Planning a couple of projects, need some advice (content heavy)
10-09-2012, 03:18 PM
#1
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Planning a couple of projects, need some advice (content heavy)
Hey all,
Here's the background:
I have a 1987 Porsche 944 with a 1997 LT1 V8 (cam, lightly ported heads, valvesprings, rockers, intake, headers, exhaust). It puts out pretty good power and torque if i say so myself. I recently put some decent tires on nice wheels on it (see avatar). They are Eurotech wheels (not super light, but decent) with Sumitomo HTR ZIII summer tires on them, 265 rear, 225 front. I'm planning on probably going up to a 255 front eventually to get a more square setup, but that's going to be after this winter, in which i will be running some skinny winter tires and storing those wheels so my shiny-ness doesn't get ruined!
Here's what's going down:
I've been putting off doing the suspension on this car for a VERY long time...many of you who have met me and gone for a drive an attest to the fact that my suspension is SHOT.
I mean...totally shot.
Everything on the suspension side is stock. And old...i have receipts from the PO that new struts were put on 10+ years ago, they were stockers. The rear torsion bars are also stock. This makes for a very unpredictable, squishy yet shockingly harsh ride.
I have spec'd out and plan on purchasing a set of Bilstein Escort Cup coilovers for the front and rear. I am planning on deleting the torsion bars in the rear and running a straight coilover. I have received mixed suggestions about spring rate suggestions and would like to discuss and clarify some elements of my build before i go spending big coin, only later finding out i have to change something because I am dissatisfied.
I have heard with the Bilstein Escort Cup coilovers, a higher spring rate is desirable, because of the valving of the shocks. I have done EXTENSIVE reading on the forums, going through all of the technical discussions and working to understand the math going into calculating spring rates for the front and rear of a car. I have been suggested everything from a 300/400 lb/in setup, 350/550, 450/550, to 550/750. I have been told that the spring rate should not be split more than 100 pounds front to rear, but I have also read that the actual rate at the rear wheel equals about 42% of the measured spring rate, requiring a higher rate in the rear to be comparable to the front.
So, if you've read this far I thank you very much. I'll get to the nitty gritty now.
1. What spring rates should I run with the Escort Cup coilovers...remember I have a bit more weight in the front of the car, and a LOT of torque, which on the stock suspension equals SQUAT in the rear.
2. What should I do about sway bars? I have considered buying a set of 26.8/18mm turbo sway bars BUT...I have read that it can be beneficial to run WITHOUT a rear sway bar on a car with a lot of torque and NO LSD, because it will not allow the inner rear wheel to lift as easily, keeping the wheel from skipping under acceleration. This car is going to be mostly for street, in fact it is my DD and will stay that way, but I am less worried about pure comfort and more worried about a safe, stable ride, that I can take to a DE event and be confident in.
3. While I'm in there I will be installing a V8 swap trans mount (the product offered by xschop). It is a solid unit with poly isolators. I have had issues with my trans mount flex killing cv joints in the past, i do not want to recreate that problem.
4. What suspension bushings should I replace while I am installing the coilovers? I will most likely be running a set of camber plates, since my stock strut mounts are completely gone, and it is cheaper to buy high quality camber plates than replace with OEM rubber units. I do not want to break the bank on poly-bronze this and solid that...mostly I will be replacing old rubber with new rubber, to keep what sharpness out of the suspension I can. NOTE* I have relatively newly rebuilt front control arms (Rennbay). So I am not planning on doing much there, unless i absolutely have to replace a bad rubber bushing.
5. Where should I get such bushings for a decent price?
Thank you for sticking through and reading my post, and thank you in advance for your help!
Ethan Cooper
Here's the background:
I have a 1987 Porsche 944 with a 1997 LT1 V8 (cam, lightly ported heads, valvesprings, rockers, intake, headers, exhaust). It puts out pretty good power and torque if i say so myself. I recently put some decent tires on nice wheels on it (see avatar). They are Eurotech wheels (not super light, but decent) with Sumitomo HTR ZIII summer tires on them, 265 rear, 225 front. I'm planning on probably going up to a 255 front eventually to get a more square setup, but that's going to be after this winter, in which i will be running some skinny winter tires and storing those wheels so my shiny-ness doesn't get ruined!
Here's what's going down:
I've been putting off doing the suspension on this car for a VERY long time...many of you who have met me and gone for a drive an attest to the fact that my suspension is SHOT.
I mean...totally shot.
