michael2e

Summer's coming and my car's hot. Trusted P mechanic evaluated the AC system and identified the culprit-bad compressor from worn seals after 130K. He recommends the 134 conversion with a Sandin replacement. Anyone have any experiences/ opinions on the matter? Seems like installing a used OEM unit would be asking for trouble. Is the R&R doable for a home mechanic or do you need special equipment? From what I've read the dryer and a few other parts should be replaced at the same time. Thanks for the help.

Mike

Paul C 944

I got a used compressor last year for 60 bucks Its been fine so far <img src="graemlins/bigok.gif" border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" /> But you should find out how much they will charge you for a refill some times it gets pricy from what I here.I stayed with r12 only cause a good relationship with a mechanic who gave me a really good price for the fill.(free)
Get a new drier its anly 20 bucks or less if
i remember right.Also replace all the rubber seals and change the oil in the system.Usually yuo need a shop with a recovery system for the freon.Politically incorrect to just vent it in todays world.You wouldnt want to be blamed for creating a big hole in the atmospher! <img src="graemlins/oops.gif" border="0" alt="[oops]" />
Iv heard from others the 134 conversion has worked fine good cold air.And if it runs low you can pick up cans at walmart cheap! Cant do that with r12 anymore.

danny951

Use FREEZE12.. it's an r12 sub and it is just a bit more than 134a.. and it works better. my mechanic just charged mine after the exp valve got stuck and it is very cold, plus it was a lot cheaper.. every porsche-smart mechanic i talk to tell me to stay away from 134 on these cars, whereas the foreign motor places told me they'd do the conversion... I went with the Porsche idea.

Tabor

You can use a stock compressor and run R134a, you just need the appropriate oil and drier.

I would convert to a Kuehl compressor, they are supposedly better than the Saden ones.

Ski

I just bought a Sanden Kit: compressor, new mounts, fittings, hose, drier, and expansion valve for $399 from Ians Imports. I plan on using Enviro Safe ES-12a. Check it out at

<a href="http://www.btt.org" target="_blank">www.btt.org</a>

It is 32% more efficient than 134a. I didn't quite believe this so I converted my Jeep Grand Cherokee over to it first. You know how somtimes in traffic the 134a sorta goes warm, well not with this stuff. I noticed my Jeep cooled off quicker, pretty much ran on low setting even in town after gettin it cool rather than fan on two or three. The oil charge is compatible with pag and mineral oils as well. The only real difference is that you install WITHOUT A VACCUM ON THE SYSTEM. I'll have a write up on it about the third week in April after completing all the work on my car, which includes new A/C compressor.

rpm's S2

Had my R-12 system serviced and replaced compressor two years ago. You could hang meat in my car with the ac on. I am convinced that no 134 system can match the cooling. The cost of R-12 is high, but you only have to recharge every 3 or 4 years!
Living in the South, the cooler, the better.

Bob S. 1984 Silver

Pleas be careful using Freeze 12 or any other blend. I am a little leery of them since each component has a different boiling point and molecule size and each "leaks" at a different rate. What starts as "80% this and 20% that" can become "50% this and 50% that" over time.

Based on experience. Plus, should the system require professional help down the line and the tech finds out there is a blend in the system, he (or she) will not vacuum the residue into their holding tank because it will contaminate what is in there, whether it is R12 or R134a. This has been a serious problem.

Cheers!!

Bob S.

michael2e

When the compressor seals go bad (over time & disuse) does that necessitate replacing the unit or is there any way to rebuild or reseal them? OEM replacements are spendy and my guess is that a used one sitting on a shelf would allow the seals to dry out rendering it questionable (unless you're lucky like Paul). Are ES12 and Freeze 12 similar products that are compatible with the original R12/oil? Thanks guys.

Mike

TimC

Man, I'd side with the "stick with the freon" responses. I have heard of people getting satisfactory results with R134, but not if you have hot (i.e, like most places in the US being hot enough) summers. The expense is annoying, but then again, what on these cars isn't expensive?

