Where to buy paint?
01-19-2011, 01:22 PM
#1
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Where to buy paint?
What brands work, what brands not?
Acrylic lacquer qualities vs. other types?
This for Cobenhabenblau LY5B color.
Suggestions as to sources and prices appreciated.
Acrylic lacquer qualities vs. other types?
This for Cobenhabenblau LY5B color.
Suggestions as to sources and prices appreciated.
09-02-2013, 07:37 PM
#2
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Bump, as nobody had an answer in almost 3 years.
Also, thoughts on acrylic urethane single stage paint? The stuff is said to be quite durable and good quality, so has anybody here tried it?
Also, thoughts on acrylic urethane single stage paint? The stuff is said to be quite durable and good quality, so has anybody here tried it?
09-02-2013, 08:09 PM
#3
Dash -
Currently helping out on a single stage urethane paint project for a 944. Will post pics on how it turns out. We purchased paint from TCP global and House Of Colors (I think it's called) is also a good option I've heard. The primer, hardener, activator and paint (1 gal) cost around $150 I believe. It truly is a lot of work though, prep wise.
Good luck!
Currently helping out on a single stage urethane paint project for a 944. Will post pics on how it turns out. We purchased paint from TCP global and House Of Colors (I think it's called) is also a good option I've heard. The primer, hardener, activator and paint (1 gal) cost around $150 I believe. It truly is a lot of work though, prep wise.
Good luck!
09-02-2013, 11:41 PM
#5
DuPont paint. On the window sticker on my 87 S it says it came with DuPont Teflon paint sealer as an extra option. DuPont will also make an exact match to your paint, just supply with original paint codes for your car (on the sticker in the back or manual)
09-03-2013, 12:48 AM
#6
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Thanks, all, this is excellent information.
I plan to keep the original Kopenhagenblau color, as it's rare and changing colors is not a good idea vis resale. If I had my druthers, I'd druther have had Baltic Blue or Zenith Blue, but Kopenhagenblau LY5B is what came from the factory.
The car needs front fenders, popup headlight covers, bumper cover, part of rear quarter panel , and rocker panels repainted. Everybody says repaint the whole car, to make sure it matches, and that's good advice. unfortunately, funds are lacking for that, so I may repaint it myself, all or parts.
Online study of various paints suggests that acrylic polyurethane single stage paint is a good quality and durable paint, and so far, that seems the best choice.
But, what paint is most forgiving and usable for an amateur painter, lacking professional booth, etc.?
No final decision has been made, pending input from those of you more knowledgeable than I.
So, fire away, please.
I plan to keep the original Kopenhagenblau color, as it's rare and changing colors is not a good idea vis resale. If I had my druthers, I'd druther have had Baltic Blue or Zenith Blue, but Kopenhagenblau LY5B is what came from the factory.
The car needs front fenders, popup headlight covers, bumper cover, part of rear quarter panel , and rocker panels repainted. Everybody says repaint the whole car, to make sure it matches, and that's good advice. unfortunately, funds are lacking for that, so I may repaint it myself, all or parts.
Online study of various paints suggests that acrylic polyurethane single stage paint is a good quality and durable paint, and so far, that seems the best choice.
But, what paint is most forgiving and usable for an amateur painter, lacking professional booth, etc.?
No final decision has been made, pending input from those of you more knowledgeable than I.
So, fire away, please.
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09-03-2013, 11:50 AM
#8
Rennlist Member
The "best" paint for an amateur, no booth, is any catalyst based single stage paint. Single stage because you can put it on thick and sand/buff out your mistakes. Catalyst (generally known as 2K) because it dries the quickest and so less time for stuff to land on it. Trust me, paint a car, and every damn bug in the neighborhood decides it's time to show up.
If you don't own a gun and a compressor, you might want to check out Eastwood. They have just come out with 2K paint in a single use "rattle can". You activate it with some sort of mixing chamber right in the can. They call it "2-Component Aero Spray". The problem for you will be the color choice, which is pretty limited.
