aka 951

Anyone else driven one of these cars? I know, I know they are like replicas of the NA 944 in that they have 155hp, weigh about 2750lbs, and are rear drive two door coupes. Interestingly enough, they seem to be worth more than older NAs in this part of town also...

Anyway, I'm in the process of doing some headwork on my 924S and I'm driving a friend's 91? 240SX in the meantime. Honestly, the structure does not feel as rigid as a 944, but there are almost no problems at all with this car at 165,000 miles! The doors don't make the nice "thud" that my 924S does but there are no squeaks or rattles!!! Also, everything still works and works well.

What really gets me is the way it handles (It is an SE model I believe). I believe it has a multi-link set-up in the rear and anti-roll bars at the front and rear. There is virtually no body roll and the car is very predicatable. I'd guess that it'd be easier to peddle this car around a track or autocross course than a 944. Its actually more enjoyable to drive to work also.

Anyone else suprised at how well these cars were built and designed? Any converts?

stupenal

I'm considering getting a 240sx over the 944 because of the fact that you don't need to borrow a friend's car to drive around when the 944 is at the shop or on the blocks. That being said, in 1991 they introduced a new engine, the Ka24de i think its wat its called. Anyways, this is the one where you have your numbers for, but the torque on this thing is also in the 150 range. A rarity considering most Japanese "sports" cars are lackin the torque dept.

Anyways, I'm guessing a 944 like car was the goal nissan developers were trying to come up, considering the car looks pretty similar to the 951 while combining the same #s as the 944. The car handles decently, but many people argue it doesnt handle as well as the 944, and definitly doesn't brake as well. The prices on the car, around 4k for a 93, and 7k for a 95+, are somewhat higher than a 944, considering the preventive maintenance costs associated with the 944.

Another thing about the 240sx. In japan, there is 2.0 L turbo engine still being produced and used (the infamous SR20DET) Capable of 240 hp, this is a fav amongst the 240 crowd. Even with the stock engine, the car still pulls well in all gears. At the track, however, i think the lack of good brakes and not as balanced weight distr. gives the 944 an advantage.

Another comment brought up when comparing 944s to 240sx's, the 944 has more feedback and soul to it. The 240sx is more of a car, not another living soul that responds to your actions. Also, the interior of nissans aren't too well designed. but then again, just take a look at the cracked dashes and broken switches in 944s. Anyways, to sum it all up, yes, the 240sx is a good car, but is it as good as a 944? That's up to you to decide.

stupenal

aka 951, just realized after reading your sig, that you're wolfpri from pelican huh. Anyways, I remember i posted a similar topic before there, and you responded with most of what i put in my previous post. SOrry for the repeat of info. Btw, i don't know if you ever got my PM, but how's your uncle's 944? Is it still for sale? If so, I'd love to get some info on it. Thanks!

Lemon Yellow 87 n/a

Even if the 240sx was identical to the 944 I would not feel as good driving it. As said above, the Porsche has "soul" and I believe it has a certain pedigree to it.

Kierf - ¿§?

I think I would take a '97 240SX with the SR20DET over my 951 (maybe).

What is this 'soul' you folks speak of? I know I don't have one, nor does my car.

Danno

I've got a friend with one of these cars and we thrash the crap out of it! We do McRae wannabe rally-drivers up in the mountains on dirt roads. He can almost keep up with me in my 951 in the twisties. He's got 150K-miles on it and in the last two years, he's had to do ZERO maintenance on it (aside from oil-changes and brake-pads).

In that same period, I've had to replace the following on my 160K-miles 951:

• clutch
• A-arm ball-joints
• brake-rotors & 2 sets of pads
• water-pump
• timing & balance belts
• rear CV joints
• headgasket
• crank & balance-shaft seals
• radiator

So basically, for the price of just my 951's maintenance alone, I could've gone out and bought a used 240sx!
I was even contemplating getting one just for track-only car. But now I'm leaning towards a 914 with an RX-7 TwinTurbo motor!

lordgrommit

Well since I own a 240sx I've got to say it's not a bad car I use it for around town when I don't feel like shifting. It's got the auto which takes quite a bit out of the engine but it's still going strong and since it had a little cosmetic damage I got it for a song.

