Jfrahm

Yes, I would not doubt that John's rebuilds are better but the $150 price point is pretty easy on the wallet, therefore it seems more reasonable when your car runs perfectly but happens to be 20 years old. I have been thinking about doing a few preventative things for the long-term: fuel pump, MAF, maybe some overvoltage protection for the ECU (DC to DC converter maybe?) so I might try it.

OBBBQ: I've only been to Brother's once and it was decent, but I've had lunch at KT's a couple times and found it good. I've been more impressed with the BBQ at the Lazy Dog on Pearl in Boulder.
http://www.thelazydog.com/menu_page_bbq.htm

However for lunch I think either Brother's or KT's would be fine. KT's is the place my moto/motorhead friends like to meet for lunch every now and then.

-Joel.

RyanPerrella

One thing i like about injection labs, is that he tests the MAF and apparently makes adjustments to it. I prefer getting this info on MY maf so I know if that was in fact the problem. You wont get that with an exchange from John. I am sure he could tell you if you asked though. But being in the states and with him in the UK, it would take longer. But the way it goes is you send a MAFto 928intl they send you an already rebuilt one. But they cant test it and tell you if in fact your MAF was out of spec or what. I love the price, but I also love that Kevin at Injection Labs can test it and tell you, hey its good, or yeah it was doing this and such and such would happen. I like knowing if it was in fact bad. I always feel better about replacing parts I know (or someone else knows) are bad.

Peter F

I got this information from John so it can be had.
Mine was 4% off and 3% should be the factory given limit.
Easier for me being in Europe dealing direct with John though.
The unit is then re-calibrated on our special jig at 12 preset flow rates, accurate to better than 0.5%.

/Peter

RyanPerrella

Yeah i am sure John is more then happy to tell you how they test. But in the states, you buy them from 928 intl, they send you a rebuilt (i assume this is what they do, same with WP's) you send them yours, they then get a bunch of MAF's at some point and send them back to John, he rebuilds them, sends them back to 928 intl filling their shelves again. I cant believe 928 INTL has more then a half dozen of these in at any one time, I dont think they are in high demand, but it would take awhile here in the states to get them to John and have him tell you if its within spec. But as you mentioned if they are off just a little then they can run lean or rich, Kevin said they tend to run lean. I dont know anything about these sensors so i wont even speculate but again, I like to know what mine was doing so I then feel confident or not that what i am replacing was necessary.

John Speake

So are injection labs just recalibrating MAFs, or rewiring them ?

There's a big difference.

Rick Carter

Hi John,
This is from their site:

Injection Labs' most widely known product is the Bosch Air Mass Meter, or air mass sensor.Research of air mass sensors on the market, conducted by injection Labs before it began to manufacture the product, revealed a high warranty return rate caused by platinum wire failure. While competitors attempted to address the problem by modifying a different part of the circuit, Injection Labs began working on the real solution - developing a longer-lasting, failure-resistant wire.
After years of development - creating platinum alloys, producing precision wire drawings and designing custom tooling - Injection Labs began producing its own new wire elements that could stand the test of time. The result: a remanufactured air mass sensor containing virtually all-new components (except for the housing) that in many cases are more durable and reliable than the original items. In fact, these wire elements and other components manufactured in-house by Injection Labs were such an improvement, even competitors soon began purchasing them, both in North America and abroad.

RyanPerrella

Rick,

Have you had Injection Labs work on your MAF?

John Speake

Hi Rick, yes I read that 4 years ago..... but Ryan's comments suggest that his MAF is just being "adjusted" and not fully rebuilt with a new wire.

RyanPerrella

John

I am not sure. I read in a thread before that these can be adjusted. I will call tomorrow as he should have mine from UPS by then and ask. I just want mine to work, i dont care if it needs a new wire, or whatever, i just want mine to read correctly and i want my idle to no longer be an issue. If i paid $150 and the car idles as it should, its money well spent as far as i am concerned. I also think the car runs real rich on initial startup, you can smell it.

I will check back tomorrow with the update. Considering you charge $350 and he charges $150 there must be something your doing that he is not. Perhaps he has a better line on replacement wire then you do, perhaps he charges less per his hour of time to fix them, maybe he simply recalibates them ,who knows. There is a pretty obvious price difference and since you asked i will let you know.

John Speake

Fair comments Ryan. Although the wire is expensive, it is labor cost rather than material cost that is dominant.

Injection labs may have automated processes, but they really only come into there own with serial runs of product, rather than one offs. So that is why I am querying what work is done on each unit.

I will be interested to hear your observations when you receive your unit back.

RyanPerrella

certianly, I will let you all know. Again, I am not trying to show up your services John. I am glad you have invested money of your own into rebuilding MAF's, ECU's so on and so forth. There maybe a time when i need a new ECU, i pray I dont however but I certianly appreciate what you do and appreciate your investment. It seems however there is another fish in he sea and i thought i would give him (them) a shot.

It says clearly that they rebuild "most" components and the wire is specifically mentioned on the page about remanufactured MAF's. I think you may have thought i was just happy to get it recalibrated cause I had mentioned that I was anxious to see test results from him on how my MAF was performing. I think they can be adjusted but that may have been quite a bit less.

I will call tomorrow

marton

Any 20 year old MAF needs rebuilding.
if this did not fix the problem then either it was not rebuilt or you have some other major problem; get a bosch hammer or shark tuner connected (if they work on an 86.5) to investigate further.

About restaurants; I always liked the steaks in (sh*t forgot the name) was it Pikes peak or similar? They do cowboy & cowgirl steaks & they cut off your tie if you wear one.

Marton

Lorenfb

"I sent my AFM as well as my LH unit to one of the sponsors. Well, $450.00 later and a rebuilt AFM my car ran just as bad as it did prior me sending them in."

Using the "shotgun" approach to troubleshooting can be very costly and ineffective.
Each unit has typical failure modes, although some modes are common to both but very few are.
You should have better diagnosed the problem and asked that the units be tested.
Check here for a general troubleshooting procedure:

www.systemsc.com/tshoot.htm

Lorenfb

"I sent my AFM as well as my LH unit to one of the sponsors. Well, $450.00 later and a rebuilt AFM my car ran just as bad as it did prior me sending them in."

Using the "shotgun" approach to troubleshooting can be very costly and ineffective.
Each unit has typical failure modes, although some modes are common to both but very few are.
You should have better diagnosed the problem and asked that the units be tested prior to rebuilding.

Check here for a general troubleshooting procedure:

www.systemsc.com/tshoot.htm

Check here for the typical LH failure modes:

www.systemsc.com/failuremodes.htm

danglerb

Its Pinnacle Pete's, and the beans are as good as the steaks.

Shotgun trouble shooting may not be the best way, but if you can shoot the shotgun yourself it may not be the most expensive either. 20 year old MAF should be replaced even if it seems to work.