My local Dupont dealer can mix single stage paint to match a sample. You bring the car or a piece of the car to them, they analyze it with a reader, and can give you a pretty good match. Their Nason brand of single stage paint is the most economical.
But again, the real key is to get a single stage paint, lay on lots of coats, and sand out your blems.
Be warned, there is nothing cheap about modern automotive paints. The primers, sealers, and top coats for a full car will easily be over $500. Just the required sandpapers can set you back several hundred.
I have several articles about painting cars on my website. One for the orange 944 track car (single stage Nason), one for the white Etype. I used basecoat/clearcoat on the Etype. That process is definitely not budget friendly or easy to apply.
If you're willing to paint the front and rear bumpers black, like I did on the track car, you can use rattle can paint and avoid all the color matching issues.
A good source for both products and education is:
www.autobodystore.com
It has some good how to articles. See Classroom. If you follow their forum long enough, you'll get some good tips.
If you really want cheap, you may want to go the Duplicolor route.
If you don't own a gun and a compressor, you might want to check out Eastwood. They have just come out with 2K paint in a single use "rattle can". You activate it with some sort of mixing chamber right in the can. They call it "2-Component Aero Spray". The problem for you will be the color choice, which is pretty limited.
My local Dupont dealer can mix single stage paint to match a sample. You bring the car or a piece of the car to them, they analyze it with a reader, and can give you a pretty good match. Their Nason brand of single stage paint is the most economical.
But again, the real key is to get a single stage paint, lay on lots of coats, and sand out your blems.
Be warned, there is nothing cheap about modern automotive paints. The primers, sealers, and top coats for a full car will easily be over $500. Just the required sandpapers can set you back several hundred.
I have several articles about painting cars on my website. One for the orange 944 track car (single stage Nason), one for the white Etype. I used basecoat/clearcoat on the Etype. That process is definitely not budget friendly or easy to apply.
If you're willing to paint the front and rear bumpers black, like I did on the track car, you can use rattle can paint and avoid all the color matching issues.
A good source for both products and education is:
www.autobodystore.com
It has some good how to articles. See Classroom. If you follow their forum long enough, you'll get some good tips.
If you really want cheap, you may want to go the Duplicolor route.
09-03-2013, 12:49 PM
#9
Racer
I disagree on the best paint for the amateur being single stage. If its a metallic then no way, base coat/clear coat is the way to go because you can't buff out a single stage metallic.
I most always use bc/cc because you can take your time on the bc (there are no catalysts in the bc). You can mix a color and take up to 8 hours putting it down. That time comes in handy when you need to fix up little "mistakes" in the color coat. Take your time, sand and touch up. Can't to that with a single stage because you are racing against time with the hardener.
The clear coat masks alot of technique errors with the gun (amazing actually). If you get dust/bugs in the clear you can just wet sand and buff out without touching the color coat.
PPG Omni is a decent budget paint system. There are others but I only have experience with the Omni line.
I most always use bc/cc because you can take your time on the bc (there are no catalysts in the bc). You can mix a color and take up to 8 hours putting it down. That time comes in handy when you need to fix up little "mistakes" in the color coat. Take your time, sand and touch up. Can't to that with a single stage because you are racing against time with the hardener.
The clear coat masks alot of technique errors with the gun (amazing actually). If you get dust/bugs in the clear you can just wet sand and buff out without touching the color coat.
PPG Omni is a decent budget paint system. There are others but I only have experience with the Omni line.
09-03-2013, 02:01 PM
#10
Rennlist Member
Yes, agree. You can't sand/buff metallics. Good point. But for non-metallic colors, you can certainly sand/buff single stage. As you can with clear coat.
My problem, as an amateur, with clear coat was that I would sand through the clear coat, trying to chase a blem. This was with 5 or 6 coats of clear. The paint mfg says you can't spot apply the clear, it has to be sanded and re-applied back to an edge, as in the edge of the panel. That said, you can also sand through single stage. But, and I may be wrong, but I think you can spot apply single stage if this happens.
