928 vs. todays competition
09-26-2005, 07:43 PM
#136
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This all reminds me of the Wisconsin CS guys challenging Mark to a race with Devek's white car...
Rather than a simple race, it became a multi-challenge endeavor.
Racing, road racing, dyno, open-road race, etc...
And of course, no one showed up.
Devek raised the stakes so much that no one could afford to compete.
I think it's a pretty simple challenge.
He said he'd beat an E55, in his OB 928, running NOS...
Regardless of HP claims, reliability, etc, that was his challenge.
The horsepower may or may not be what he expects.
But the point is that you can buy a NOS kit from Ebay,
and get enough power to beat a new E55, with an OB 928.
That's a challege and a statement right there...
He wasn't talking about open road racing, or road racing.
He was talking about a drag race. A street race. A stoplight race.
The kind we encounter every day. Someone pulls next to us in
our 928, with their E55... We take off on a race, and hit the NOS.
Who wins?
Rather than a simple race, it became a multi-challenge endeavor.
Racing, road racing, dyno, open-road race, etc...
And of course, no one showed up.
Devek raised the stakes so much that no one could afford to compete.
I think it's a pretty simple challenge.
He said he'd beat an E55, in his OB 928, running NOS...
Regardless of HP claims, reliability, etc, that was his challenge.
The horsepower may or may not be what he expects.
But the point is that you can buy a NOS kit from Ebay,
and get enough power to beat a new E55, with an OB 928.
That's a challege and a statement right there...
He wasn't talking about open road racing, or road racing.
He was talking about a drag race. A street race. A stoplight race.
The kind we encounter every day. Someone pulls next to us in
our 928, with their E55... We take off on a race, and hit the NOS.
Who wins?
09-26-2005, 10:03 PM
#137
Exactly BC Davis.
Why jump through all the hoops?
Just meet me at the drag strip(Atco raceway, NJ) best out of three runs, and we'll see what we see.
Either i'll win, or i'll blow my motor or something in my driveline and lose. I'm willing to take the risk because i'm extremely confident i can deliver on my claim(or i would have never made it to begin with)...and because the potential payoff is so big.
The challenge is out there. Either accept it, or move on.
TV- I purposely moved this challenge to PM with Blau so as NOT to further jack this thread, and the only reason it's moved back here is because Blau threatened to have Randy V block my PMs if i sent him another one, then he decided to resume posting about it on this thread anyway.
On a separate note, a rain delay has postponed my move 1/2 way through.
Why jump through all the hoops?
Just meet me at the drag strip(Atco raceway, NJ) best out of three runs, and we'll see what we see.
Either i'll win, or i'll blow my motor or something in my driveline and lose. I'm willing to take the risk because i'm extremely confident i can deliver on my claim(or i would have never made it to begin with)...and because the potential payoff is so big.
The challenge is out there. Either accept it, or move on.
TV- I purposely moved this challenge to PM with Blau so as NOT to further jack this thread, and the only reason it's moved back here is because Blau threatened to have Randy V block my PMs if i sent him another one, then he decided to resume posting about it on this thread anyway.
On a separate note, a rain delay has postponed my move 1/2 way through.
09-26-2005, 10:13 PM
#138
Rennlist Member
1 - Don hanson has the highest hp dyno so far at 575 RWHP. Is there a 600 rwhp 928 out there?
2 - I like challenges that do not involve driver skills. As an example, I ram the 1/4 three times, by the third time, I was lucky to make it home as I killed the clutch.
3 - My dyno challenge is no different, and in fact less stressful, than that of the standard factory test protocol. I would never call it cost prohibitive, just a standardized way of testing power and reliability together.
4 - Richard is a smart guy ... make sure you have your ponies in a row before makeing a claim
5 - Most folks on this list have well more than 1/3 the cost of E55 in their 928's. We just prefer to let it go as we love the 928 that much..
6 - As for me, I still would go for a slightly modded 456, IF money were no object ...er, ahh ...impenertratable wall
AND a E55 .... and a 7.0 l 928 with a dry sump and a 7000 rpm limit...
Take it easy and have some fun ...f o the the drags with your nitrous setup and get some times and end the hoopla
2 - I like challenges that do not involve driver skills. As an example, I ram the 1/4 three times, by the third time, I was lucky to make it home as I killed the clutch.
3 - My dyno challenge is no different, and in fact less stressful, than that of the standard factory test protocol. I would never call it cost prohibitive, just a standardized way of testing power and reliability together.
