Never heard of a seat breaking? Not as uncommon as you might think.

 

Fair point! Also a good reason to avoid low-quality aftermarket seats.

 

This is an interesting topic.

Regarding collisions, there are so many WHAT IFS.

Some say door bars are the most needed protection item, others think rollover protection is required.

Having been one who installed a Hanksville weld in rollbar & installed seats & harnesses in a daily driver I can say I have made mistakes, such as learning:
-welding ruins your glass from splatter if left unprotected.
-6 point and 5 point harnesses were designed for seats with a 5th hole, racing seats with 4 holes were designed for 4 point and usually don't work well with oem 3 point harnesses.
-I made the jump from 3 to 6 point and really wish I went 4 point.

 

OH GOOD!

An 87 944S is an Excellent car with Excellent Seat mounts... so much more solid than earlier versions!

--------


Heres a thought. New way of thinking, but it "feels true" from the drivers seat.

Air bags changed the game in a big way. Those of us without airbags risk destroying our faces on the steering wheel. So we lock our selves in with belts & seats? Now in a collision the head with a heavy helmet can rock & roll so a Hans device is a very good idea.

Now your head and neck is safe.

Or is it?

Rollover protection. Lets face it, you probably are at risk for a side collision more than a rollover, but if you carefully study the parts of your car that will collapse in a rollover, I now think a rollbar and racing seats/harness is "false protection" because your neck and back is going to break.

You are better off with a 3 point oem harness and seats and rollbar in a rollover than 4,5,6 point harness, because it allows your body to conform to the shape of the collapsing roof & a-pillars. Whereas if you are locked in, your neck is going to snap before the rollbar protects you.

 

I'm a tall guy too (6'3") and with a helmet I can touch the roof. I can totally see your point.

 

Sent you another PM.

 

I'm going to be picking up the Redline bar from will968 next week. This thread worked out nicely!
Thanks guys.

 

Your welder should know this but the secret for us tallies is to cut holes in the floor first. This will provide extra room near the roof for the welds. Then you raise it up and the floor pieces will cover the holes.

 

Out of curiosity, does anyone have any empirical evidence of how well the Redline bar performs?

Like in a roll over? http://www.redlinerennsport.com/SafeguardPage.html

For harness I am sure it is fine.

I have one in my DE 968.

 

This is the one I run, similar to Redline (also uses same mounting points) but with some additional triangulation. Produced by the same person that makes High Strung 44 control arms.

 

There's a reason all sanctioned racing organizations don't allow 4 point... They're just not as good at holding you in place as a 5 or 6 point belt.


Airbags aren't about "saving your face on the steering wheel", but rather they are to reduce blunt trauma to the head from the windshield. The also reduce basal skull fractures (your skull breaking off of your spinal cord).

But, you are right, put on a helmet, and now, with the extra weight, a basal skull fracture is more likely. That is specifically why the HANS (head and neck restraint) device was invented - to help hold the helmet back so your neck doesn't overextend.

Full harnesses aren't street legal because, like condoms, they are highly susceptible to user error. When used properly, they're great... but too many people either don't have the belts mounted properly, don't use a proper seat with them, or don't tighten them down enough. 3 point belts are more tolerant to lackadaisical idiots.

Anecdotally, the majority of accidents I've seen at the track (both at DEs and races) are single car impacts with stationary objects. Properly attached/used harnesses, seat, and head/neck restraint do wonders to keep people safe in those.

Porsches are pretty strong in rollovers (unless they're convertibles) - a roll bar like you're getting isn't really going to change that or make it more robust. But, again, it provides you with a way to properly mount a 5 or 6 point harness. And that will help you in ALL impacts - even a rollover.

 

You can sit on the anti-submarine belt(s) if you don't have a seat with the fifth hole. They attach to the same mount as the lap belt. I'll see if I can find a diagram. Many (SCCA) tech inspectors have been surprised by this. I usually have to show them the diagram in the rule book.

OK - found it. Sorry for the poor quality image. This is from the current GCRs.

 

Thanks to wil968 I have the Redline bar installed! One step closer.

Next part: Is it okay to mount the FE to this bar or do I really need to get one of the (what seems overpirced) mounts for the passenger seat (manual)?
Thanks
Chris

 

Will you be able to reach it....? I don't think I'd risk it becoming a projectile.

Hand-held is minimum in PCA but an onboard sytem with a minimum 2 T nozzles should be.

If I'm in a cabin full of smoke doing 100mph in traffic, the last thing I wanna be thinking is the procedure steps to unbuckle a floor mounted handheld.

ESS comes with it's own mount.

T

 

Remember guys this is not a race car, just something for DE. I'm not going to install a fire suppression system, just wondering if others have bolted to other location besides the seat bracket.