Stereo/Subwoofer Help
06-01-2010, 05:52 AM
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Stereo/Subwoofer Help
I'm in the process of redoing my ghetto stereo the right way. 
Here's my old sub box for humour's sake. There were 6x9's mounted in either cubby on foam brackets. Basically it looked terrible and was asking for someone to break into my car.
Now I have a question about what to do. I want a subwoofer, and want my spare tire.
Is there any way to mount my 10" sub in a cubby without fiberglassing? (mount it on a plate on top and have a heavy mat around the inside of the cubby or something..), and would this be better/worse than doing a sealed 8" sub enclosure in the cubby?
and also,
Here's my new 6.5" rear speaker installation.
What should I do while I'm there to make the sound as good as possible within reason, time and budget?
-put foam behind the speaker?
-seal the wooden speaker mount?
-drill more holes in vinyl? (the vinyl seems to muffle the sound)
Thanks for any help!
Here's my old sub box for humour's sake. There were 6x9's mounted in either cubby on foam brackets. Basically it looked terrible and was asking for someone to break into my car.
Now I have a question about what to do. I want a subwoofer, and want my spare tire.
Is there any way to mount my 10" sub in a cubby without fiberglassing? (mount it on a plate on top and have a heavy mat around the inside of the cubby or something..), and would this be better/worse than doing a sealed 8" sub enclosure in the cubby?
and also,
Here's my new 6.5" rear speaker installation.
What should I do while I'm there to make the sound as good as possible within reason, time and budget?
-put foam behind the speaker?
-seal the wooden speaker mount?
-drill more holes in vinyl? (the vinyl seems to muffle the sound)
Thanks for any help!
06-01-2010, 12:08 PM
#3
That looks like a clean car, so you're on the right track!
The "muffling" sound you're hearing is the attenuation and diffraction of the pressboard and vinyl panel. You're right that drilling more holes would improve it, but replacing the section over the speaker with something more acoustically-transparent (speaker grille cloth, for instance) would make it sound much better.
Also, odurandina is right about sound deadening (particularly a little on the sheet metal around your mount and a few thin strips on the backside of the interior panel). Since you're in Canada, though, how about B-Quiet? Their B-Quiet Ultimate is better, cheaper and easier than any version of Dynamat, and they ship from Alberta, where it's made.
The "muffling" sound you're hearing is the attenuation and diffraction of the pressboard and vinyl panel. You're right that drilling more holes would improve it, but replacing the section over the speaker with something more acoustically-transparent (speaker grille cloth, for instance) would make it sound much better.
Also, odurandina is right about sound deadening (particularly a little on the sheet metal around your mount and a few thin strips on the backside of the interior panel). Since you're in Canada, though, how about B-Quiet? Their B-Quiet Ultimate is better, cheaper and easier than any version of Dynamat, and they ship from Alberta, where it's made.
06-01-2010, 12:47 PM
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The solid baffle you have there (Wood) is a great start. If you really want to go at it, pick up some non-hardening modeling clay from an arts/craft store and make sure there are no holes between the wood and the body.
Also, a sound deadening mat on the front as well as a diffuser behind the speaker will improve the sound quite a bit.
Also, a sound deadening mat on the front as well as a diffuser behind the speaker will improve the sound quite a bit.
06-01-2010, 08:43 PM
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Thanks for the advice! I'll have to get some mat, and think about hacking up my side panels a bit. I'm not too eager to chop them up though.
As far as a subwoofer install goes, I'm likely to do an 8inch in a cubby. However, I was wondering how the SQ would be if i were to use the cubby itself as an enclosure with a 10" sub, has anyone tried it? I want to get my trunk back to stock appearance.
As far as a subwoofer install goes, I'm likely to do an 8inch in a cubby. However, I was wondering how the SQ would be if i were to use the cubby itself as an enclosure with a 10" sub, has anyone tried it? I want to get my trunk back to stock appearance.
06-01-2010, 09:10 PM
#6
The cubby isn't easy to seal, and you would have to block the drains in the bottom in order to keep the bass response accurate, but they are a pretty good location for a hidden sub.
On the subject of the side panels, it might be worth trying to track down some 10-speaker rear grilles. As you've likely already read, the 10-speaker option on these cars used a 6.5" speaker and an additional tweeter in each rear quarter panel. The factory interior panels for the rear come with special grilles which follow the contour of the panel and let the sound out much better.
kdjones on Pelican had a great thread with all the 10-speaker factory part numbers. If you can find it, it might at least give you some inspiration!
On the subject of the side panels, it might be worth trying to track down some 10-speaker rear grilles. As you've likely already read, the 10-speaker option on these cars used a 6.5" speaker and an additional tweeter in each rear quarter panel. The factory interior panels for the rear come with special grilles which follow the contour of the panel and let the sound out much better.
kdjones on Pelican had a great thread with all the 10-speaker factory part numbers. If you can find it, it might at least give you some inspiration!
06-02-2010, 04:24 PM
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Thanks for the advice! I'll have to get some mat, and think about hacking up my side panels a bit. I'm not too eager to chop them up though.
