GregBBRD

Nothing is ever perfect...not even when Porsche makes it.

I think what Carl is saying here is that his old "method of doing business" was much like when Porsche makes something that has problems, they don't necessarily contact all their customers and makes sure the customer gets the correct part. I think 928 GTS connecting rods are the perfect example of this....."If you loosen more than two connecting rod nuts, all of the connecting rods need to be replaced." Of course, that was a very ****ty thing to do, but that's the road they chose.

I've been involved with some of Carl's "early" parts (Rob Rossitto's sway bars) and truthfully, they were very crude. I made lots of changes before they could even be bolted onto the car. Lots of changes. However, the front sway bar had significant "design" problems with geometry that I could not "cure" without a major redesign. Apparently, Carl did redesign this, but Rob was never informed. After the sway bar ruined a set of front wheels, Rob contacted Carl and Carl told him that there was an "updated version" and he would be happy to send out the parts.

Carl took care of the problem, by sending out "updated pieces", but there was no effort to contact Rob about there being a potential huge dangerous problem. Cost Rob a set of wheels and the car was "unsafe" as the sway bar machined a huge groove out of the inner rim on the front wheels....

Not every product can be perfect the first time. It's all about how the vendor chooses to "handle" the problem. Sounds like Carl has changed his "method of doing business" and now is making "active" efforts to contact customers when a problem is found.

I guess since this thread is about sway bar bushings and Carl now claims that he does contact people about products that have "issues"....this would be the perfect part to study.

How many people got emails telling them that their "first" two versions of steering rack bushings were not a press fit and they should call to get a free set of the latest, updated version?

Obviously missed Shane, but things happen.

Carl, make us proud and tell us that you contacted everyone....except Shane, of course.

Ninespub

Maybe my email address if different than original when I bought some bushings and protection plates from 928 Motorsports (but I doubt it) as I have never received an email about updated (much less replaceable) items. Both the bushings and the protection plates I purchased remain un-installed. The plates because of the hassle described on RL for installing them because they did not "fit" the offset of the mounting, and the bushings because I couldn't get anyone to install them without fearing they would screw up the rack in the process.

Additionally, after reading the various threads over the past couple years or so about the perceived issues on warranty service, I quite frankly, just decided to not buy anything else from 928 motorsports. So there they sit. However, my mindset on 928 Motorsports would change if there was an item-for-item replacement program. I would be more than willing to pay a reasonable fee to have the updated stuff just because I've sat on them long enough that its nobodys fault but my own.

I'm typically one of the silent majority who is dis-inclined to get in pissing matches with any one and make my decisions with my wallet accordingly. I am also someone who looks for upgrades to my 928 and am prepared to embrace new concepts, so, if there is something you can follow up with for me Carl, you can let me know.

Carl Fausett

We contact everyone in our database.

However: two things can happen that will prevent them from receiving our bulletins.

1) they changed their email address and didn't update us (which is what happened to Shane)

2) they respond to any of our Bulletins with REMOVE in the subject line, which they are instructed to do if they want to removed from the email list so as not to receive any more bulletins.
I honor all REMOVE requests.

Carl Fausett

I do not have time to read this whole thread again, but I dont recall seeing any post on how to tell if you actually have defective or worn out steering rack bushings. If this has been posted, I appologize.

A simple and accurate way to check:

It requires two people, no tools, and no disassembly.

Put one person in the car, engine running, car in Park or Neutral. Parking brake set. Car MUST be on the ground, so weight is on the tires.

Second person is the Observer. Observer lies on the ground near the front tire and looks at the steering rack. You can see it by looking from behind the front tires.

Have the person in the car work the steering wheel from L to R. Only an inch or two of movement is required.

IF you see the steering rack move laterally from side-to-side before the tires start to move, then you have an issue that warrants further investigation. If the steering rack does not move, and the tie rods move right away, You dont have a problem.

While your at it, you can inspect play in your tie rods ends while performing this simple test as well.

Overview: the tires do not want to scrub on the pavement. They resist movement. Any slack in the system (steering rack bushings, tie rods ends, excessive wheel bearing play, steering column bushings, steering rack internal bushings) must be overcome before the force of the driver turning the wheel can be applied to the tire.

Carl Fausett

Paul,

You have purchased:

7/19/2007
Silicone Vacuum Lines
Drain Plug Magnet
Water wetter 12oz
Differential Oil Pump

11/15/2007
Shock Snubbers
Solid Steering rack Mounts

12/28/2009
Chin Protection Plates

You have received no recall bulletins on these items because there have been no recall bulletins on these items.

Please be sure I have your current email address on file, so I can reach you if need be. You can contact me by any of several methods below my signature in every post on the Renn.

Please perform the test I have outline in post 49 above on your car. If your find your steering rack bushings are not holding your rack still, by all means contact me for a replacement set.

GregBBRD

Carl:

Not sure that the question, in this thread, is if the aluminum bushings will hold the rack still...a few thousanths of an inch movement is hardly going to be noticable.....until several years go by and both the bushing and the bore of the hole in the rack get "wallowed out" from vibration and movement. By that time, the rack will certainly be junk.

So, I think the concern is what damage non-press fit aluminum bushings are doing to do to the aluminum rack.

I think you said that this is your "third" version. Apparently, from what we are reading from people that have versions #1 and #2, these other versions are not a press fit. Since the "new" version is apparently a "press fit", obviously the "change" in design is in response to some sort of a problem...otherwise there would only be one version.

As I read this thread, I think that is the first concern and why I was asking about how people get "new" pieces for the "prior" versions....or if you had already contacted all the prior purchasers and informed them of the potential problems.

