Factory alarm system as source of problem
11-15-2006, 04:02 PM
#16
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Certainly in the UK from '90 on cars with a "Porsche" alarm , the alarm system was made buy Hamilton and Palmer and was installed by Porsceh Cars uk. The installation standard on three cars I know of was appaling
One UK owner took his 928 to Hamilton and Palmer for diagnosis of a fault. They told him the alarm was so badly installed that to diagnose the fault they would have to re-install. After some wrangling Porsche cars UK agreed to pay for the re-install.
It took me the best part of a day to de-install the H and P alarm on the '90GT and restore the wiring back to non-alarm status.
One UK owner took his 928 to Hamilton and Palmer for diagnosis of a fault. They told him the alarm was so badly installed that to diagnose the fault they would have to re-install. After some wrangling Porsche cars UK agreed to pay for the re-install.
It took me the best part of a day to de-install the H and P alarm on the '90GT and restore the wiring back to non-alarm status.
11-15-2006, 04:32 PM
#17
928 Collector
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Lucas Technicians huh 
So, there is a fault state which I have encountered a few times and mentioned here, related to the factory alarm. If an aftermarket system is installed to unlock the doors, and it is not used, or for some reason the door is locked with the KEY, and then unlocked with an aftermarket (alarm or other) system, the car will not start. To resolve this, the key must be turned to the UNLOCK position in the door.
So, there is a fault state which I have encountered a few times and mentioned here, related to the factory alarm. If an aftermarket system is installed to unlock the doors, and it is not used, or for some reason the door is locked with the KEY, and then unlocked with an aftermarket (alarm or other) system, the car will not start. To resolve this, the key must be turned to the UNLOCK position in the door.
10-05-2007, 01:23 PM
#18
Stan,
My owner's manual had a long write-up about the alarm, and the last line was something like: If the alarm begins to malfunction, a temporary way to disable it is to jumper across pins X and Y in on the relay board. (Sort of a good reason not to keep it in the glove box I guess).
BTW- Stan I got the parts you sent, thank you very much!
My owner's manual had a long write-up about the alarm, and the last line was something like: If the alarm begins to malfunction, a temporary way to disable it is to jumper across pins X and Y in on the relay board. (Sort of a good reason not to keep it in the glove box I guess).
BTW- Stan I got the parts you sent, thank you very much!
I have had periodic engine shutdowns (3 episodes), followed by no starts for several hours since early July. Without going into detail; is there any common means to:
1) set up an alarm activation alert that would signal that the alarm has locked out the ignition?
2) disengage the alarm once it has cut out ignition. For example, on the side of the road, can you simply use the long key in one of the door locks, to disable the alarm?
3) lastly; I did find
that even after polishing all the grounds, that I hadn't checked that second smaller bus that connects to the battery plus terminal, and it was just hanging on the stud. This I believe feeds the engine computers...does it also feed the alarm?Mike
10-05-2007, 02:32 PM
#19
Electron Wrangler
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1) Yes - you can add an LED connected to the coil input of the EZK relay to show when the alarm is disabled (goes out with ignition on for disable)
2) With key - NO - because this is not the alarm triggering normally - that cannot happen with the ignition on. Instead its a control unit malfunction or an alarm relay drop-out.
Otherwise - YES Connect the EZK coil input to Ignition (15) with a switch or jumper.
3) Kind of - it is fed from the CE panel (from the power to the EZK relay most of the time). But while the ECU feeders do power this line - the drop out would happen even with the alarm bypassed if the EZK looses power... loose connections to the battery on the ECU is bad news.
Alan
2) With key - NO - because this is not the alarm triggering normally - that cannot happen with the ignition on. Instead its a control unit malfunction or an alarm relay drop-out.
Otherwise - YES Connect the EZK coil input to Ignition (15) with a switch or jumper.
3) Kind of - it is fed from the CE panel (from the power to the EZK relay most of the time). But while the ECU feeders do power this line - the drop out would happen even with the alarm bypassed if the EZK looses power... loose connections to the battery on the ECU is bad news.
Alan
10-05-2007, 03:27 PM
#20
Thanks Alan...I'll apply a solution and we'll see how this all works out. I feel bad for the beating that I've given the ECUs, while looking right over an obvious problem.
BTW: Having been surfing these threads for 5 months, you seem to be the hardest hitter in the 928 electronics department...and there are a few heavy hitters. Do any of the shops/customers buy your time in solving difficult electrical/electronic issues? Just curious...
Mike
BTW: Having been surfing these threads for 5 months, you seem to be the hardest hitter in the 928 electronics department...and there are a few heavy hitters. Do any of the shops/customers buy your time in solving difficult electrical/electronic issues? Just curious...