Everything on the suspension side is stock. And old...i have receipts from the PO that new struts were put on 10+ years ago, they were stockers. The rear torsion bars are also stock. This makes for a very unpredictable, squishy yet shockingly harsh ride.
I have spec'd out and plan on purchasing a set of Bilstein Escort Cup coilovers for the front and rear. I am planning on deleting the torsion bars in the rear and running a straight coilover. I have received mixed suggestions about spring rate suggestions and would like to discuss and clarify some elements of my build before i go spending big coin, only later finding out i have to change something because I am dissatisfied.
I have heard with the Bilstein Escort Cup coilovers, a higher spring rate is desirable, because of the valving of the shocks. I have done EXTENSIVE reading on the forums, going through all of the technical discussions and working to understand the math going into calculating spring rates for the front and rear of a car. I have been suggested everything from a 300/400 lb/in setup, 350/550, 450/550, to 550/750. I have been told that the spring rate should not be split more than 100 pounds front to rear, but I have also read that the actual rate at the rear wheel equals about 42% of the measured spring rate, requiring a higher rate in the rear to be comparable to the front.
So, if you've read this far I thank you very much. I'll get to the nitty gritty now.
1. What spring rates should I run with the Escort Cup coilovers...remember I have a bit more weight in the front of the car, and a LOT of torque, which on the stock suspension equals SQUAT in the rear.
2. What should I do about sway bars? I have considered buying a set of 26.8/18mm turbo sway bars BUT...I have read that it can be beneficial to run WITHOUT a rear sway bar on a car with a lot of torque and NO LSD, because it will not allow the inner rear wheel to lift as easily, keeping the wheel from skipping under acceleration. This car is going to be mostly for street, in fact it is my DD and will stay that way, but I am less worried about pure comfort and more worried about a safe, stable ride, that I can take to a DE event and be confident in.
3. While I'm in there I will be installing a V8 swap trans mount (the product offered by xschop). It is a solid unit with poly isolators. I have had issues with my trans mount flex killing cv joints in the past, i do not want to recreate that problem.
4. What suspension bushings should I replace while I am installing the coilovers? I will most likely be running a set of camber plates, since my stock strut mounts are completely gone, and it is cheaper to buy high quality camber plates than replace with OEM rubber units. I do not want to break the bank on poly-bronze this and solid that...mostly I will be replacing old rubber with new rubber, to keep what sharpness out of the suspension I can. NOTE* I have relatively newly rebuilt front control arms (Rennbay). So I am not planning on doing much there, unless i absolutely have to replace a bad rubber bushing.
5. Where should I get such bushings for a decent price?
Thank you for sticking through and reading my post, and thank you in advance for your help!
Ethan Cooper
10-09-2012, 06:58 PM
#2
Is the LT1 an iron block? If its aluminum it is no heavier than the stock motor.
My stock N/A has turbo sway bars front and rear with new bushings and 205/55-17 front tires. The fronts look good but they tramline, even after a deluxe wheel alignment. I'd be careful about going larger up front. I don't have a LSD either but the rear bar is not a problem. Buy the bushings from Pelican. Camber plates are a waste of money for a street car but I believe the later car's strut bushings are stupidly priced?
Personally I think coilovers are overkill for a DD, but I fully intend to convert my shocks/struts to Konis.
Sorry about no opinion on spring rates, I think they are pointless on a DD. Good luck!
My stock N/A has turbo sway bars front and rear with new bushings and 205/55-17 front tires. The fronts look good but they tramline, even after a deluxe wheel alignment. I'd be careful about going larger up front. I don't have a LSD either but the rear bar is not a problem. Buy the bushings from Pelican. Camber plates are a waste of money for a street car but I believe the later car's strut bushings are stupidly priced?
Personally I think coilovers are overkill for a DD, but I fully intend to convert my shocks/struts to Konis.
Sorry about no opinion on spring rates, I think they are pointless on a DD. Good luck!
10-09-2012, 07:21 PM
#4
Nordschleife Master
Forget coilovers which are a waste of money for a dd. Forget camber plates unless you like excessive noise in the cabin.
Fit stock rubber bushes or urethane, forget Delrin or billet.
Forget spring rate above 250 on a dd, the jarring gets old fast.