4 - Richard is a smart guy ... make sure you have your ponies in a row before makeing a claim
5 - Most folks on this list have well more than 1/3 the cost of E55 in their 928's. We just prefer to let it go as we love the 928 that much..
6 - As for me, I still would go for a slightly modded 456, IF money were no object ...er, ahh ...impenertratable wall
AND a E55 .... and a 7.0 l 928 with a dry sump and a 7000 rpm limit...Take it easy and have some fun ...f o the the drags with your nitrous setup and get some times and end the hoopla
09-26-2005, 11:12 PM
#141
"Take it easy and have some fun ...f o the the drags with your nitrous setup and get some times and end the hoopla"
LOL, bro i'm not adding a big multi-stage fogger setup unless it's to win a 100k dollar mercedes. I do plan on a tunable 50-100 shot though.
LOL, bro i'm not adding a big multi-stage fogger setup unless it's to win a 100k dollar mercedes. I do plan on a tunable 50-100 shot though.
09-26-2005, 11:13 PM
#142
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I want to see a drag race, but I do have to agree with Marc that the dyno tells a lot.
As I pointed out on the last challenge thread we had, the whole weight issue is a big
factor. Marc's white car is essentially stripped to the bone. Sniper's car is likewise
stripped quite a bit. Plus you have driver skill, luck, track conditions, tires, suspension, etc...
So I tend to lump these kind of competitions into two categories.
Racing, and number crunching...
If you want to challenge someone to a race, numbers and weight and all that stuff does not matter.
Make, model, driver, induction, NOS, etc... None of it matters. Strip the car to the bone, pump
it full of nitrous oxide, etc... A race is a race. Stoplight to stoplight. 0-60, 1/4 mile, 60-150, whatever
you want to race. You can't determine who pulls up at the light next to you.
So I think it's a legitimate challenge when you tell someone you can beat their
E55, with your OB 928 on nitrous. If they accept the challenge, you show up
with your bottle-fed 928, and see who wins the race. No other factors matter.
But if you want to crunch numbers, and say who has the baddest beast,
then the dyno tells the facts. Turbo, Stroker, Supercharged, or NOS,
the dyno will tell who has the most power. It eliminates factors like
tires, weight, driver skill, etc...
But I really don't think this E55 vs NOS 928 was that kind of challenge.
It was a challenge to a drag race.
With all the unknowns included.
As I pointed out on the last challenge thread we had, the whole weight issue is a big
factor. Marc's white car is essentially stripped to the bone. Sniper's car is likewise
stripped quite a bit. Plus you have driver skill, luck, track conditions, tires, suspension, etc...
So I tend to lump these kind of competitions into two categories.
Racing, and number crunching...
If you want to challenge someone to a race, numbers and weight and all that stuff does not matter.
Make, model, driver, induction, NOS, etc... None of it matters. Strip the car to the bone, pump
it full of nitrous oxide, etc... A race is a race. Stoplight to stoplight. 0-60, 1/4 mile, 60-150, whatever
you want to race. You can't determine who pulls up at the light next to you.
So I think it's a legitimate challenge when you tell someone you can beat their
E55, with your OB 928 on nitrous. If they accept the challenge, you show up
with your bottle-fed 928, and see who wins the race. No other factors matter.
But if you want to crunch numbers, and say who has the baddest beast,
then the dyno tells the facts. Turbo, Stroker, Supercharged, or NOS,
the dyno will tell who has the most power. It eliminates factors like
tires, weight, driver skill, etc...
But I really don't think this E55 vs NOS 928 was that kind of challenge.
It was a challenge to a drag race.
With all the unknowns included.
09-27-2005, 12:17 PM
#144
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Marc,
I hope to best the 575 number by early next year...no claims as of yet, but I believe the exhaust driven compressors represent the path by which to get there. I have a lot of work to do over the next 6 months, but this time it will be a 6 month project, not a 6 week project like Goldmember was (what was I thinking?) Callaway upgrade happening soon...hope for an additional 40 WHP off of the 4.5 liter...mainly with camshaft profile change and K-26 units. Not looking for a lot more power there, just a lot more useable power...isn't that the real issue?
Let's not forget the equally important factor of useable area under the power curve. I'm expecting lots of torque with the 5.0 liters and boost...and I expect it to come on like a cannon shot. That is one thing I really like about the turbo car...its somewhat non-linear power delivery...a real rush. Your Mother's in Law worst fear....oops I forgot I don't have one of those anymore....Boy, I'm gonna miss her.
