16V Fuel Line Conversion to AN
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From: N NJ
16V Fuel Line Conversion to AN
PIC of the engine, -6 AN hoses start at the engine compartment lines.
SC intake not yet installed.
The goal was to increase fuel flow so their's no chance of leaning out under boost. In the PICS below notice the elimiation of the fuel dampner, and a adjustable fuel pressure regulator "MAGNA FUEL". The B.E.G.I. fuel regulator is for boost conditions. Fuel pressure is set to 37 PSI (vaccum conditions) stock FP was 30 PSI. Idle is smoother and steady. Use to have a surge in second gear low speed, no more.
SC intake not yet installed.
The goal was to increase fuel flow so their's no chance of leaning out under boost. In the PICS below notice the elimiation of the fuel dampner, and a adjustable fuel pressure regulator "MAGNA FUEL". The B.E.G.I. fuel regulator is for boost conditions. Fuel pressure is set to 37 PSI (vaccum conditions) stock FP was 30 PSI. Idle is smoother and steady. Use to have a surge in second gear low speed, no more.
Last edited by toofast928; Dec 9, 2012 at 10:56 PM.
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From: N NJ
About 6 weeks and my CC is still warm to the touch. PM me and I'll give the details. I still have enough metric to AN fittings and AN hose ends to eliminate the fuel dampner.... if your interested.
Tony
Tony
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From: N NJ
928C
Sweet!
What type of adapter did you use coming from the hard line into the eng. bay?
Does the adapter have a AN part number?
Using the SC the BEGI fuel regulator will pressureizing the fuel system to 100 PSI under boost (stock maxed 45 psi) So every connection is strong enough to hold 350 psi.
The hard line is 3/8 in diam, so big enough to fuel 500 HP. The fitting at the end of the hard line is flare line compression. (not pipe thread, not inverted flare, but line compression metric) No one makes a conversion fitting to AN. So for the fuel feed I cut the hose off the barb nipple and had a speed shop weld together the barb to male fitting -6 AN. It works great and even opened the end up a little on the barb fitting (the tip of the barb is smaller than 3/8). For the fuel return barb nipple just clamped -6 hose, no pressure.
If your planning on replacing the engine compartment hoses. The big three don't stock the hoses. So it's easy and cheap to cut away the hose from the nipples and use -6 hose. Use a good hose clamp. Porsche just pushed on the hose on to the barb, so using a clamp yeilds a higher fuel line pressure than stock.
Sweet!
What type of adapter did you use coming from the hard line into the eng. bay?
Does the adapter have a AN part number?
Using the SC the BEGI fuel regulator will pressureizing the fuel system to 100 PSI under boost (stock maxed 45 psi) So every connection is strong enough to hold 350 psi.
The hard line is 3/8 in diam, so big enough to fuel 500 HP. The fitting at the end of the hard line is flare line compression. (not pipe thread, not inverted flare, but line compression metric) No one makes a conversion fitting to AN. So for the fuel feed I cut the hose off the barb nipple and had a speed shop weld together the barb to male fitting -6 AN. It works great and even opened the end up a little on the barb fitting (the tip of the barb is smaller than 3/8). For the fuel return barb nipple just clamped -6 hose, no pressure.
If your planning on replacing the engine compartment hoses. The big three don't stock the hoses. So it's easy and cheap to cut away the hose from the nipples and use -6 hose. Use a good hose clamp. Porsche just pushed on the hose on to the barb, so using a clamp yeilds a higher fuel line pressure than stock.
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From: Kelowna B.C.
Thanks for the info toofast928
I've been juggling the idea of changing a number of hoses and possiblly going to AN fittings. I have a good source of them and MS fittings @ my work.
But I think I might take your advice and use the original fittings and hose clamps. Untill I make a major change Like a SC.
I've been juggling the idea of changing a number of hoses and possiblly going to AN fittings. I have a good source of them and MS fittings @ my work.
But I think I might take your advice and use the original fittings and hose clamps. Untill I make a major change Like a SC.
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From: N NJ
928BC,
I would, the Porsche hard line from the fuel pump to the engine compartment hose is nice neat in it's holder. The line to hose barb ends are exactly -6 AN or 3/8 hose. Stainless Steel braid hose and a good fuel injection hose clamp is good for 200 psi+. Remember the stock L Jet or LH is 45 max.