My problem, as an amateur, with clear coat was that I would sand through the clear coat, trying to chase a blem. This was with 5 or 6 coats of clear. The paint mfg says you can't spot apply the clear, it has to be sanded and re-applied back to an edge, as in the edge of the panel. That said, you can also sand through single stage. But, and I may be wrong, but I think you can spot apply single stage if this happens.
09-03-2013, 02:03 PM
#11
Intermediate
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Right, there is nothing cheap about modern paints. The cost of good materials is shocking. Yes you can get generic colors or off brand materials for less. Twenty five years ago, my auto body instructor told me, "There is no free lunch with paint products". He was right.
Body work is not brain surgery, but considering the cost of mistakes in wasted material while you learn, you might think about doing some of the simple prep work yourself and having a Maaco or similar shoot the car. This way you also would not have the tool and material investment. By prep work, I mean removing as much of your trim as possible, door handles, tail lamps, spoiler,etc. On panels that have no dings, you can wet sand and prep those with some 600 grit paper and save labor.
On a DIY project, for non metallic, I'd go single stage. For metallic, I would use base/clear.
Every paint company has an economy line. PPG has Omni. Akzo Nobel (Sikkens) has Lesonal. Dupont has Nason. They are not bad, but you get what you pay for.
Body work is not brain surgery, but considering the cost of mistakes in wasted material while you learn, you might think about doing some of the simple prep work yourself and having a Maaco or similar shoot the car. This way you also would not have the tool and material investment. By prep work, I mean removing as much of your trim as possible, door handles, tail lamps, spoiler,etc. On panels that have no dings, you can wet sand and prep those with some 600 grit paper and save labor.
On a DIY project, for non metallic, I'd go single stage. For metallic, I would use base/clear.
Every paint company has an economy line. PPG has Omni. Akzo Nobel (Sikkens) has Lesonal. Dupont has Nason. They are not bad, but you get what you pay for.
09-03-2013, 02:51 PM
#13
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Fortunately for me, Copenhagen blue LY5B is not metallic paint. The car has a base coat/clear coat combination, and the paint is actually pretty good except for the PS fender, header panel, pop up light covers, nose panel, and a ding on the PS rear corner which is about the size of your hand. This all happened when clipping a guard rail in a minor accident with no structural damage.
I've debated with myself about just respraying the affected pieces, and compounding the rest of the car to remove any oxidation there. Going this route, a quart of paint would do the job. Some companies sell specially mixed rattle cans + clear coat + other stuff for DIY jobs, for about $50. That's just one 12 oz rattle can, which is said to cover about 4 square feet, or roughly one fender panel's worth. Perhaps they'd sell a package of 4 or 5 cans at a bulk price, which is surely what I'd need for all the affected parts.
Others say, no matter how well matched the paint formula, the panels just won't match after cure, due to oxidation, etc. on the other parts of the car, so, just respray the whole thing and be done with it. We have several excellent paint shops here, but that runs about $4K, WAY beyond my budget.
If done by me, I'd construct a paint booth like a hoop house greenhouse, out of 3/4" PVC pipe and 6 mil clear plastic sheeting. That way, natural light, protection from weather and bugs. I have an HVLP two state turbine spray system which shoots a pretty fine mist if desired, but that depends on paint viscosity and other variables which I'm not yet competent with. I have a HEPA filter and a dehumidifier which I could clean the air in the hoop house with before, during, and after spraying. Hoop houses are pretty cheap to make, less than $100, and later I could use it to grow tomatoes.
Another idea I've considered is to just prepare and spray the affected nose parts (bumper cover, pop ups, header panel, forward sections of the front fenders) with primer and Copenhagen blue basecoat, then urethane such as SEM Chip Guard, to prevent rock chips. Chip Guard is clear, and essentially the same stuff Porsche used on the rocker panels. Works better than the 3M clear film decals around the wheel wells, and covers better for a fraction the price, on the nose section where rock chips occur. Yes, the urethane chip protection has orange peel when applied in normal protective thickness, but 6 months later looks better than an unprotected factory paint job, which by then is sandblasted.