Goldmember exhaust manifolds are already being copied...I should have NEVER let those photographs out! Scoundrels!
I hope to best the 575 number by early next year...no claims as of yet, but I believe the exhaust driven compressors represent the path by which to get there. I have a lot of work to do over the next 6 months, but this time it will be a 6 month project, not a 6 week project like Goldmember was (what was I thinking?) Callaway upgrade happening soon...hope for an additional 40 WHP off of the 4.5 liter...mainly with camshaft profile change and K-26 units. Not looking for a lot more power there, just a lot more useable power...isn't that the real issue?
Let's not forget the equally important factor of useable area under the power curve. I'm expecting lots of torque with the 5.0 liters and boost...and I expect it to come on like a cannon shot. That is one thing I really like about the turbo car...its somewhat non-linear power delivery...a real rush. Your Mother's in Law worst fear....oops I forgot I don't have one of those anymore....Boy, I'm gonna miss her.
Goldmember exhaust manifolds are already being copied...I should have NEVER let those photographs out! Scoundrels!
09-27-2005, 01:19 PM
#146
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God Save Us
Originally Posted by Herr-Kuhn
I hope to best the 575 number by early next year...no claims as of yet, but I believe the exhaust driven compressors represent the path by which to get there. I have a lot of work to do over the next 6 months, but this time it will be a 6 month project...
<Six months of incessant blathering> 
09-27-2005, 03:03 PM
#148
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He does awesome work, but was never willing to back it up with dyno sheets or a race...
That's why people are giving him some flack.
Because he makes a lot of claims of the ability to dominate over the supercharged cars,
but when they challenged him to a dyno run, or a race, all we got was more claims of
turbo superiority, and no numbers to back it up...
I have more confidence that with a s4 turbo car, he will have something to bring to the table...
Time will tell...
That's why people are giving him some flack.
Because he makes a lot of claims of the ability to dominate over the supercharged cars,
but when they challenged him to a dyno run, or a race, all we got was more claims of
turbo superiority, and no numbers to back it up...
I have more confidence that with a s4 turbo car, he will have something to bring to the table...
Time will tell...
09-27-2005, 03:04 PM
#149
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Clear as mud..
Hey Richard, I agree with everything you said except for this. If you meant 4 in the back seat then they better be 2 couples on very good terms because they will have to be humping each other as the back seat has a large divider down the middle. I actually opened it up and looked inside.
To my eyes the back seats were not up to my roadmaster standard and the BMW's back seat was very cramped especially knee-wise.
To my eyes the back seats were not up to my roadmaster standard and the BMW's back seat was very cramped especially knee-wise.
I think I mentioned prior that I was just actually driving around a CLS 500 for 1 month in Germany in the summer of 2005. 4 people of over 6 ft in the car means the whole car, not the rear seat. I also know this to be true, as I took 3 of my friends on a trip from Hamburg to Lubeck, and we all fit in the car just fine... If had specified 4 people in the rear, then it would have been different. I did not.. Thanks..
Marc,
Thanks for setting some things straight..
BC,
I drive about 200 miles per day in my 928 when I am in CA. It's a lot more than so many of us on R'List drive in a week.. I get into all kinds of "street races" with all kinds of cars on a daily basis. I do not do stoplight to stoplight simply because the 928 is no dragster. PORSCHE AG did not design nor build it as such. If I wanted a dragster, I would go out and buy one from Don Garlits et al. FYI BC, most "street races" stop at around 135 mph. Most people do not go any faster for whatever reason.... The freeways also do not end after 1/4th mile...
In any event, your comment on a race on the street. I offered to pay Bill's freight to run such a "street race" in Germany, so we would both not be arrested. I did this after Bill said:
what i see is you attempting to carefully craft a competition that favors the E55(namely the 100km race). Where exactly we're going to race 100km in my area flat out(unless you're renting pocono or nazereth superspeedway for the day) is beyond me.
However, he has to perform FIRST by INDEPENDENTLY VERIFYING that he has HIS 714HP 1983 928S. If he cannot, and I am sure he cannot, no point in racing, as the talk is just that... TALK.
Bill's claim or anyone else's claim with no scientific proof is JUST TALK. BS, MARKETING, or whatever else it can be called... mostly HOT AIR..
This bantering should stop unless Bill shows me some proof +. Unless he does, it's a moot point. In respect to TV's thread and earlier wishes, no more comments from myself on Bill 's 714HP NOX 83 928S.
Basta..!
Have a great day..