The main importance is to replace the engine compartment fuel hoses. The Porsche OEM hose is nice, double wrapped, thick, but it's impossible to see the hose condotion without cutting the barb off. The hoses were not designed for 20 years of service and being dipped in MTBE/ETBE (oxy-fuel).
Tony
I would, the Porsche hard line from the fuel pump to the engine compartment hose is nice neat in it's holder. The line to hose barb ends are exactly -6 AN or 3/8 hose. Stainless Steel braid hose and a good fuel injection hose clamp is good for 200 psi+. Remember the stock L Jet or LH is 45 max.
The main importance is to replace the engine compartment fuel hoses. The Porsche OEM hose is nice, double wrapped, thick, but it's impossible to see the hose condotion without cutting the barb off. The hoses were not designed for 20 years of service and being dipped in MTBE/ETBE (oxy-fuel).
Tony
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This is of interest to me.
I've managed to find a fellow who found me an adaptor for the end of the fuel rail, so I can mount a fuel pressure gauge sensor, he suggested I remotely mount the sensor, and had a source for braided stainless lines with AN fittings, who built up a line for that application.
But as you've said, there isn't any adaptors for the fuel lines.
I've thought about getting AN fittings welded to the factory hose barbs, you've prooven that's doable, so I'll ask for where steel AN fittings are available from?
I haven't verified that fuel lines are still not available from the big-3, but I've heard that rumor, and am trying to find other sources of lines myself.....
Good thread!
I've managed to find a fellow who found me an adaptor for the end of the fuel rail, so I can mount a fuel pressure gauge sensor, he suggested I remotely mount the sensor, and had a source for braided stainless lines with AN fittings, who built up a line for that application.
But as you've said, there isn't any adaptors for the fuel lines.
I've thought about getting AN fittings welded to the factory hose barbs, you've prooven that's doable, so I'll ask for where steel AN fittings are available from?
I haven't verified that fuel lines are still not available from the big-3, but I've heard that rumor, and am trying to find other sources of lines myself.....
Good thread!
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From: N NJ
Steel AN -6 male end is common. I was doubtful it would work but the man did a nice job. My fuel pressure gauge is electronic. The sender is tapped off the 1/4 port of the MAGNA fuel regulator. I'm not a fan of drilling the right fuel rail cap and tapping in 1/4 gauge. That cap's threads are not designed to seal without the ball. (I know it works but...) You could use metric conversion fitting and fuel block, install a fuel gauge where ever you want.
Cheaper yet replace the engine compartment fuel feed hose as described above. Use push barbs and a fuel gauge adapter. (Earl's carry's them or Jegs.) An electronic fuel gauge can be mounted in the passenger compartment, mechanical gauge no.
Cheaper yet replace the engine compartment fuel feed hose as described above. Use push barbs and a fuel gauge adapter. (Earl's carry's them or Jegs.) An electronic fuel gauge can be mounted in the passenger compartment, mechanical gauge no.
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Originally Posted by Brett Rickman
I've thought about getting AN fittings welded to the factory hose barbs, you've prooven that's doable, so I'll ask for where steel AN fittings are available from?
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerc...11&prmenbr=361
not sure where to get steel.
They also have a bunch of metric conversion fittings:
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerc...73&prmenbr=361
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerc...18&prmenbr=361
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerc...76&prmenbr=361
Do none of these do what we want?
I have to admit I'm pretty clueless about all these different connection standards (AN, NPT, compression, flare, ball, etc.), but I'd like to learn more. Anybody have a primer or a link to one? What is it we have in our cars? What do we want?
I'm looking to hook a fuel pressure guage up at a minimum. Maybe more if I supercharge.
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From: N NJ
AN stands for Army Navy, standard USA hoses and fittings, connection is sealed by the 37 deg flare. Don't be confused with JIS AN (found on fuel regulator) JIS fittings have similar thread to NPT but seal by an O ring. Very common mistake!
NPT National Pipe Thread, The threads seal the connection. Tighter the turn stronger the seal.
Compression fitting is sealed by use of a ferrule. ex ice maker 1/4 plastic hose
Flare end is used on hard lines. The tightness of the connection crushes the roll in the flare. eg Brake line has 2 compression flares.