Mike
09-21-2011, 11:12 AM
#21
Pro
I think the factory alarm on my '85 ROW car gave me trouble yesterday. When I went to start the car I got a relay 'click' and no interior lights. Checked ground strap connection, turned off ignition off, interior lights came back on, turned ignition, 'click', no start no lights. Turned ign off and on again same effect. Half a dozen times. When I started to look into the CE panel I noticed the passenger door jam contact pin was sticking out more than usual. Pushed it in and it started. Strange. I've been setting the alarm much more recently when I park it and I wonder if it's related.
05-28-2012, 06:34 PM
#22
Time to resurrect this with a new spin on MY 1990 928 Factory Alarm system.
1. Driver's side LED works (flashes) when the car is either locked or unlocked.
2. When I central lock the car using the key cylinder in either door (with the window open so I can trigger the alarm), it makes no difference when I force open the door (manually turn the lock dial to open it).
3. I swapped LED pins and sure enough, the pulse sender in the door of the passengers side needs to be replaced because the "working" LED lock pin does not work on the passengers side.
4. Would this alone disable the proper function of the factory alarm system?
Or what is the reason the alarm will not arm even though an LED flashes?
1. Driver's side LED works (flashes) when the car is either locked or unlocked.
2. When I central lock the car using the key cylinder in either door (with the window open so I can trigger the alarm), it makes no difference when I force open the door (manually turn the lock dial to open it).
3. I swapped LED pins and sure enough, the pulse sender in the door of the passengers side needs to be replaced because the "working" LED lock pin does not work on the passengers side.
4. Would this alone disable the proper function of the factory alarm system?
Or what is the reason the alarm will not arm even though an LED flashes?
05-29-2012, 01:00 AM
#24
1. I have the LONG key and that is what I am using.
2. In my previous post point "1" the LED flashes with the doors locked and unlocked. You said, "The flashing LEDs only indicates the doors are locked." So then, what does the flashing LEDs indicate when the doors are unlocked?
2. In my previous post point "1" the LED flashes with the doors locked and unlocked. You said, "The flashing LEDs only indicates the doors are locked." So then, what does the flashing LEDs indicate when the doors are unlocked?
05-29-2012, 03:28 PM
#26
I have the WSM but that is of no help if I am not an expert at knowing "how-to" read it....
Thanks for pointing out a "possible" avenue to take.
As to starting a NEW thread, I am being responsible by reading before posting so as to use a similar thread and avoid just posting for the sake of posting.
Trying not to tick off The Administrator
I will re-post in the evening when more people are available.
Thanks for pointing out a "possible" avenue to take.
As to starting a NEW thread, I am being responsible by reading before posting so as to use a similar thread and avoid just posting for the sake of posting.
Trying not to tick off The Administrator
I will re-post in the evening when more people are available.
11-24-2012, 02:23 AM
#27
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I tried to jump my alarm system ('90 928S4 ROW) as per the photos in post #10. I disconnected the alarm control unit (928 637 104 03 ROW) and jumped 15 and 87a.
Engine cranks but ignition or fuel pump are not allowing it to fire up? Weird given that the photos in post #10 show the same setup, same model and it is a RHD car to boot.
Any ideas?
Engine cranks but ignition or fuel pump are not allowing it to fire up? Weird given that the photos in post #10 show the same setup, same model and it is a RHD car to boot.
Any ideas?
11-24-2012, 12:46 PM
#28
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Loon--
Did the car start/run correctly before you added the jumper? Or are we chasing a no-start problem through a suspect alarm controller?
Did the car start/run correctly before you added the jumper? Or are we chasing a no-start problem through a suspect alarm controller?
11-24-2012, 11:47 PM
#30
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Problem solved - the car didn't start because of stupidity - mine! I attempted a fix the morning after our yacht club pre-Christmas bash.
I jumped 87a and 15 whilst holding the Control Module beside the pin connector. Yup, instead of jumping the bottom row pins 1 & 3, I did the mirror image and jumped 2 & 4. So, crank but not start. This morning I got up with a much clearer head and ....
On the positive side, I spent a good amount of time yesterday afternoon perusing the Wiring Diagrams and 928 Wiring Primer. For one thing, I discovered my "1989" car is wired to the 1990 diagram. And it's interesting to see how it all fits together.
Thanks for the input guys! This forum really is remarkable. Cheers, Cameron
PS - I wanted a temporary bypass to the alarm system in order to track a parasitic drain which seems connected to the alarm, while also being able to lock the car.
I jumped 87a and 15 whilst holding the Control Module beside the pin connector. Yup, instead of jumping the bottom row pins 1 & 3, I did the mirror image and jumped 2 & 4. So, crank but not start. This morning I got up with a much clearer head and ....
On the positive side, I spent a good amount of time yesterday afternoon perusing the Wiring Diagrams and 928 Wiring Primer. For one thing, I discovered my "1989" car is wired to the 1990 diagram. And it's interesting to see how it all fits together.
Thanks for the input guys! This forum really is remarkable. Cheers, Cameron
PS - I wanted a temporary bypass to the alarm system in order to track a parasitic drain which seems connected to the alarm, while also being able to lock the car.