Tip - run your a/c every week or so for say 10 min. This should keep the seals in good order for some time. So, once you bite the bullet on the repair, it should remain worth it.

T

jordanolder

Bret:

Are you doing the installation/removal yourself?

I need to fix my compresor. Does the "Enviro Safe ES-12a" work with the stock compressor and AC setup?

Do you have instructions on how to do the compressor change and then re-fill and restart the AC?

Any info is appreciated.


****************************
I just bought a Sanden Kit: compressor, new mounts, fittings, hose, drier, and expansion valve for $399 from Ians Imports. I plan on using Enviro Safe ES-12a. Check it out at
<a href="http://www.btt.org" target="_blank">www.btt.org</a>

It is 32% more efficient than 134a. I didn't quite believe this so I converted my Jeep Grand Cherokee over to it first. You know how somtimes in traffic the 134a sorta goes warm, well not with this stuff. I noticed my Jeep cooled off quicker, pretty much ran on low setting even in town after gettin it cool rather than fan on two or three. The oil charge is compatible with pag and mineral oils as well. The only real difference is that you install WITHOUT A VACCUM ON THE SYSTEM. I'll have a write up on it about the third week in April after completing all the work on my car, which includes new A/C compressor.

--------------------

Bret
87 951 blk/lt gray

michael2e

Performance Products advertises rebuilt Nippodenso compressors for $229 with a 30 month warranty. Anyone with experiences using rebuilt units? Seems like a good fix-relatively inexpensive and can continue to use R12. Thanks

Mike

Bob S. 1984 Silver

Just curious...

Where does the claim of 32% more efficient come from for the Envirosafe 12? From the manufacturer? There is data on the net by the EPA and others comparing the positives and negatives of various refrigerants. I have seen claims made by companies that cannot be verified.

The decision of what to be put in is an individual one. All I can do is warn folks about blends for the reasons I outlined in an earlier response to this thread. Like I said, if a system using a blend is brought into a certified shop for repair, they may refuse to work on it because introducing blends into the tanks used by the repair facility. This is a Federal requirement as well as a requirement of the industry.

I live in Tucson, transplanted last year from upstate NY. From the warm and miserably muggy to the quite hot and arid. My 944 was converted three years ago. Cools fine.

I will look into the claims of this refrigerant. I have an open enough mind to give it a chance. But, like the Russians, I trust, but I verify. If the claims are from the company alone, I wouldn't trust it. If the EPA or the industry has adiabetic data on this stuff and it checks out, I will report back.

Cheers!!

Bob S. EPA certified A/C tech

Ski

Bob S, any info you find would be more than appreciated. It has just worked really well in my Jeep. I had heard about it through a friend gave it a try. The 32% is probably from them but not sure. They do ask that you place the sticker on the system somewhere to let people or techs know that is a different refrigerant. Mine will go on the dryer or compressor.

Jordan, it should work with your stock system or so they claim; it did on my jeep, we flushed the system, then vaccumed it down, then followed install instructions. It is recommmended to flush the system first of course. ON the compressor install; I'm doing it in conjunction with a head, turbo, radiator, water pump, clutch, lightened flywheel, oil pan gasket, rod bearings, etc. I was going to drop the motor and go cmopletely through it since I had the time but taxes changed my mind on that! The compression test last week was spot on factory so really no need.

The Kit has new mounting arms, all the bolts and hardware, new fittings, belt, and some new hose. I have access to hose and crimps so a buddy is making me new hoses. It looks staight forward enough. The arms fit off the old mounting holes and just extend the compressor probably a little more than an inch.

The website provides a list for installation of the ES12a. The biggest thing is not to install it under vaccum. Pull a vaccum on your system after componets are installed and tight. Then release the vaccum cmopletely, hook up the cans of ES12a, start the flow of ES12a, then start your compressor and turn it on max.