BTW:

I think that "our" new friendlier exchange of ideas is very good for the whole 928 community.

Wouldn't you agree?

Ninespub

Thank you for your reply Carl. Wow, its been that long since I bought that stuff? Time flies when you own a 928. As I stated, It's nobody's (including yours) fault for those items not being installed but mine.

There were several times I took the rack mounts to get installed and they said they didn't want to touch it because they didn't feel they could do it right without risking damage to the rack by (effectively) beating the old ones out......and that they just didn't look like they would fit right. I know, I know, maybe it was the wrong person (the first time it was) but the second time it was a respected 928 wrencher here in Michigan that deferred from the mount installation, along with the spoiler protection plates.

The spoiler plates are a known PITA installation because they do not follow the profile of the mounting area and therefore do not "fit" as one would expect of a "custom-built" item. As for the rack mounts, obviously you felt changes were necessary to upgrade them an iteration (or two) because of proper fit, installation or end-use issues. If it was important enough to change an item such as the mounts as dramaticaly as you did could indicate a serious need as well.

My point was that I can not find any fault with a vendor improving their product like you have, but you did indicate that you sent a bulletin informing past purchasers of the improved versions and I never got those or any other notices from you.

The parts remain in their respective original original packaging. The protection plates will probably get installed someday after I take them to a friend who has a manufacturing facility with a big press and try and re-shape them to fit a little better. The mounts I'll probably throw on ebay just to get rid of them and get some different ones unless there is a trade in value with you.

With best regards

Ninespub

Carl, I spent some time (I'm a slow typer) writing my last message and got pre-empted by GB before I posted mine and read his. His post essentially is what I also said, and in the end, is what this thread is about. There is no intent to beat you up and I respect that you replied the way you did.

With best regards.

Carl Fausett

Stop patting yourself on the back. You have only changed from being overtly aggressive to being passive-aggressive. You just stirred up a bees nest looking for a problem to write about. You alarmed people needlessly. I bet if they test their steering rack mounts with my procedure outlined in post 49 above they will find no problem.

The steering rack is a casting. The tolerances of the mounting holes are + or - .005 at best. The same steering rack mount on customer A's car may need pressing to install, the same mount on customer B's car may slip in.

The mount is not fully installed until the steel bottom plate is put up and tightened. The job is not done until then. THEN, if the rack moves laterally, there is a problem. When solid mounts are installed int he rack, the rack is no longer held only by the bushings as in the case of the rubber mounts. Our aluminum mounts are flanged, so now the rack is located by the mount and HELD by the compression created by the torque on the mounting nuts.

Greg, you assume version 1 and 2 were "bad" (of course). They were not. Thats why they were not recalled. As I have already said, we found ways to make them easier to install, (more chanfer) and easier to manufacture. Hence the revisions. They still perform just as well.

Carl Fausett

Paul,

Apply the test outlined in post number 49 and let me know if you see steering rack movement.

Note that the method of holding the rack in place changes when you use our steering rack mounts.

In this photograph you can see the thick flanges that are clamped when the bolts are torqued. These thick flanges do not exist on the factory rubber mounts. I do not know if Greg's or Rogers aluminum mounts are engineered this way, so have made no comment about them. But in like kind - Greg's comments about the right way to install his mounts is not necessarily correct for our mounts.

GregBBRD

I'm sorry you feel that way.

Actually, I was "taking the high road" here. I'm keeping my opinions out of this conversation and just communicating about the bushings.

First, you say that the "new bushings" are a press fit, which is one of the things that you changed on them.....Now you say that the bushings can't be a press fit, since the racks vary in size.

Very confusing.

And.....

If the racks do vary in the size of the hole, wouldn't that make a solid aluminum bushing completely unsuitable for a certain percentage of the applications?

Do you not understand that aluminum to aluminum pieces are going to wear like crazy if there is any slop between the two? Go loosen the bell housing to block bolts on your race car and see how that works and for how long....

I'm seriously not trying to pick on you, here.

I'm just asking completely logical questions.

I think the best thing for me to do is "bow" out of this discussion and let you deal with the people that are having problems, on your own.

Carl Fausett

Greg, sorry, I am not yet convinced of your new-found "innocence". You were a wolf in wolf's clothing, now your a wolf in sheep's clothing. But you will still be a wolf to me for some time. It doesn't go away overnight, especially with the passive-aggressive things you have posted in this thread. Keep trying though.

Aluminum to aluminum will not wear if there is no movement. Aluminum to aluminum is clamped to together all over this car without wear. If the parts do not move, there is no abrasion.

Look, this must be a lot of fun for you and all, but i just don't have the amount of keyboard time that you must have.

I have 4 engines to build in this picture alone - a 5.0L 32v Nikasiled motor, a 5.0L sleeved 16v motor, a 5.0L 32v Alusil motor, and a 968. And at least 4 engine wiring harnesses to make, not to mention all the other normal parts.

I'm going to drop off this thread for at least a couple days until I get caught up. I just cannot explain to my customers that they did not get their parts because I was camped out on the forums.

If anybody has any more legitimate questions about the steering rack mounts, please email me. My email address is below my signature. Thanks.

Andre Hedrick

FWIW, I think Greg is being genuine and has mellowed, please consider giving him the benefit of the doubt. It is hard to watch the smart and skilled people who help other and create replacement/improved parts for our cars throw sand around the room.

Thanks in advance Carl, and keep up the good work!

dcrasta

If you friend him on FACEBOOK you get way more updates than anyone deserves

blown 87

I know Greg is trying to bury the hatchet as it were, but that can go away if it does not work both ways.

Greg is trying here, that much I know.