Mike Frye

In the WSM it says to remove both of these sensors from the top of the bell housing before going in for a clutch job. I did this, but in another thread, somebody said this isn't necessary.

Is there any reason to do this, or was it something that that was put in the manual just in case, but isn't really necessary?

sharkmeister85

Mike,
When I pulled my clutch a few weeks ago, I had already removed the reference sensor just to get rid of bits that were never used. I don't think it is necessary to remove, but I can see where it might interfere with starter ring on the intermediate plate if one is not careful when wrestling around with a stubborn clutch pack.
As for the TDC sensor itself, I would recommend not removing it, especially if it has never been removed before. I tried to take mine out (didn't think it would be a problem because the reference sensor came out fine) and it was held in so tight by old dirt and oil crud that I eventually busted it off entirely. This resulted in me having to pull the clutch and flywheel to drift it out down through the block. Obviously, I had no problem taking the clutch out or the flywheel off, with it in place. Well, the pins were a problem, but as you know, that's a different story.
Glenn

AO

No it's not necessary, but they probably say to remove them so you don't take a chance in damaging them - car won't turn over if they're broken or disconnected.

Mike Frye

Glenn and Andrew,

Thanks. I think I'll leave it in my write-up of 'things to do' especially since mine is out this time, so in the future it shouldn't be difficult.

I guess it's part of 'clutz proofing' the procedure in case of someone like me.

BTW- I'm probably jinxing myself but I have to say, for a car with 200+k miles on it, things like the tdc and speed ref sensors and the side coolant drain plugs came out 'relatively' easily. No, the things I have trouble with are the ones no one has ever screwed up before. My glass is still half full.

Thanks again.

sharkmeister85

Mike,
You could leave it in your write up, but with the note that if the TDC sensor is stubborn, better to leave it in than break it, because the job can be done with out removing it.
Glenn

AO

FWIW, I recently replaced my sensor (connector had fallen apart) and when I went to remove the screw that holds it in, the whole thing just crumbled.

Mike Frye

Glenn, thanks.

I hope you don't mind, I added this and mentioned you in the write-up:

How to remove a clutch in an '85- for beginners

Andrew, mine was just fine when I pulled it up. Yours is probably crumbling from all of those trips through the sound barrier

Bill Ball

Mike:

BTW, you can disconnect the battery at the ground strap bolt behind the tool holder - no need to pull out the spare tire.

Also, the flywheel, pressure plate and intermediate plate are indexed by pins - they can only go on one way - no need to paint mark them, although it may make it visually easier to reassemble.

Nice job. I agree there is no good reason the pull those sensors.

Mike Frye

Bill,

Thanks for checking in. I'll add your comments/corrections. For some reason I always disconnect the positive lead rather than the ground strap. I don't know why and I know it can't make a complete circuit without both.

I thought that about the indexing pins after I got it out. Why would that part be in the WSM too? Maybe that's in case you're re-using the existing clutch? I dunno.

I guess they had to put more in there than 'Remove cover, take out clutch.' It looks like half of the things they say to do are really optional though. That's the last time I use the manual as my guide.

Bill Ball

Oh, it proved to be a lot more than just pull the cover and drop the clutch for us.

One other thing - with stock exhaust you have to pull the cat section off or lower it a whole bunch to get to the TT clamp through the inspection hole in the TT. We pulled it. After you unbolt the exhaust from the manifold, and loosen the clamps that hold the cat section to the rear exhaust, I've found it is easiest to work it off by twisting the cat section back and forth around its axis.

sharkmeister85

Mike,
From Step 4:
"..This is not the recommended way to do it, you should find a way to use the flywheel teeth since they're less likely to break, but I couldn't get any leverage on these, so I used the starter ring gear...."
I do not think you want to use the flywheel teeth. As far as I know, that toothed ring is pressed onto the flywheel and can be moved around on the flywheel if sufficient force were applied (and I don't think a whole lot is needed). That will of course throw the ignition timing off and leave someone with a nasty running problem to diagnose. If you have your spark plugs removed like I did, you should have no problem carefully using the teeth on the starter ring gear for small adjustments.
Glenn

Mike Frye

This is great stuff. Thanks for the input.

Glenn,

Yeah, I didn't really know how to word that. I knew my way was not the 'recommended' way. But if you're working alone, the easiest way to turn it is from where you are (instead of turning by the crank).

I didn't know the flywheel teeth could move that way. I was sure I saw a write-up somewhere that recommended using them instead of the starter ring gear teeth basically because they're bigger.

Thanks for reading it and critiquing. I'm really hoping to use all the input I can and make it complete, so if anyone else has suggestions, I'm interested.

I'll see how I can reword it to give a beginner a better chance of success.

AO

I used the starter ring teeth. I figure if the starter is going to use them to spin the engine... then I should be able to as well without problems. 3 times in and out with no problems... yet. I would hate to f-up my flywheel. That thing is a PITA to remove!

Bill Ball

Starting in 87, the flywheel and the timing ring are one piece (teeth are machined into the flywheel) - see 87MY Service Info, page 2-19.

sharkmeister85

That is true, if you deal with the pins in the way described by the WSM. They want you to knock the 2 6mm pins back into the IP/PP from the flywheel just enough to clear the flywheel and NOT remove them entirely. They do say to remove the 6mm/8mm stepped entirely, knocking it from the PP side towards the front of the car, out of the flywheel (the only way it can go).
However, in my case, I could not punch the 2 6mm pins back into the IP/PP, so I had to punch them out entirely in the opposite direction, out through the flywheel. Once you do this, you lose the indexing benefit of the stepped pin, since you are left with 3 empty 6mm holes in the IP/PP, any of which will accept the stepped pin. Luckily, I had clearly marked the original orientation of the PP/IP/flywheel with an indelible marker, so this was not a problem.
Glenn