Matt

marksportcts

The KA24DE is a Nissan truck motor, that is why is is only available in the US 240SX. Nontheless, a nice car.

Lemon Yellow 87 n/a

The motor is indestructible.I have also heard of zero maintenance high milers. No t belts an all that crap, just good ol nissan truck motor (They gave the viper guys inspiration) in a competent sport chassis.

Brian Wilson

My car has a badge, the nissan just has a name.

Call me ... whatever, but I buy in to the whole "I drive a Porsche" thing.

ribs

That would be a killer set up...a 914, completely gutted to the bone (like 1900 pounds with the motor I am about to describe), with a 13B-REW motor. If I were to do it, I would get forged output shaft gears (some are good for 15,000 RPM's), custom output shaft (the stock ones have a tendancy to brake over 500 hp...if you don't know, the output shaft is the equivalent of the crank in a piston motor), lightened rotors, 3mm apex seals, newest j-spec housings (from the '99-'01 rx-7) with a big *** bridge port, big *** turbo (T70 or bigger), a ton of fuel, a good cold air intake (the stock CAI set up on the 3rd gen rx-7 can sometimes suck in the hot air off of the intercooler, causing motors to randomly explode!), no cats with a custom 3"-3.5" exhaust, huge intercooler (where would you mount it on a 914 though...oh yeah...on the roof), good wastegate, and a nice fuel management computer, like wolf 3D 3.0 (rotary guys love this one), tec II/III, etc etc. A motor like that could run reliably (actually...probably more reliably than a stock FD3S) on 15 pounds of boost with 600+ HP on pump gas. There are several guys on the rx-7 forum running a similar set up with similar numbers. Of course, this isn't in a 914...which would just be insane. You would of course have to get some huge rear fender flares to hold the 335mm+ rear tires you would require back there just to make the car safe to take around corners with your foot on the gas. You would have one mean-as-hell track car if you did all this.

Call me crazy, but I have been thinking about what I would do if I ever irreperably damaged my motor in my 951, and have come to the conclusion that I would be happiest with a 20B cosmo motor swap (thats 3 rotors...they never had any 3 rotors in the US), fully built, much like I described above, but with 3 rotors instead of 2. That motor with those specs is capable of of 900 HP or so, just as reliable. I don't think my transaxle would last though. I like that idea better than a small block chevy swap as it is very unique, and even with 3 rotors and all the turbo equipment, will probably weigh about the same as the original motor and accessories, not to mention the weight will be a bit further back in the engine bay, giving my car even better handling characteristics. Anyways, enough of my drunken babbles...I think its time for bed.

Oh ****...I forgot what this topic was about. Nissans are like fish...soulless. I get about as much enjoyment from driving a 240 SX as I do thinking about driving one...absolutely none. Even their previous flagship sportscar...a 300Z twin turbo, when I test drove one about a year ago, left me feeling like I masturbated, while driving my porsche makes me feel like I had sex. It is ridiculous how little feedback you get from most japanese cars. The best jap sportscars are and always have been mazda, even if they are quirky and not normal (and sometimes ferrari-like expensive to maintain, like 3rd gen rx-7's if you don't fix the built in flaws)...I loved driving my 2nd gen rx-7 every bit as much as my 951...it made you feel 1 with the car. My toyota (celica all-trac) feels like you are remote controlling the car, or playing a video game while you are driving it. I recently learned how to get this car (all-trac) which is, by design, impossible to loose traction in (its AWD), to do 4 wheel drifts on dry cement...but it is no where near as fun as doing the same thing in my 951. You feel like you are playing a videogame in the toyota (I have driven every sporty toyota...3rd and 4th gen supras, both turbo and n/a, mr2's, turbo and n/a, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th gen celicas, all trims, and '85/'86 corollas, which were the funnest to drive, with the 2nd gen MR2 turbo coming in 2nd...none nearly as fun as my 951 though...as well as every nissan and honda I have ever driven...well...I haven't driven an S2K, and I didn't have the pleasure of whoring an NSX the only time I ever drove one...but all others) instead of sitting in the drivers seat, feeling the road, and being able to respond accordingly. I have driven hooked up examples of many of the cars I listed, and even though a stiffer suspenion helps, none came close to my 951 or previous rx-7's for feel and ultimate control (I have had 2 rx-7's, and plan to buy another 2nd gen turbo after I sell my all-trac). Well...enough for this incredibly long drunken post. It is late (or early, depending on how you gauge time). Laters.