As far as a subwoofer install goes, I'm likely to do an 8inch in a cubby. However, I was wondering how the SQ would be if i were to use the cubby itself as an enclosure with a 10" sub, has anyone tried it? I want to get my trunk back to stock appearance.
As far as a subwoofer install goes, I'm likely to do an 8inch in a cubby. However, I was wondering how the SQ would be if i were to use the cubby itself as an enclosure with a 10" sub, has anyone tried it? I want to get my trunk back to stock appearance.
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06-02-2010, 06:08 PM
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use 1 sub. not two, as, due to the shape of our cars, two subs can not easily be stationed to not fight each other.
for me, space was something i was not going to give up, as i travel quite a lot. not saying a design such as this one is the best for everyone, but i love the sound and i have plenty of space left in my car.
this is a woofer specially designed for extremely small enclosures .5 ~ .75 cu. f. the box i am using is .72 cu. f is stuffed to the brim with insulation and with it's odd shape, the result is very little if any measurable backwave. the woofer is powered by a rockford, 500 watt monoblock setup.
.
Last edited by odurandina; 06-02-2010 at 06:24 PM.
06-02-2010, 06:24 PM
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06-02-2010, 06:35 PM
#10
I ripped out the back seat to do mine, but the placement is less than ideal for boom boom. However it does kick *** as a quasi 3 way setup, and rock is well, rockin. I used the spare tire well for the amp rack.
Overall i dig it, i kinda miss the shelf that the old seat provided when it was down and the stash spot. But i can still load up 2 snowboards, or my mountain bike or a few skateboards. I'll have no problems with camping gear either
Overall i dig it, i kinda miss the shelf that the old seat provided when it was down and the stash spot. But i can still load up 2 snowboards, or my mountain bike or a few skateboards. I'll have no problems with camping gear either
06-02-2010, 07:12 PM
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the key word is "easily."
of course it can be done, but the question that was explained to me was: "after trying how many times ?"
a week before visiting Rick, i had visited another installer with a solid reputation (PJ) in the Florida community... this guy said installing drivers in each quarter panel would probably not work, and even "sound like ****." i was intrigued, but, i tried to dismiss what he said as "an opinion i was not interested in hearing."
fastforward a week: i entered into talking with a second installer, "Rick," in hopes that a second opinion would be more to my liking... and to make matters worse, there were two huge, 8 inch subswoofer drivers he had in stock. the biggest on earth ? maybe... i was dead set on using them and having them tucked neatly in the rear quarters...
but then Rick began to explain crucial detail, that as a guy who's been doing it for 25 years, he's seen many similar attempts such as this one fail terribly... that installing 2 eight inch woofers was a REALLY bad idea (for this or similarly shaped car) no matter how loud they could get, in a perfectly, designed box off the shelf... his reasoning went something like this:
"when it comes to odd setups like what we have, life is like a box of chocolates, adding a second woofer in the opposite rear quarter in a car that's already shaped like an egg back there, is risky. two bass waves bouncing all around back there and then smaking around other parts of the car, might work,
HOWEVER, if they were fitted in a standard cabinet such as one you might use in an SUV, they could EASILY be made to sound really good !!
but, as far as installing them in the quarters goes, there's no guarentee you won't just as soon, f_ck everything up and create multiple "dead zones" in the car, or add any measurable SPL increase, for that matter after installing the second transducer... likely, you'd just be doing more harm than good."
one more call back to PJ: same explanation... so, i talked to several people about the guys i had consulted with... the answer i got, AND on the interweb was pretty much the same... solid, standup, fanatical, etc.
Patrick, if you have a setup that's working for you,
1. that's awesome.
2. when can we hear it ?
3. why did i post so many pics ? as always, posts on this thread are useless without pics.
.
Last edited by odurandina; 06-02-2010 at 08:28 PM.
06-02-2010, 07:39 PM
#12
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the key word is "easily."
of course it can be done, but the question that was explained to me was: "after trying how many times ?"
a week before visiting Rick, i had visited another installer with a solid reputation (PJ) in the Florida community... this guy said installing drivers in each quarter panel would probably not work, and even "sound like ****." i was intrigued, but, i tried to dismiss what he said as "an opinion i was not interested in hearing."
fastforward a week: i entered into talking with a second installer, "Rick," in hopes that a second opinion would be more to my liking... and to make matters worse, there were two huge, 8 inch subswoofer drivers he had in stock. the biggest on earth ? maybe... i was dead set on using them and having them tucked neatly in the rear quarters...
but then Rick began to explain crucial detail, that as a guy who's been doing it for 25 years, he's seen many similar attempts such as this one fail terribly... that installing 2 eight inch woofers was a REALLY bad idea (for this or similarly shaped car) no matter how loud they could get, in a perfectly, designed box off the shelf... his reasoning went something like this:
"when it comes to odd setups like what we have, life is like a box of chocolates, adding a second woofer in the opposite rear quarter in a car that's already shaped like an egg back there, is risky. two bass waves bouncing all around back there and then smaking around other parts of the car, might work,
HOWEVER, if they were fitted in a standard cabinet such as one you might use in an SUV, they could EASILY be made to sound really good !!
but, as far as installing them in the quarters goes, there's no guarentee you won't just as soon, f_ck everything up and create multiple "dead zones" in the car, or add any measurable SPL increase, for that matter after installing the second transducer... likely, you'd just be doing more harm than good."
one more call back to PJ: same explanation... so, i talked to several people about the guys i had consulted with... the answer i got, AND on the interweb was pretty much the same... solid, standup, fanatical, etc.
