Kevin in Atlanta

Top relay slot (85) supplies constant ground. Check!
Bottom relay slot (86) should get voltage with the key on. No.
Bottom relay slot (86) should get voltage while turning to start the car. Yes in all gears.

Time to trace from the 86. I guess.

While looking at the CE panel I saw this:

Bare wire goes from right side of block the left side of the same block

76FJ55

That's not confidence inspiring.

In the spare tire well (I think) is a 6 pin connector. Pin 3 (violet) and pin 4 (Violet/white) go to the transmission safety switch. this connector connects pin 3 to brown (ground) and pin 4 to brown/yellow (from pin 85 of starter relay). If you disconnect this connector and it still starts, then the problem is most likely in the CE panel. if when disconnected the car no longer starts then the problem is between the connector and the trans safety switch.

85 of the relay should only supply ground in Park or neutral (you have a problem).
86 should get voltage in start position in all gears (correct)

Kevin in Atlanta

First of all, thanks for all your help!

Next order of business is tracing the ground.

Given my limited understanding I believe the switched ground at the CE panel is shorting to ground somewhere between the neutral switch and the CE panel.

I think I want to see behind the CE panel and begin looking there.

Kevin in Atlanta

I have continuity from 85 on the relay block to

G Block pin connectors to ground- continuity bolded.
11 21
12 22
13 23
14 24
15 25

If I've numbered them wrong let me know.

It strikes me that I shouldn't have that many pins with continuity.

Conector side

11 21

12 22

13 23

14 24*

15 25*

Bolded have continuity. The * indicates a lower reading when my continuity tester bulb was dimmer than the others.


And with the connector disconnected I still have continuity from the 86 to the body.

Kevin in Atlanta

Let's ignore all that.

According to the WSM the XIV - 85 goes to A23.

Kevin in Atlanta

The first connector on the CE panel indicates A and B on the first connector - I am puzzled. Nevermind

And the 23 wire is yellow and lacks continuity to 86 on XIV.

The CE panel is likely a replacement - the board and the relay sockets are white - no yellowing.

The CE # is 928-610-105-17 The 17 lettering is in silver.

Kevin in Atlanta

More digging - yes the 85 on the XIV relay should go to to A23 and yes there's no continuity.

I need to pull the CE panel.

76FJ55

I'm a little confused by this. Earlier in the thread you had already tested voltage at 86 and determined you had voltage there in the start position, which is correct.

Why not run the test I suggested early with disconnecting the 6 pin plug in the spare tire well.

Kevin in Atlanta

I am confused, too.

I said 86 when I should have said 85. I've edited my posts - I hope that clears this up.

There is continuity to ground just not where I am expecting it. According the WSM the supplied ground should come from A23.

I have continuity from 85 on the relay block to G Block blades in bold.
11 21
12 22
13 23
14 24
15 25

I'm going to disconnect the grounds as you suggest.

Jason89s4

Yeah, just based on the looks of that burnt bare wire, I'd say pull the panel and look at what may have been modified on the backside.
(I've seen some crazy re-wiring on the back side by prior owners....and you never know until you pull it and look.)
Did you check the part number on the CE panel (on front top) to see if it is in fact for your car!
-Jason

Kevin in Atlanta

Did this and it still starts.

Kevin in Atlanta

The CE # is 928-610-105-17 The 17 lettering is in silver.

76FJ55

Edited to add more detail:

Per the 89 diagram that I have pin 85 should go to U23 this should be the wire out to the trans safety switch. the ground is then supplied by the safety switch 85 also goes to V14 which connects to the LH on pin 30.


You were correct in 86 going to A23. this should be the supplied 12V power when the ignition is in the crank position.

Kevin in Atlanta

You are correct - my 86 85 dyslexia at play - And there is continuity at U23 to 85.

And there is continuity from the U23 connector side to ground. This leads me back to the wiring to and at the transmission. Right?

76FJ55

Yes, -17 is the correct part number for 89.