Ball fittings is what the 928 is full of. Similar to AN just metric flare, verted or inverted.
None of the above line/hose connections are intermate. In other words you need an adapter fitting to go from AN to NPT, or Inverted Ball to AN (928 fuel rail).
Go to PARKER FLUID CONNECTORS web site and knock yourself out.................
NPT National Pipe Thread, The threads seal the connection. Tighter the turn stronger the seal.
Compression fitting is sealed by use of a ferrule. ex ice maker 1/4 plastic hose
Flare end is used on hard lines. The tightness of the connection crushes the roll in the flare. eg Brake line has 2 compression flares.
Ball fittings is what the 928 is full of. Similar to AN just metric flare, verted or inverted.
None of the above line/hose connections are intermate. In other words you need an adapter fitting to go from AN to NPT, or Inverted Ball to AN (928 fuel rail).
Go to PARKER FLUID CONNECTORS web site and knock yourself out.................
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No, I didn't wish to drill the cap either. As I've said, the fellow who rebuilt my injectors found a source for the reverse ball seal fitting, for the end of the fuel rail. So I have a correct fitting off the rail, going into an AN fitting, through a braided stainless fuel line, then to a sensor mounted of the fender well, then the wire loom into the cab, where my electric gauge is.
I bought my fuel gauge from Summit, with the sensor. I tried to tell them what I needed for an adaptor, Female threads both ends, instead I got a male/female item, and that won't work, and they say there is not such an item available.
And sublimate, all those fittings you found at Jegs, are male to male. The threads coming off my fuel rail, are male. I cannot easily find someone who has the 12mm x 1.5 thread in a female coupling. Especially a correct one with the reverse ball seal! So to answer your question, for me anyway, no, they don't have what we need for our sharks. Believe me, I've tried to talk to 'em!
I bought my fuel gauge from Summit, with the sensor. I tried to tell them what I needed for an adaptor, Female threads both ends, instead I got a male/female item, and that won't work, and they say there is not such an item available.
And sublimate, all those fittings you found at Jegs, are male to male. The threads coming off my fuel rail, are male. I cannot easily find someone who has the 12mm x 1.5 thread in a female coupling. Especially a correct one with the reverse ball seal! So to answer your question, for me anyway, no, they don't have what we need for our sharks. Believe me, I've tried to talk to 'em!
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I picked up the fuel rail inlet adapter 16mm female ball to - 6 AN male from MOTEC in Hunington Beach, 714 895-7001 ask for Greg. 2 for the rail, 1 for fuel return hose.
Also Carl at 928 Motorsports has the -6 hose end ball fittings, female. See his PIC of a L-Jet SC install. The fittings are yellow in color.
I picked up the return rail adapter fittings (8 AN to 16mm 1.5 male to male) from Pegasus Racing, 800 688-6946, http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/gro...PTMET---------
2 of these fittings for the rail, 1 for fuel feed off the engine compartment hose.
Also Carl at 928 Motorsports has the -6 hose end ball fittings, female. See his PIC of a L-Jet SC install. The fittings are yellow in color.
I picked up the return rail adapter fittings (8 AN to 16mm 1.5 male to male) from Pegasus Racing, 800 688-6946, http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/gro...PTMET---------
2 of these fittings for the rail, 1 for fuel feed off the engine compartment hose.
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From: N NJ
The return circuit of the L-Jet feeds fuel to the Cold Start Injector via small line welded to the fuel return x-over pipe. I tried everything to start the engine without this 9th injector. The ECM simply will not command more fuel to the injectors.
So with the deletion of the rear section of the fuel return hard line, and OEM fuel regulators, I tee off the -8 hose (off RT fuel rail return) to feed the Cold Start Injector via 8mm banjo fitting. The banjo fitting is pouplar with RX7 fuel sys. My speed shop made the hose and banjo fitting, $15.00. You can see why it took me 6 weeks to source this stuff out.
So with the deletion of the rear section of the fuel return hard line, and OEM fuel regulators, I tee off the -8 hose (off RT fuel rail return) to feed the Cold Start Injector via 8mm banjo fitting. The banjo fitting is pouplar with RX7 fuel sys. My speed shop made the hose and banjo fitting, $15.00. You can see why it took me 6 weeks to source this stuff out.
Last edited by toofast928; Dec 9, 2012 at 10:55 PM.