Patrick, if you have a setup that's working for you,
1. that's awesome.
2. when can we hear it ?
3. why did i post so many pics ? as always, posts on this thread are useless without pics. thumbsup:
of course it can be done, but the question that was explained to me was: "after trying how many times ?"
a week before visiting Rick, i had visited another installer with a solid reputation (PJ) in the Florida community... this guy said installing drivers in each quarter panel would probably not work, and even "sound like ****." i was intrigued, but, i tried to dismiss what he said as "an opinion i was not interested in hearing."
fastforward a week: i entered into talking with a second installer, "Rick," in hopes that a second opinion would be more to my liking... and to make matters worse, there were two huge, 8 inch subswoofer drivers he had in stock. the biggest on earth ? maybe... i was dead set on using them and having them tucked neatly in the rear quarters...
but then Rick began to explain crucial detail, that as a guy who's been doing it for 25 years, he's seen many similar attempts such as this one fail terribly... that installing 2 eight inch woofers was a REALLY bad idea (for this or similarly shaped car) no matter how loud they could get, in a perfectly, designed box off the shelf... his reasoning went something like this:
"when it comes to odd setups like what we have, life is like a box of chocolates, adding a second woofer in the opposite rear quarter in a car that's already shaped like an egg back there, is risky. two bass waves bouncing all around back there and then smaking around other parts of the car, might work,
HOWEVER, if they were fitted in a standard cabinet such as one you might use in an SUV, they could EASILY be made to sound really good !!
but, as far as installing them in the quarters goes, there's no guarentee you won't just as soon, f_ck everything up and create multiple "dead zones" in the car, or add any measurable SPL increase, for that matter after installing the second transducer... likely, you'd just be doing more harm than good."
one more call back to PJ: same explanation... so, i talked to several people about the guys i had consulted with... the answer i got, AND on the interweb was pretty much the same... solid, standup, fanatical, etc.
Patrick, if you have a setup that's working for you,
1. that's awesome.
2. when can we hear it ?
3. why did i post so many pics ? as always, posts on this thread are useless without pics. thumbsup:
The shape of the car HELPS the <80hz frequencies fill the car, not the other way around as your friend proclaims. Subwoofer enclosures and the sub are mated for each other. They can be manipulated to produce the correct sound for any desired music taste and with remote input controlling can be made for multiple styles of bass.
Joka, has heard mine....ask him
06-02-2010, 07:39 PM
#13
To the OP -- where to locate speakers (and how many to use) is a favourite argument of DIY stereo enthusiasts and professionals, alike. Each car is a totally different animal, so you're really left designing the mix of sound and appearance which you like best.
I like the track you're on, though, because having the best sounding system in the world stolen from your car because it's glaringly obvious won't make your silent ride home on broken glass any more satisfying.
odurandina, I don't think the OP wants to put sub woofers in the rear quarter panels. He was asking about the cubbies in the hatch. I had a little trouble following your post, but I think the gist of it was that subs in the quarters (or, more generally, opposing speakers on either side of the car) are a risky choice for sound quality. I can explain a little bit of when and why, if anyone's interested.
I like the track you're on, though, because having the best sounding system in the world stolen from your car because it's glaringly obvious won't make your silent ride home on broken glass any more satisfying.
but, as far as installing them in the quarters goes, there's no guarentee you won't just as soon, f_ck everything up and create multiple "dead zones" in the car, or add any measurable SPL increase, for that matter after installing the second transducer... likely, you'd just be doing more harm than good."
06-02-2010, 07:46 PM
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06-02-2010, 08:24 PM
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no way bass waves coming from two opposite corners of the car are not going to present some form of "opposition."
a.k.a fight each other, create dead zones, etc, as i have been told... even if we are talking about two, small 8" subs lying flat in those big fat J-LO hips my car's got -- so i've been led to believe. but can this theory be proven wrong ? i imagine so..
yes, PJ and Rick, who built my system are true fanatics. their personal systems are designed the same way...
1. hide stuff
2. make it incredibly loud.
but, in a properly designed cabinet, or in the seat delete, i've been led by men of great honor and courage (true leaders of men) to believe that two supppwoooofer drivers/transducers/e.a.t.s's can work very well together.
a.k.a fight each other, create dead zones, etc, as i have been told... even if we are talking about two, small 8" subs lying flat in those big fat J-LO hips my car's got -- so i've been led to believe. but can this theory be proven wrong ? i imagine so..
yes, PJ and Rick, who built my system are true fanatics. their personal systems are designed the same way...
1. hide stuff
2. make it incredibly loud.
but, in a properly designed cabinet, or in the seat delete, i've been led by men of great honor and courage (true leaders of men) to believe that two supppwoooofer drivers/transducers/e.a.t.s's can work very well together.