Mr. Bates - Masta2U

It's not what you drive. It's how cool the chicks think you are because of what you are driving.

Getting chicks in a porsche is like white on rice. A shiny 944, especilly in a rad color like yellow or red gets the most chick for the money. Even better than a vette i think.

What chick wants to hang out with a guy driving dad's buick, when they can hang out with a guy they think is driving dads porsche.

Joel, sometimes you just have to say F$$k it!

Jason_86_951

Not knowing a whole lot about the 240 I'll speak from an encounter I once had:
I'll was cruising along a local strecth of hiway one night with my buddy and a newer (90-93??) 240 pulled up next to us, in its full on rice glory, well I couldn't resist and there was no other cars around. I gunned it as did he, it was pretty close most of the way untill we came to the off ramp that was a full 360 degree turn, I'll had pulled ahead in the last few hundred yards so I went in first. He was right behind me coming into this ramp, but by the time I emerged from this he was at least 100 yards behind. When we came to stop light he said he couldn't believe how fast I had pulled that corner off, and that in his car he couldn't even atempt something like that.

Take it for what its worth, IMHO I think their pretty close if not faster in the straits but cornering seems to go to our P-car.
(Oh, even if the 240 was better in every way I'd still drive a Porsche!!!)

Bryan

Interesting topic. A friend of mine had a 240SX a few years ago, so it was pretty new at the time. I rode in it and drove it several times and I was like "yeah whatever". It's funny - it seems like it's less than the sum of its parts. If you look at the numbers and such, the car should be great. But the actual driving experience is a little hem-haw. Not that exciting. I had a Prelude at the time so I was pretty non-biased. 944s seem to be greater than the sum of their parts. The numbers don't seem that impressive, but the driving experience is really great.

Another friend of mine has a Sentra SE-R. It's a blast but hasn't been trouble-free. We've done a clutch, axles, AC rebuild, suspension on all 4 corners, brakes, door hinges, exhaust, EGR system, tail light gaskets, wheel bearings, and several other things. The car's got about 130K on it. And is a '92. And is starting to use quite a bit of oil. My '88 944, purchased a year ago, with about the same mileage, has required about the same amount of work. I did a head on mine recently, but it looks like the SE-R will need a head soon. And I paid $2500 less for my car. So my car plus what I've spent on maintenance puts me about what his SE-R cost him just to buy - it was 6 years old when he bought it (in '98).

Basically I think there's less truth to the "Japanese cars never need work" theory and also less truth to 944 expense and unreliability.

It's true that Nissan doesn't seem to be able to have an original thought. The 240SX 944 copy, and the Sentra BMW 3-series copy. I think it's easier to be the follower than the leader. But which is better when the company's bottom line is at stake? Probably the way Nissan does it.

Bryan

MAS

I dunno... but my stock 924S is quite a bit faster than a 240. I'm not just saying that because I own a 924S either. I spent 2 years looking for a replacement for my 82 RX7. I looked at a number of cars including 240's and a number of 944's. Ended up buying the 924S mainly because of its superior perfomance.

-MAS