Follow Mr Clark's advise:
"A good sport suspension setup for a car that is primarily driven on the street might include 220 lb. front springs, 27 mm torsion bar, 30 mm front sway bar, and 19 mm rear sway bar. Personally, I like a car that has very neutral steering characteristics. If you prefer to maintain the understeering characteristics of the stock 944, you might prefer a 26 mm sway bar to the 27 mm. If you prefer a car that oversteers, you might choose a 28 mm torsion bar. Just realize that a car that oversteers is much more sensitive to steering corrections and can you into trouble during a panic maneuver. With regards to the sway bars, I really like the 968 M030 sway bars. The reason I like them is that the 19 mm rear bars are 3-way adjustable which give you another option when it comes to changing the steering characteristics."
Fit stock rubber bushes or urethane, forget Delrin or billet.
Forget spring rate above 250 on a dd, the jarring gets old fast.
Follow Mr Clark's advise:
"A good sport suspension setup for a car that is primarily driven on the street might include 220 lb. front springs, 27 mm torsion bar, 30 mm front sway bar, and 19 mm rear sway bar. Personally, I like a car that has very neutral steering characteristics. If you prefer to maintain the understeering characteristics of the stock 944, you might prefer a 26 mm sway bar to the 27 mm. If you prefer a car that oversteers, you might choose a 28 mm torsion bar. Just realize that a car that oversteers is much more sensitive to steering corrections and can you into trouble during a panic maneuver. With regards to the sway bars, I really like the 968 M030 sway bars. The reason I like them is that the 19 mm rear bars are 3-way adjustable which give you another option when it comes to changing the steering characteristics."
10-09-2012, 08:00 PM
#5
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Is the LT1 an iron block? If its aluminum it is no heavier than the stock motor.
My stock N/A has turbo sway bars front and rear with new bushings and 205/55-17 front tires. The fronts look good but they tramline, even after a deluxe wheel alignment. I'd be careful about going larger up front. I don't have a LSD either but the rear bar is not a problem. Buy the bushings from Pelican. Camber plates are a waste of money for a street car but I believe the later car's strut bushings are stupidly priced?
Personally I think coilovers are overkill for a DD, but I fully intend to convert my shocks/struts to Konis.
Sorry about no opinion on spring rates, I think they are pointless on a DD. Good luck!
My stock N/A has turbo sway bars front and rear with new bushings and 205/55-17 front tires. The fronts look good but they tramline, even after a deluxe wheel alignment. I'd be careful about going larger up front. I don't have a LSD either but the rear bar is not a problem. Buy the bushings from Pelican. Camber plates are a waste of money for a street car but I believe the later car's strut bushings are stupidly priced?
Personally I think coilovers are overkill for a DD, but I fully intend to convert my shocks/struts to Konis.
Sorry about no opinion on spring rates, I think they are pointless on a DD. Good luck!
Try breaking the rear end loose with as much torque as i do and you'll want that rear end to have both wheels planted on the ground. This is why i was intrigued by those not running a rear sway bar, and wanted to ask.
In addition, I do plan on seeing several HPDE's over the next year. A friend of mine owns one of these cars with a 525 horsepower built 383 stroker LT1, it's a turbo body. He suggested to me that the best thing to do with torsion bars once you get your hands on them (i.e. when swapping them) is to throw them in the recycling bin, their weight in steel is about all they are worth. I am inclined to go with his advice on this, however irrational it may seem to most.
thanks Doug!
I can get a set of top of the line camber plates for <$500, i can get ONE oem replacement rubber strut mount for $441 from Paragon...do the math...even if I don't regularly use the camber plates to adjust the suspension geometry, the money i save can buy me a damn cushion. I already have solid motor mounts, the vibrations from the road aren't going to bother me much more than the current CLUNK i get from the strut mounts trying to fall apart when i slowly pull into my driveway and the road drops off 3 inches to gravel.
Also, I will not go BELOW 300 on spring rates...i know how soft the stock is, and i will NOT put a suspension in this car that I have to pull out because it is too soft...I would much rather overshoot and have to put something a little softer in.
I have not completely given up hope on Koni's yet...ground control has some nice stuff and i've almost bought one of their coilover kits, but I haven't been able to give up on bilstein yet, especially because of the reviews i have heard. Ground Control's price is fantastic though...and that is a big plus for them.