Back to acrylic urethane single stage paint: Assuming hoop house protection from bugs, how easy is this stuff to work with? Can it be mixed to match the car using an optical scanner like better supply stores have? Those with acrylic urethane experience please chime in. We've had excellent posts in this thread, and I hope to elicit even more.
I've debated with myself about just respraying the affected pieces, and compounding the rest of the car to remove any oxidation there. Going this route, a quart of paint would do the job. Some companies sell specially mixed rattle cans + clear coat + other stuff for DIY jobs, for about $50. That's just one 12 oz rattle can, which is said to cover about 4 square feet, or roughly one fender panel's worth. Perhaps they'd sell a package of 4 or 5 cans at a bulk price, which is surely what I'd need for all the affected parts.
Others say, no matter how well matched the paint formula, the panels just won't match after cure, due to oxidation, etc. on the other parts of the car, so, just respray the whole thing and be done with it. We have several excellent paint shops here, but that runs about $4K, WAY beyond my budget.
If done by me, I'd construct a paint booth like a hoop house greenhouse, out of 3/4" PVC pipe and 6 mil clear plastic sheeting. That way, natural light, protection from weather and bugs. I have an HVLP two state turbine spray system which shoots a pretty fine mist if desired, but that depends on paint viscosity and other variables which I'm not yet competent with. I have a HEPA filter and a dehumidifier which I could clean the air in the hoop house with before, during, and after spraying. Hoop houses are pretty cheap to make, less than $100, and later I could use it to grow tomatoes.
Another idea I've considered is to just prepare and spray the affected nose parts (bumper cover, pop ups, header panel, forward sections of the front fenders) with primer and Copenhagen blue basecoat, then urethane such as SEM Chip Guard, to prevent rock chips. Chip Guard is clear, and essentially the same stuff Porsche used on the rocker panels. Works better than the 3M clear film decals around the wheel wells, and covers better for a fraction the price, on the nose section where rock chips occur. Yes, the urethane chip protection has orange peel when applied in normal protective thickness, but 6 months later looks better than an unprotected factory paint job, which by then is sandblasted.
Back to acrylic urethane single stage paint: Assuming hoop house protection from bugs, how easy is this stuff to work with? Can it be mixed to match the car using an optical scanner like better supply stores have? Those with acrylic urethane experience please chime in. We've had excellent posts in this thread, and I hope to elicit even more.
09-03-2013, 03:31 PM
#14
Racer
My problem, as an amateur, with clear coat was that I would sand through the clear coat, trying to chase a blem. This was with 5 or 6 coats of clear. The paint mfg says you can't spot apply the clear, it has to be sanded and re-applied back to an edge, as in the edge of the panel. That said, you can also sand through single stage. But, and I may be wrong, but I think you can spot apply single stage if this happens.
Rule of them is don't take anything coarser than 1000 grit to clean up a clear blemish. Spot repairs of a single stage require the same technique.
A single state urethane paint is nothing but the color with more clear resin in the mix. The done side is that it generally doesn't cover as well as a bc so you will need a little more paint, not a big deal.
With some colors single stage is superior to bc/cc. Black is much better and deeper as a single stage. Plus you can always clear a single stage if you want more protection or an extra layer for detailing.
09-03-2013, 03:40 PM
#15
Racer
Others say, no matter how well matched the paint formula, the panels just won't match after cure, due to oxidation, etc. on the other parts of the car, so, just respray the whole thing and be done with it. We have several excellent paint shops here, but that runs about $4K, WAY beyond my budget.
I'd get a pint of paint mixed to the factory code and try a section (like a bumper) to how close you get out of the can. A pint of Omni or the Dupont budget stuff will cost you about $30.
You do not have to prime a painted panel. Just scuff with brown scotchbrite , tack cloth it, wipe with a degrease prep and spray. See how it comes out and go from there. You only need to prime repaired areas, bare metal,. bondo etc.