Still looking for a GT when I came across a '88 S4 5 speed. What's the major differences other than the engines...............is the gearing similar, slightly differnt or completely opposite?

I believe the S4 could have sports suspension from the factory..............correct?

 

Malcolm, it's been discussed so many times I'm not going to bore everyone and I'm not a GT fan anyway which most people are. If someone offered me a GT today and a comparable S4 5spd I'd take the S4, for several reasons.

Price:
S4 5spd is a lot cheaper for maybe 5% less car

Transmission:
2.2 rear end is good for boost ie good for future

Performance:
My S4 5spd delivered in excess of GT horsepower/torque normally aspirated

The bottom line is, you have to find a GOOD EXAMPLE of either. A well-worn, tired S4 and a tired, used-up GT will give you the same lacklustre performance and you'll hate it. However, a good example (talking maintenance, general condition and actual dyno numbers) will make you proud. With a car like that, you may decide it's so much more fun than your AT that you'll be selling. Another (more difficult) option is to convert to 5spd. There are at least TWO offers out there today for the entire drivetrain from flywheel to the differential, all you need to convert to 5spd. If you love your car, if you know it has excellent numbers, if you've done all needed woirk ... then that is a great (and fun) option that won't cost you a lot.

 

Heinrich.............appreciate your ponts of view and you've hit my dilema right on the head.

My present S4 is almost perfect with many mods and all maintenance performed by yours truly. The only thing thats lacking is the auto transmission; not that its bad, I just want a 5 speed (no flames please just my personal desire).

So, take a risk with a different unknown car or convert my S4?..............or add a supercharger? or???

Its -26C this morning.............could all be cabin fever ramblings

 

To counter H's point....

GT's give you more power...ie 330 hp vs 317hp S4....stock....with equivalently modded cars...the GT will win on hp every time...

Gearing is 2.73 which gives you snappier response...but doesn't affect top end either since the redline for a gt is moved up from the S4.

GT's have the "GT cams" which so many people desire for top end performance...these alone are worth 1500 to 2 k..if you can find them...of course Mark K has modded 85/86 cams..which are similar to GT cams..to fit into an S4..so a cheaper cam option may be on the horizon....

I disagree with H on the price point....seems when someone has a 928 5sp..they go at a premium over the AT.... the difference in price between 5sp and GT isn't that great for like condition the diff being mostly due to year...since 89 is the only overlap year...and the 89GT's are the most rare of the 928 period...and you can't find a 88 CS..to compare....

The conversion point is valid, however it's a lot of work...no better way to get to know your S4

And finally...If someone offered H a GT and a S4 5-sp for the "same Price"..which would he take???
haha...

Later,
Tom
89GT...(I've made my choice)...

BTW..the GT is the first effort (actually the 88CS is)....by Porsche to turn their 928 cruiser to a sportier performance car....too bad they didn't go with it all the way.....It is the way Porsche intended

 

Weird how times change I remember when H thought GT's were the 928 to own.
I have owned both and driven many nice examples of both. From my experiences I have become somewhat of a GT nut. I love them and will always own one and in fact own 4 right now.
You will tend to find more GT's with GTS dyno #'s than GTS's with GTS dyno #'s. They are just snappier and more fun, to me.
FWIW I am one of the few who prefer the analog display of the pre 89's. I just think they look more racey and exotic.

 

Jim.........did you sell your white GT?

 

That is one pretty GT. How much for that?

 

Changes between S4 & GT

My opinion of S4 vs. GT? I worship at the altar of GT so I'd say find a good example of a GT and rest comfortably in the knowledge that you've bought the factory-developed, performance version of the 928.

 

You could add to the list the differences between 90 & 91 that you will notice: better rain gutters, better power steering, better sound deadening.

 

Putting GT cams in an S4 transforms the top end with no loss at the low end, but as Tom says it comes at a cost. Tell me about it. Worth every penny.

IMO if you find any 87+ 5 speed you like (color, condition,mileage etc ..) and the price is right buy it, GT or S4.

Chris

 

now that we know, you can use 85-86 cams for the S4 and create the GT. they are almost identical, with the 85-86 cams probably having better high end.
the cost is only the cost of a 85-86 set, and a slight modification done by elgin cams, for $400.

the other thing is the computer, with a higher redline than the S4.

The gear box is better, i think it has the stronger gears, but the ratio differnce is very subtle. 2.72 vs a 2.2 is a 15% difference between gears. since we are talking about street applicatoins, the gains if any or loss, depends on the speed range you spend most of your time in. (we have discussed this at great length already)

Dennis has a 2.64 rear end, and it is pretty interesting at thunderhill and sears, but a disadvantage at Laguna vs a 2.2 as proved by his good video.

Mk

 

My take is this:

I would love to have a GT at some point, but I am completely happy with what I have. Two 5sp 86.5 and half an auto '86. I love driving the manuals, they are a kick in the pants, but there are many many times when I would rather be driving my '86. Of course it had a supercharger on it the last time it ran, so for an auto it was a complete blast to drive! I found myself ignoring the 5sp altogether after I added boost. If you can afford to have both a manual and an auto, then go for it. But if I could only have one 928, it would be a supercharged auto.

 

When I began my quest, I started thinking I could go for an S4 (5-speed of course). I looked at a few, drove a few, and passed on a few. They were all pretty nice cars, but they weren't quite was I was looking for. Then I looked at an 89 S4 in San Diego (thanks again Randy! ). It was grey with linen/black interior plus it was SUPERCHARGED! Unfortunately the car had issues! BIG ISSUES! So I walked away from it, but I did fall in love with the digital dash. So I started to consider a GT. After about 4-5 months, I found my 91 GT. I would have preferred black, but the red is easy on the eyes too.

There are a lot of nice updates I'm fining on the 91GT like the improved sound deadening material, Express down windows and sunroof, of course the digital dash, and lots of power! It's amazing how it just pulls all the way to red line.

Recently at the Frenzy 9, a gentleman in his S4 was following me, and I punched it. He said he hit it too, but that I just walked away from him. Made me feel like I made a wise choice. My car is still 100% stock. I can't wait to start modifying it. (DR - PLEASE TAKE MY MONEY!)

But H's point is about finding a good example is so important. THe main reason why I didn't consider the other cars was primarily due to condition. I think that's the most important criteria.

 

Don't the GT's have an Oil Starvation problem? I know of a couple and one of them finally gave up and went with a GTS motor because he was tired of his GT motors failing. This was from high speed DE cornering and whatnot. Don't know if it is true for ALL GT's, that's why i'm asking the question. Seems i've heard it is more the later models that have the starvation problem.

Jon

 

Same kinda of thing happened with me when Pat E was following me back from Louie O's place. He was in his recently purchased, beautiful S4 and told me afterwards I just kept leaving him and there was nothing he could do about it. Fun.