10-09-2012, 08:09 PM
#6
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Important Note:
I will be lowering the car around 1 inch in the rear and probably somewhere around 2 inches in the front...this needs to be taken into consideration, i do NOT want my suspension soft enough to allow me to bottom out or scrape my undercarriage...i had enough of a problem with this before i picked up a set of new shocks off of doug so i would stop dragging my tailpipe when launching (7ish inches off the ground)
I will be lowering the car around 1 inch in the rear and probably somewhere around 2 inches in the front...this needs to be taken into consideration, i do NOT want my suspension soft enough to allow me to bottom out or scrape my undercarriage...i had enough of a problem with this before i picked up a set of new shocks off of doug so i would stop dragging my tailpipe when launching (7ish inches off the ground)
10-09-2012, 08:15 PM
#7
Three Wheelin'
if you have a 944 that has some power i would suggest upgrading the suspension. might not have to go all out but at least to a turbo spec. you should probably upgrade the brakes too. the ls1 engine is lighter then the turbo engine but i dont think its lighter then a na engine. correct me if im wrong. if your going to put it on the track i would stick to your goals and go with the coil overs and camber plates. do a search on spring rates on this board and the turbo board. plenty of info on these kind of questions. upgraded bushing also stiffen up the ride. you cant always believe what some of the rennlist community has to offer. dont let them scare you away from your goals and plans
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10-09-2012, 08:56 PM
#8
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Here are the specs on my '86 951:
Racer's Edge Lower Control Arms (early)
944S2 Spindles/Hubs/Front rotors
Racer's Edge Camber Plates
Racer's Edge Caster Blocks
Racer's Edge Rear Elephant bushings
Racer's Edge inner and outter Delrin Bushings
LEDA dampers
Front Hypercoil 500 lb springs (8" x 2.5")
Rear Hypercoil 600 lb springs (8" x 2.25") plus helpers (tb's deleted)
Gutted interior
Sunroof delete
Fuchs 7"/8" x 16" early offset
Hoosier R6 245/45/16 (track)
Bridgestone Potenza RE-11 (street)
I'm running about 1" lower than stock.
First bit of advice: talk Karl Poeltl at Racer's Edge. He is a wealth of information.
My opinions. Don't use delrin, it's too squeaky for the street. 500/600 springs are a little soft for the track, but pretty harsh for the street. My car weighs 2700 lbs, and I imagine your >3100? If so, 500/600 may be ok for you, but understand that it ain't gonna feel like a Lincoln. If you are going to lower the car, make sure you get the ball joints figured out.
I'm running stock sway bars, and square tires, and have gentle push that I can control with trail braking. Personally, I think you're on the right track with your idea of running without a rear swaybar since you don't have an LSD. Keep in mind that springs are a relatively small investment relative to the cost or effort it will take to delete the torsion bars and everything else you are planning.
If I were you, I'd guestimate where you think you want to end up with springs and use your existing sway bars. Then drive the car. Then buy another set of either front or rear springs and/or a bigger front sway bar.
My best guess is that a hardcore initial choice would be 500/700, and a only slightly more tame choice would be 400/600.
Good luck!
Racer's Edge Lower Control Arms (early)
944S2 Spindles/Hubs/Front rotors
Racer's Edge Camber Plates
Racer's Edge Caster Blocks
Racer's Edge Rear Elephant bushings
Racer's Edge inner and outter Delrin Bushings
LEDA dampers
Front Hypercoil 500 lb springs (8" x 2.5")
Rear Hypercoil 600 lb springs (8" x 2.25") plus helpers (tb's deleted)
Gutted interior
Sunroof delete
Fuchs 7"/8" x 16" early offset
Hoosier R6 245/45/16 (track)
Bridgestone Potenza RE-11 (street)
I'm running about 1" lower than stock.
First bit of advice: talk Karl Poeltl at Racer's Edge. He is a wealth of information.
My opinions. Don't use delrin, it's too squeaky for the street. 500/600 springs are a little soft for the track, but pretty harsh for the street. My car weighs 2700 lbs, and I imagine your >3100? If so, 500/600 may be ok for you, but understand that it ain't gonna feel like a Lincoln. If you are going to lower the car, make sure you get the ball joints figured out.
I'm running stock sway bars, and square tires, and have gentle push that I can control with trail braking. Personally, I think you're on the right track with your idea of running without a rear swaybar since you don't have an LSD. Keep in mind that springs are a relatively small investment relative to the cost or effort it will take to delete the torsion bars and everything else you are planning.
If I were you, I'd guestimate where you think you want to end up with springs and use your existing sway bars. Then drive the car. Then buy another set of either front or rear springs and/or a bigger front sway bar.
My best guess is that a hardcore initial choice would be 500/700, and a only slightly more tame choice would be 400/600.
Good luck!
