Here's a pict of my car with it's noral stance.
[Notice how low it sits in the rear]



Not take a look at these and notice how the inside rear tire stays planted but has a HUGE gap in the wheel well.

In this shot the front wheel is off the ground but the rear is planted with a gap.



In this shot... I'm cresting a hill. Again the rear has a gap



And last again the inside rear has a huge gap.



Any ideas what may be the cause? The car seems to handle well but I cant imagine it's how it should be.

Thanks in advance!

 

Is this in steady-state cornering or under transisitons? If steady-state, you need to soften that front sway-bar and get higher-rate front springs.

 

nice pics Doc.
Perhaps the rebound is set to soft? or maybe not..you may have it set real nice....the wheel seems to be maintaining contact. That is good.

 

The most surprising thing is, if you notice in the first "side shot" the front wheel is off the ground, (no travel) but the rear has tons of travel.

 

[quote]Originally posted by Doc:
<strong>The most surprising thing is, if you notice in the first "side shot" the front wheel is off the ground, (no travel) but the rear has tons of travel.</strong><hr></blockquote>

What is actually happening is the outside front wheel is compressed, pushing the stiff sway-bar up. This sway-bar then pushes the inside tire up as well, so much that it is no longer touching the ground.

The real problem, as Danno mentioned is that the front sway-bar is too stiff and the springs are too soft. If the sway-bar was softer, you would likely see a similar "gap" in the front fender as there was in the rear. If the front springs were stiffer, the outside tire wouldn't have so much travel. It would be interesting to see a picture of the outside front tire to see just how much it was actually compressing.

 

Dac, what sway bars and spring rates are you running? Just curious (very). <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

 

I'm running MO30 (968 Cup Car) Swaybars front and back. They're 3-way adjustable in the rear...(Set to stiffest) and honostly I can't remember at the moment if the fronts are adjustable too.

I'm running 450lbs springs up front.

 

I would have to agree with Renntag, it seems as though the rebound may be a bit soft.

Is the rear end adjustable for both bump and rebound? You may need to play with the different adjustments. <img src="graemlins/burnout.gif" border="0" alt="[burnout]" />

 

I'm running Bilsteins, full threaded body coil over all around, no adjustment on rebound or dampening.

 

Stiffer rebound damping would pick up the front wheel even more (doesn't let strut expand as quickly). Besides, shocks only play a role in the transition reponse of the car (from straight line through turn-in). Once you are at steady-state cornering, the balance is dictated only by the sum of the stiffnesses of the springs and swaybars.

This is a pretty typical road-racer progression. Guys with decades of racing experience will tell you to have really stiff front springs and soft rear springs. This will you plenty of rear traction for power coming out of corners (no spinning that inside rear tire). Also gives you faster straightaway speeds because you can fully get on the gas earlier in a corner.

 

I appreciate the input, however it's funny that everyone seems to be picking up on the ONE picture where I hit a burm and got the front wheel off the ground. There doesn't seem to be as much talk about what I was really asking... the inside rear wheel gap. (i.e. body roll)

Like I said, the car seems to handle fine, steering is great, but I can't help but feel that rear end could be better.

I've been holding off on mentioning anything becuase didn't want to influence any comments, but I still have the stock rear torsion bars which are shot. I installed some 350lbs helper springs back there to keep from dragging my ***... it was a lot easier than torsion bar replacent.

P.S. Not to look a gift horse in the mouth (I do appreciate all the comments,) but I'd really like to hear from racers who've had similar experience.

 

For the issue on the dampers, yes I was looking that the one with the front-wheel in the air. But for the springs issue, I was lookin at the last two photos, which shows you have the outside front tire very compressed. Combined with the rake of the car, it causes the rear of the car to rise up, overloading the outside front tire even more.

I say soften up the rear and/or increase the front spring-rate.

Also with rear tires that are 1" larger in diameter than stock, you should really lower the rear end 0.5" so that it's level with the front.

 

Doc,

Without knowing what springs, torsion bars and sway bars you are using - I will say that the gap you see in the pictures really is not the best gauge for how the car handles.
I did initially suspect that the front roll stiffness was considerably higher than the rear because of the picture where the left? front is off the ground. You mention that you had just hit a berm (that will do it).
It looks like the car is handling well. And if you think it is handling well - then maybe it is. On the other hand - if you are looking to make changes you may start by increasing the rear roll stiffness (can be accomplished with stiffer torsion bars (I think you mentioned that) or anti-sway bars). Just beware that increased roll stiffness at the rear will reduce understeer - or potentially increase oversteer. If as you say, the car feels good now - increasing the rear roll stiffness may make your car tail happy. Now I'm not one to say that tail-happiness is a bad thing. In fact it can be a blast! But unless you are using your car on a rally, oversteer is usually not the fast way 'round.

Scott
Team Harco Motorsports
Win on Sunday, Sleep on Monday"

 

You can have my used stock extra squishy 87 n/a shocks and struts. They're grrrrrreat (tony the tiger voice).

 

[B][Danno said- , I was lookin at the last two photos, which shows you have the outside front tire very compressed. ][/B]

Is it possible the front end is simply too low to begin with?

Scott- as I had mentioned in follow up posts, I'm running Bilsteins with full threaded bodies all the way around. Eibach 450lbs spring in the front and 300lbs helper springs rear with shot stock torsion bars. [the rear is already on the lowest ride height setting] And factory MO30 swaybars front and back. [3 way adjustable in the rear on the hardest setting.]