Seth W

I LOVE this forum.

In no particular order:

Love the Maserati--all we need to do is get a dealer to sell me said Maserati at 40k. One of the keys to this is not spending all the $ that I MIGHT earn someday (b/c I sure as hell have not yet!). I prefer the good old manual myself. I can't drive an automatic, makes my left leg nervous.

If we are gonna move upscale to the Maserati, how about the Audi bodied version of the baby Lambo?? But I digress.

Omni GLH--High School memories there--god that car was a hoot. Friends had the charger by shelby too, same idea. I drive a sleeper wagon so I love anything that is a sleeper.

Thanks for the message on the S4S reliability. The Lotus Esprit Fact File is truly a credit to the internet as a concept--if its not on that site then it does not need to be known.

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