10-10-2012, 12:31 AM
#9
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
if you have a 944 that has some power i would suggest upgrading the suspension. might not have to go all out but at least to a turbo spec. you should probably upgrade the brakes too. the ls1 engine is lighter then the turbo engine but i dont think its lighter then a na engine. correct me if im wrong. if your going to put it on the track i would stick to your goals and go with the coil overs and camber plates. do a search on spring rates on this board and the turbo board. plenty of info on these kind of questions. upgraded bushing also stiffen up the ride. you cant always believe what some of the rennlist community has to offer. dont let them scare you away from your goals and plans
Here are the specs on my '86 951:
Racer's Edge Lower Control Arms (early)
944S2 Spindles/Hubs/Front rotors
Racer's Edge Camber Plates
Racer's Edge Caster Blocks
Racer's Edge Rear Elephant bushings
Racer's Edge inner and outter Delrin Bushings
LEDA dampers
Front Hypercoil 500 lb springs (8" x 2.5")
Rear Hypercoil 600 lb springs (8" x 2.25") plus helpers (tb's deleted)
Gutted interior
Sunroof delete
Fuchs 7"/8" x 16" early offset
Hoosier R6 245/45/16 (track)
Bridgestone Potenza RE-11 (street)
I'm running about 1" lower than stock.
First bit of advice: talk Karl Poeltl at Racer's Edge. He is a wealth of information.
My opinions. Don't use delrin, it's too squeaky for the street. 500/600 springs are a little soft for the track, but pretty harsh for the street. My car weighs 2700 lbs, and I imagine your >3100? If so, 500/600 may be ok for you, but understand that it ain't gonna feel like a Lincoln. If you are going to lower the car, make sure you get the ball joints figured out.
I'm running stock sway bars, and square tires, and have gentle push that I can control with trail braking. Personally, I think you're on the right track with your idea of running without a rear swaybar since you don't have an LSD. Keep in mind that springs are a relatively small investment relative to the cost or effort it will take to delete the torsion bars and everything else you are planning.
If I were you, I'd guestimate where you think you want to end up with springs and use your existing sway bars. Then drive the car. Then buy another set of either front or rear springs and/or a bigger front sway bar.
My best guess is that a hardcore initial choice would be 500/700, and a only slightly more tame choice would be 400/600.
Good luck!
Racer's Edge Lower Control Arms (early)
944S2 Spindles/Hubs/Front rotors
Racer's Edge Camber Plates
Racer's Edge Caster Blocks
Racer's Edge Rear Elephant bushings
Racer's Edge inner and outter Delrin Bushings
LEDA dampers
Front Hypercoil 500 lb springs (8" x 2.5")
Rear Hypercoil 600 lb springs (8" x 2.25") plus helpers (tb's deleted)
Gutted interior
Sunroof delete
Fuchs 7"/8" x 16" early offset
Hoosier R6 245/45/16 (track)
Bridgestone Potenza RE-11 (street)
I'm running about 1" lower than stock.
First bit of advice: talk Karl Poeltl at Racer's Edge. He is a wealth of information.
My opinions. Don't use delrin, it's too squeaky for the street. 500/600 springs are a little soft for the track, but pretty harsh for the street. My car weighs 2700 lbs, and I imagine your >3100? If so, 500/600 may be ok for you, but understand that it ain't gonna feel like a Lincoln. If you are going to lower the car, make sure you get the ball joints figured out.
I'm running stock sway bars, and square tires, and have gentle push that I can control with trail braking. Personally, I think you're on the right track with your idea of running without a rear swaybar since you don't have an LSD. Keep in mind that springs are a relatively small investment relative to the cost or effort it will take to delete the torsion bars and everything else you are planning.
If I were you, I'd guestimate where you think you want to end up with springs and use your existing sway bars. Then drive the car. Then buy another set of either front or rear springs and/or a bigger front sway bar.
My best guess is that a hardcore initial choice would be 500/700, and a only slightly more tame choice would be 400/600.
Good luck!
You are one of the lucky ones...you have LEDA'S!!!! I would LOVE to pick up a set of Leda coilovers for this car...but they seem to be relatively unobtanium...can't get them, and those who have them aren't letting go of them! Would you suggest sticking with my idea of replacing old rubber bushings with new rubber, to keep a little bit of the harshness out of the ride, while still going with a firm suspension to give this car a good feel?
Also, I HATE understeer, I'm one of those that would much prefer to drive a car with a bit of oversteer that i can control with my right foot than have understeer that i can't. I've even noticed with the current wheels and tires i have that i have a bit of understeer, although turn in is considerably improved by the setup, the staggered tire sizes definitely gives me a little less confidence in the front end vs. the rear.
Thanks for the advice concerning the cost/time investment of removing rear torsion bars. I am well aware of what it takes, and I have no problem going for this project. I mean, i built this car myself, a shop hasn't seen this car for 4 years...except for the one i work at occasionally that'll let me do oil changes in a spare bay if they have one!
Thanks for your advice, it is greatly appreciated!
10-10-2012, 09:01 AM
#12
Nordschleife Master
Chill, I was just giving advise to the op from my experience of driving those spring rates on my dd for over 20 years. It works well for me so I thought I would pass it on. FYI the set-up is almost 50% stiffer than stock spring rates, well balanced and didn't cost a fortune. I answered based on the op saying this was a dd with no track aspirations. The thread has changed somewhat since my post, so what's your problem?
10-10-2012, 10:47 AM
#13
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
I completely agree... 
You're input is appreciated. Good to hear some ideas from someone running a swapped car!
Thank you for your input, it is taken into consideration. I know you've had your car for a very long time...I have owned mine for no time at all in comparison. I mentioned in the original post that I would be taking my car out to a few DE's and would want to do some track days with it, but i didn't spend much time on it so i understand that you missed it.
I want adjustable ride height, and I want to be able to replace my shocks when i need to. I've considered doing the Koni Hacksaw mod with aftermarket springs, but i don't like the valving of Koni's...I've heard that on soft they aren't comfortable but float and on hard they are bricks, so you have to run them on a middle-ish setting if you want any comfort or performance. In addition, for me to replace the stock crap struts with new ones, or to rebuild them with a nice set of stock style struts will cost me close to the price of a set of Escort Cups...I know which I'd pick. I'd rather have a properly valved very firm setup with adjustable ride height...Bilstein fits the bill for this. What I want to know is what split I can use front to rear on spring rates, and where the Bilsteins will be happy in terms of spring rates to valving. I dont want to have a setup that is under dampened (and over sprung) or over dampened (and under sprung). That is why I'm leaning toward higher spring rates with the Bilsteins, because i have heard that the Bilsteins are valved for stiffer springs.
Who is this "Mr. Clark" and why is he so full of himself? Your "opinions" are getting old too.
Big swaybars are NOT the answer. Period.
I have been running 350F/525R (total) with 225/55/16 all the way around and no rear swaybar (stock turbo front) very successfully on the street. Grip is plenty, especially with all this torque I throw at it. The Bilstein HDs are probably right at the edge of what they can accept before needing revalved. I would have went higher in spring rate if the valving was there. I've been in/driven cars with 800F/1000R spring rates and "proper" dampening and they were perfectly acceptable on the street and not jarring.
Big swaybars are NOT the answer. Period.
I have been running 350F/525R (total) with 225/55/16 all the way around and no rear swaybar (stock turbo front) very successfully on the street. Grip is plenty, especially with all this torque I throw at it. The Bilstein HDs are probably right at the edge of what they can accept before needing revalved. I would have went higher in spring rate if the valving was there. I've been in/driven cars with 800F/1000R spring rates and "proper" dampening and they were perfectly acceptable on the street and not jarring.
Chill, I was just giving advise to the op from my experience of driving those spring rates on my dd for over 20 years. It works well for me so I thought I would pass it on. FYI the set-up is almost 50% stiffer than stock spring rates, well balanced and didn't cost a fortune. I answered based on the op saying this was a dd with no track aspirations. The thread has changed somewhat since my post, so what's your problem?
I want adjustable ride height, and I want to be able to replace my shocks when i need to. I've considered doing the Koni Hacksaw mod with aftermarket springs, but i don't like the valving of Koni's...I've heard that on soft they aren't comfortable but float and on hard they are bricks, so you have to run them on a middle-ish setting if you want any comfort or performance. In addition, for me to replace the stock crap struts with new ones, or to rebuild them with a nice set of stock style struts will cost me close to the price of a set of Escort Cups...I know which I'd pick. I'd rather have a properly valved very firm setup with adjustable ride height...Bilstein fits the bill for this. What I want to know is what split I can use front to rear on spring rates, and where the Bilsteins will be happy in terms of spring rates to valving. I dont want to have a setup that is under dampened (and over sprung) or over dampened (and under sprung). That is why I'm leaning toward higher spring rates with the Bilsteins, because i have heard that the Bilsteins are valved for stiffer springs.
10-10-2012, 12:16 PM
#15
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
yeah? Howabout we swap titles for 2 months...you give me your title plus 7K. At the end of the 2 months we swap back, I keep what's left of the 7K, and your car now has an LS motor in it...deal?
